Now Mr. Van Onselen, the best answer I can give is I haven't had to. As Marv himself says, killing a man for no reason means you are just crazy.

Though there are three people I am interested in locating. To turn over to the police of course.

One is a skinny Donny Osmonde look-a-like who beat my sister so badly he ruptured her spleen. He was a wastrel when he showed up and rumor had it that he moved on to join the terminally homeless in Santa Cruz. Though the statute of limitations has probably expired on that one. Oh well, I guess this means he got away with it.

Then there is whoever murdered my sister's fiance. An executive chef. His family was going to buy him a restarant in downtown San Francisco as a wedding present. He was murdered in a restaurant in San Francisco after hours. He didn't even work there. He was doing a favor for a "friend". Handcuffed, laid face down on the floor and shot through the spine and heart with a .38, (one shot).

That night, when he was supposed to get off work, my sister and a another friend went to pick him up as they had planned to go dancing. They heard him on the other side of the door saying, "No wait! I know who it is, I'll get rid of them!" and when he opened the door he yelled at them, "What are you doing here! I thought I told you I never wanted to see you again!" And then slammed the door. So they have an idea when the bad guy got there.

The owner of the restarant, who was summoned by my future brother in law with a phone call saying the boiler had a major leak was found in his office with the safe open and him tied to a chair beaten so badly it was considered a torture murder. Most of his bones were broken. The bullets in him were window dressing.

Thirdly, the slimy little piece of dung that called my future brother in law the night before to work for him that night because "something came up". Who then became harder to find over the next couple of days, particularly after other folks had a talk with him, until he and his girlfriend disappeared all together. I'm not Judge Judy. I don't require constitutionally admissiable evidence to be convinced of complicity.

And that's where I became an advocate of the old saw, "The first step in getting away with murder is lure your victim to San Francisco."
Their investigation deviated so far from reality that the family of my murdered future brother in law (They had a set wedding date) hired their own P.I.'s. They had a different story.

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"The beauty of that discussion of averages is that you don't have to be an expert in Apollo or in photography in order to see where this time study "analysis" breaks down. You just have to be, well...not an idiot." -JayUtah