Thread: idle moon math
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Old 02-April-2002, 03:38 AM
DoctorDon DoctorDon is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: University of Michigan
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On 2002-04-01 16:30, Gary Redmond wrote:
I have tried to explain that the math, regarding a torque, applied to an inertial mass, by a gravitational force, requires a secondary force. I thought the lumber yard thing would work. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_frown.gif[/img]
And I tried to explain that the lumber analogy was flawed. I thought an integral/sum would work, being the simplest way to break down the problem, but apparently not. I tried providing an example of a torque with no secondary force (I provide another one below), since you only need to provide one example to disprove necessity, but that didn't seem to stick, either.

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Try this: Walk over to the closest (hinged door) open or close the door. That is torque. It takes one force to move the door, and one to hold it to the wall or hold the wall up.
Try this: put your piece of lumber on a slick ice-rink (just after the Zamboni goes by) and kick it on the side at one end. It will slide away from you, spinning. *One* force (your foot hitting it), and there is torque.

What your door analogy misses is that the door would still spin "open", even if there were no force to hold it to the wall. You don't need two forces. The *net* force (vector sum of all forces acting on the object) just has to be not pointed at the center of mass. That's all you need.

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"That is, the force between any two bodies is unaffected by the presence of other bodies."
True, in the Newtonian limit, but irrelevent. Silas covered this perfectly well already, so I won't repeat.

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Please leave the Geophysicists, and Mathematicians out of this.
I agree with Gary. Arguments by authority are irrelevant. Let's stick to the math.

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Last night I posted a message here. This morning I found every one angry at me.
FWIW, I'm not angry, just baffled and frustrated.

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All you do is quote the books and tell me I'm wrong or imply worse. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_frown.gif[/img]
And I would like to point out (again) that I have not quoted a single book.

And that's all I have to say about that.

Don