View Single Post
  #67 (permalink)  
Old 08-July-2008, 02:54 AM
Joe Durnavich Joe Durnavich is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 710
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken G View Post
You're kidding, right?
I'm really trying, Ken. I enjoy these discussions and partake of them in good faith. And I know how irritating I must be to others coming off as stubborn or as somebody who just doesn't get what seems obvious and in no need of explanation to most everyone else. One function of philosophical discussions, however, is to re-examine the obvious from time-to-time.

Quote:
In truth, we begin making models when we are little babies. You have only to look at your own life to see what models are, and how they are used in science. In physics, the process is formalized, because models are generally quantitative, but their main purpose is to make predictions and to unify observations-- just like the little baby.
Just to speak clearly here, a person--not a model--makes predictions and unifies observations.

Quote:
Um, yes, there are clear-cut examples of models. How about the model "Mommy" in the mind of a baby, for example?
Well, I was hoping for something a little more clear-cut than in the mind of a baby, but on the other hand, that you chose this example is informative as to what you consider models to be.

Quote:
A baby sees a face that responds to crying by supplying crucial sustenance and comfort, and builds a model that there is some kind of entity there (who knows how a baby conceives of their model, we don't recall) that if they are within earshot, can supply these needs. The baby uses that model to make the prediction that when he/she cries, he/she will have the need met.
But you are attempting an indirect argument for a model here when something a little more direct is called for. You observe a parent attend to the baby when it cries and the baby ceasing crying after it is taken care of. That's what is known to exist here. You then posit a model as a singular entity that explains the crying done afterward. That doesn't help me understand what a model is. All you have done is state the observed patterns of behavior and then said that a model causes it. We could more effectively just leave it at saying that the reason the baby cries is that its parents came to it when it cried. At least there would be a clear cause and a clear effect.
Reply With Quote