Chatroom
 

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Forum > General > About BAUT
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

   

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #391 (permalink)  
Old 29-August-2007, 10:00 PM
Paracelsus's Avatar
Paracelsus Paracelsus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 1,508
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doodler View Post
I've seen some debates in ATM eventually cover quite a bit of a document in contention over the course of 40 pages plus as people perform some impressive ginsu work on a paper to aim the discussion in their direction.
__________________
The dose makes the poison--Paracelsus (1493-1541) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paracelsus

I don't know. That's why I'm asking--Noclevername

Intelligence may not be clearly defined, but you know stupid when you see it--Noclevername

Science is a way of thinking much more than it is a body of knowledge--Carl Sagan (1934-1996)
Reply With Quote
  #392 (permalink)  
Old 30-August-2007, 12:50 AM
Van Rijn's Avatar
Van Rijn Van Rijn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 10,260
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neverfly View Post
You know... now that you mention it.
I have noticed that some members here post a link to someplace like The New York Times.
But to read the article they are talking about- I would have to subscribe.

That is annoying.
You can always check www.bugmenot.com

I do that when I see subscription requirements for news sites when I want to check the article, but I don't want to go on their list.
__________________
I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser
Reply With Quote
  #393 (permalink)  
Old 30-August-2007, 01:25 AM
Neverfly's Avatar
Neverfly Neverfly is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ATX
Posts: 11,007
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
You can always check www.bugmenot.com

I do that when I see subscription requirements for news sites when I want to check the article, but I don't want to go on their list.
Van Rijn, You Rock.
Reply With Quote
  #394 (permalink)  
Old 30-August-2007, 07:58 AM
Paracelsus's Avatar
Paracelsus Paracelsus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 1,508
Default

Hmm....I'll try that with the Royal Soc. thing and see if it works. Thanks, Van Rijn!
__________________
The dose makes the poison--Paracelsus (1493-1541) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paracelsus

I don't know. That's why I'm asking--Noclevername

Intelligence may not be clearly defined, but you know stupid when you see it--Noclevername

Science is a way of thinking much more than it is a body of knowledge--Carl Sagan (1934-1996)
Reply With Quote
  #395 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2007, 10:35 PM
JayUtah's Avatar
JayUtah JayUtah is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 8,907
Default

In this thread The 'faces' Of Mars!! the OP's writing style has become an impediment for some regular readers. His posts are long, rambling, and disjointed. The OP's real-world identity is known, providing an ability to see other examples of his communications.

There is testimony that his writing here at BAUT is an affected style, deliberately adopted for effect. I understand that this is an unresolved question of fact. My question instead has to do with whether the general requirement to provide direct answers might have something to say about an elective writing style: might an artificially obfuscatory, disjointed, and rambling style be construed as evasive?

I fear the slippery slope. Not everyone has an equal command of the English language, and it would be unfortunate to squelch important discussion by imposing stylistic requirements that some other posters legitimately cannot attain.
__________________
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams
Clavius Moon Base
Reply With Quote
  #396 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2007, 10:53 PM
Kaptain K's Avatar
Kaptain K Kaptain K is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Elgin, Tx
Posts: 7,568
Default

Well, since the OP has been banned, it seems to be irrelevant.
__________________
Any day you wake up on "the right side of the dirt" is a good day.

T. Anderson
Reply With Quote
  #397 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2007, 10:55 PM
Neverfly's Avatar
Neverfly Neverfly is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ATX
Posts: 11,007
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaptain K View Post
Well, since the OP has been banned, it seems to be irrelevant.
Suspended.

I think it's a valid point. Deliberately falsifying your writing style can have many implications- all of which are to confuse.
Reply With Quote
  #398 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2007, 11:42 PM
The_Radiation_Specialist's Avatar
The_Radiation_Specialist The_Radiation_Specialist is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,511
Send a message via Yahoo to The_Radiation_Specialist
Default

What do we do in situations where a member publicly posts message included in a PM (Private Message) without the express permission of the original sender?

As explained in the rules here:

Quote:
5. Privacy Issues

Do not post private email you have received without the express permission of the sender. There are legal and copyright reasons for this, not to mention that doing so is very impolite. The same caveat applies to private messages, whether they're from this forum or anywhere else. If you receive rude or abusive private messages on this forum, please contact the administrators/moderators for assistance. Posting private information about forum users that is not available otherwise publicly will not be tolerated.
How long does the message have to stay there (before they delete it) for the user to get a warning or possible suspension? 10 minutes? an hour? a day?
__________________
P.S. This is what part of the alphabet would look like if Q and R were eliminated.

-- Mitch Hedberg
Reply With Quote
  #399 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 12:07 AM
Moose's Avatar
Moose Moose is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Maritimes
Posts: 7,291
Send a message via MSN to Moose
Default

I may be speaking out of turn, but like any other major violation, you report it.

As for how long an offender has, they have had, judging by past observation, exactly as long as it takes as a mod to notice, and rarely so much as a second more. There has never been much visible leeway in the enforcement of rule 5.
__________________
[Dr. Horrible]___________________________[Penny]
Listen close to everybody's heart________And you believe there's good in everybody's heart
And hear that breaking sound_____________Keep it safe and sound
Hopes and dreams are shattering apart____With hope you can do your part
And crashing to the ground_______________To turn a life around
Reply With Quote
  #400 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 12:11 AM
Neverfly's Avatar
Neverfly Neverfly is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ATX
Posts: 11,007
Default

It's being taken care of TRS.
Reply With Quote
  #401 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 03:16 AM
Jim's Avatar
Jim Jim is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Clear Lake City, TX
Posts: 4,160
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
... My question instead has to do with whether the general requirement to provide direct answers might have something to say about an elective writing style: might an artificially obfuscatory, disjointed, and rambling style be construed as evasive?

I fear the slippery slope. Not everyone has an equal command of the English language, and it would be unfortunate to squelch important discussion by imposing stylistic requirements that some other posters legitimately cannot attain.
I think you have a vaild point and I'll be sure to bring it to the attention of the other Moderators.

No, we do not want to enforce any specific style on posters; many regulars here (me included) will vary their posting style to suit the topic or for effect. Nor do we want to make command of English a requirement; we'd lose too many members... whose first language is English! People need to be able to write in a style that is comfortable for them; this makes it easier for them to express their thoughts.

However, to deliberately alter your style to mislead and/or evade is deceptive at least, possibly fraudulent.

Let us think on it some.
__________________
Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
Isaac Asimov
Reply With Quote
  #402 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 03:17 AM
The_Radiation_Specialist's Avatar
The_Radiation_Specialist The_Radiation_Specialist is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,511
Send a message via Yahoo to The_Radiation_Specialist
Default

And BTW- to anyone interested to know, the issue was settled mutually. So my previous post and its implications can be considered void.
__________________
P.S. This is what part of the alphabet would look like if Q and R were eliminated.

-- Mitch Hedberg
Reply With Quote
  #403 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 08:11 PM
Van Rijn's Avatar
Van Rijn Van Rijn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 10,260
Default

What are the general considerations for what should be in the Q&A forum? My impression is that that forum is for space and astronomy related questions and answers, and is supposed to show a straightforward "good face" for new and rare posters. So, my question is, should we report threads like this:

http://www.bautforum.com/questions-a...ms-anyway.html

I don't see an astronomy or space related question and answer session there, and the science content itself is pretty thin. What I mostly see is a back and forth argument about what one person thinks the other person said. In other words, they're debating the person, not the subject.

I would PM this, but threads like this seem to turn up in Q&A fairly regularly. Are they considered acceptable for that forum, or not?
__________________
I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser
Reply With Quote
  #404 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 08:27 PM
Paracelsus's Avatar
Paracelsus Paracelsus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 1,508
Default

Well, I've asked paleontology/geochemistry questions there and have gotten good feedback.

Should I not have done that?
__________________
The dose makes the poison--Paracelsus (1493-1541) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paracelsus

I don't know. That's why I'm asking--Noclevername

Intelligence may not be clearly defined, but you know stupid when you see it--Noclevername

Science is a way of thinking much more than it is a body of knowledge--Carl Sagan (1934-1996)
Reply With Quote
  #405 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 08:43 PM
Van Rijn's Avatar
Van Rijn Van Rijn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 10,260
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paracelsus View Post
Well, I've asked paleontology/geochemistry questions there and have gotten good feedback.

Should I not have done that?
It's a good question. Perhaps it should go in "General Science." But there are two issue here: One is if there is a science question that is subsequently answerd. Another is if there is not a question and answer thread, but a debate that might or might not be scientific in nature, let alone astronomy or space related.
__________________
I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser
Reply With Quote
  #406 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 08:52 PM
hhEb09'1's Avatar
hhEb09'1 hhEb09'1 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: NC USA
Posts: 7,978
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
I don't see an astronomy or space related question and answer session there, and the science content itself is pretty thin. What I mostly see is a back and forth argument about what one person thinks the other person said. In other words, they're debating the person, not the subject.
That sort of thing happens in threads sometimes, it's part of the process of working out the misunderstandings. You have to offer a paraphrase, and evaluate the response.

Should Q&A be for science Q&A? or just space/astronomy Q&A? I don't start very many threads there (search says none), I just try to answer the posted questions.
Quote:
I would PM this, but threads like this seem to turn up in Q&A fairly regularly. Are they considered acceptable for that forum, or not?
You are supposed to PM a mod if you don't like what you see. I'm pretty sure, for instance, you're not supposed to accuse people of being a troll, you're supposed to PM a mod that they might be a troll.
Reply With Quote
  #407 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 09:00 PM
Jim's Avatar
Jim Jim is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Clear Lake City, TX
Posts: 4,160
Default

Use the little red triangle. That alerts all the Mods.
__________________
Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
Isaac Asimov
Reply With Quote
  #408 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 09:06 PM
01101001's Avatar
01101001 01101001 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 10,775
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hhEb09'1 View Post
Should Q&A be for science Q&A? or just space/astronomy Q&A? I don't start very many threads there (search says none), I just try to answer the posted questions.You are supposed to PM a mod if you don't like what you see. I'm pretty sure, for instance, you're not supposed to accuse people of being a troll, you're supposed to PM a mod that they might be a troll.
The subheader says "Got a space/astronomy question? Get it answered here."
I take that to be exclusionary.

If I don't see a topic's connection to space or astronomy, even a tenuous one, I just ask the participants. They should have an answer. I don't see bothering the mods until the poster plainly states that there is no connection, or the proffered connection is nonsense. Sometimes a good explanation is offered, one I didn't expect; usually not.

Edit: But.... in light of the very recent Rule 16 change, I must ask: is asking such a question "talking about bad posts or anything else you consider to be inappropriate user behavior"? What is talking and what is asking?
__________________
0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0....
Reply With Quote
  #409 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2007, 09:07 PM
ToSeek's Avatar
ToSeek ToSeek is offline
Vulcan Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Greenbelt, MD
Posts: 24,225
Default

Rule 16 has been further modified, as follows:

Before:

Quote:
If you feel a post breaks one of these rules, please report it by clicking the 'report' button (the red triangle with the exclamation mark inside it, located at the top right hand side of every post). Do not talk about bad posts in the forum itself or suggest, speculate on, or threaten what the moderator response should be. All reported posts are reviewed by moderators or administrators, and are treated very seriously (so do not report frivolously). If you have concerns, please PM a moderator or administrator.
After:

Quote:
If you feel a post breaks one of these rules, please report it by clicking the 'report' button (the red triangle with the exclamation mark inside it, located at the top right hand side of every post). Do not talk about bad posts or anything else you consider to be inappropriate user behavior in the forum itself or suggest, speculate on, or threaten what the moderator response should be. All reported posts are reviewed by moderators or administrators, and are treated very seriously (so do not report frivolously). If you have concerns, please PM a moderator or administrator.
This is to forestall another meltdown of the sort that occurred in a recent thread, where one poster criticized another poster's pattern of behavior, whereupon a bunch of other posters got on that poster for being critical, etc., etc.
__________________
Everything I need to know I learned through Googling.
Reply With Quote