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Old 07-January-2005, 09:54 PM
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Duane Duane is offline
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He expects that the galactic material surrounding a quasar will have the same redshift as the quasar nucleus - because its all ejected material in his model!

You've created an expectation for Arp's model (quasar and surrounding galaxy should have different redshift) that isn't an expectation of Arp's model.
Hold on a minute. That is not what I got out of the 5 or so articles I have read by Arp, although going back and looking a couple again, I suppose you have a literal point.

It leads to a an illogical conclusion though, because part of Arp's argument is that once the QSO has become a "normal" galaxy, it no longer displys the extreme redshift seen when it was a QSO. In other words, it shows redshift equal to its "actual" distance from the MW.

So even if you accept the argument that the red-shifted galactic material shows an equal redshift to the QSO because of its association to the QSO, it still begs the question, where are the transitional phases? I also find it highly suspect that when an image of a QSO with a galactic host is produced, the only reply from the Arp camp is that it is associated with the QSO.

Quote:
Now you think he's wrong - that's fine. I could care less whether you think he's right or not. But your characterization of what he is saying is incorrect. If you'll notice I'm not wasting my time trying to convince you he's right. I'm simply clarifying for you where you've incorrectly interpreted what he is saying.
To be perfectly frank, I don't know if he is wrong. What I do know is that he gives almost no factual underlying basis for the arguments that he makes. Worse, he fends off critiques of his ideas by saying "well it looks like..." and essentially nothing else. Even his staunchest supporters point to exactly the same evidence--that is, such and such an image looks like it is A, therefore A must be right.

Well excuse my skepticity, but I see much more diverse and factual evidence from the redshift researchers providing evidence beyond just "it looks like".

Quote:
How about an example of Arp doing this?
His whole method is based on this. He says, this image looks like blah blah blah. Now looking at this image, it looks like blah blah blah. Now because I know that A is right, it is clear from the images that A is right.
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