I've been following the Nancy/Zeta saga for a while and am continually amazed and dismayed at the lack of basic astronomical understanding of so many people. I appreciate the effort done by many debunkers to explain the true cause of the Planet X sightings. I thought of a few more ways to demonstrate that the Earth has been unaffected.
1) Star trails near the astronomical north pole - One of the first pictures any budding astro-photographer takes is long exposure shot near Polaris to show star trails. If the Earth has tipped, such a shot would very easily show how much tipping has taken place. Anyone have a link to a recent photograph of that nature?
2) Sundials would not properly work. If the sun were really rising "too far North" (a current hot Planet X proof on GLP), then the sundial would not show the correct time. It is more complicated that just comparing your watch to the time indicated on the sundial. You need to know that the gnomon is angled properly to begin with, and if the hour lines have been adjusted to take into account your location within your time zone.

We're all still alive is good enough evidence for me.

I always assumed that when they say the earth has stopped they mean orbiting around the sun rather than spinning on it's axis. If the earth stopped in it's orbit you could still have sunrise & sunset, you just wouldn't have the normal seasons and the stars wouldn't move each day as they do (rising approximately 4 minutes earlier each day if I recall correctly).

The first (rotate on axis - day and night) one takes what should be 6 year old's understanding of astronomy where as the latter (revolve in orbit around the sun - the seasons) takes what should be an 8 year old's understanding of astronomy. So either misconception by reasonably intelligent adults is sad. :roll:

PS: for any "believers"... the sun is rising at the expected time (unless you think the clocks are being tampered with by the gov) and the stars are in the expected location as per my 1996 star program (The Sky IV).

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I must not PX. PX is the mind-killer. I will face my PX. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the PX has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

I'm still sort of wondering why we didn't hear the squeal when Earth jammed on its breaks, or the sickening crash when we collided with Planet Ex. (Oh, wait, we were "pushed by gravity" or something... nevermind the crashing). I don't ever expect people to have any theoretical knowledge of physics, even at the most basic level, but something like inertia should be known from everyday life. And that the Earth has a lot of inertia should also be self-evident. It's big, it's 90-some million miles from the sun, and goes around it in a year. I don't think anyone would expect a Mack Truck going along at 110 clicks to be able to instantly reverse directions without someone feeling it. Why should the Earth be granted magical stopping powers?

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"I'm making wheatloaf. It's like meatloaf, only with wheat"
"Isn't that just...bread?"

It happened gradually, so it's okay. So speaketh the Great Lieder.

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And maybe all that energy was diverted to the 5th density. :P

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I must not PX. PX is the mind-killer. I will face my PX. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the PX has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

It is kind of hard to understand- I got used to the stately march of the stars across the sky as the year went by as a kid- had to, to figure out what would be available to look at if I took my 'scope out that night. And this was in the days before sky map programs for personal computers; indeed, before personal computers. I remember one particularly helpful book for beginning stargazers that contained a series of pictures showing what the sky should look like if you looked in a given direction at a stated time in the middle of each month (in the middle latitudes of the Northern Hemisphere, of course).

I haven't stargazed in years, but I still notice the changes in the night sky over the course of the year; seeing an "old buddy" move through the sky with the changing seasons remains a pleasant feature of life in the unfashionable end of the Galactic arm.

How anyone could reach adulthood and remain oblivious to this, or how it relates to our orbital motion, or how the notion that we're stuck in our December orbital postion is completely and perfectly disproved by the fact that you don't see Orion in mid-sky at a suitable time for skywatching on a school night- is an utter mystery to me.

Not to mention a considerable bummer.

the star trails picture argument (plus several derivatives to demonstrate that Polaris doesn't mve appreciably over long periods) have been tried...

the Zeta faithful just ignore them when pointed out :roll:

always worth another try, though...

Regards
Krill

What you're doing is noble, but I wouldn't sweat it. The "zeta-faithful" that still exist have had to make a lot of allowances since last year to maintain their faith so it's a good bet your best efforts, no matter how well-presented, ain't gonna snap 'em out of it. Think about some of her .. "stuff". (The "kite" thing is so sad, it's almost funny). Even your basic GLP woowoo isn't buying her tripe. Those that are still "zeta-faithful" at this late stage will only listen to Nancy and are above convincing IMO.

Good luck Krill, but those you are trying to help are probably best served by a psychologist/psychiatrist as opposed to a scientific "disinfo" agent such as yourself. Try by all means if you think it'll do any good .. just don't hang your head when it doesn't work amigo. Some people need a "savior*" in lieu of themselves. Sad, but true.

*This is about Nancy's dogma, not organized religion, for those that might get the wrong impression. Nancy's zealous followers consider her a savior .. I don't talk about mainstream religion here (one of the good things I've managed to maintain in my 1800-some posts) and apologize in advance if any gets anything besides Zeta-spiel out that term .. there ain't no comparison :wink:

And here I figured it happened at night when everyone was asleep and no one was looking.

Huh, that reminds of that infamous "photograph from the ISS" that showed night on planet Earth. Only problem was it showed night for almost ALL of planet Earth, except for areas near the poles. The email that had this image attached that I debunked for a fellow employee, contained some remarkably jingoistic writing. :roll:

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Your work is in vain. Nancy has more "explanations" for why all is not well on planet Earth.

Keyword: torque

Nice to see she's been able to move on past the kite debacle.

:roll:

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Torque? Nancy's figured out what torque is now? Let me guess: She thinks it's due to mysterious "torque converters" that change the hugging arms fo the Sun into spin tops?

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"I'm making wheatloaf. It's like meatloaf, only with wheat"
"Isn't that just...bread?"

I have frequently referred Lieder and her followers to the Night Sky Live camera network. Go to http://us.geocities.com/openmindxx/ and click "No Evidence for Pole Shift Seen in Movies of the Night Sky" for an example attempt.

Every clear night these cameras produce a timelapse movie (design interval 3m56s ... any guesses why?) of the rotation of the sky ... no signs of any tilt. Lieder is imune to this sort of direct evidence although for a while she came up with a "jump up" argument that kept the pole still aligned with Polaris.

John Oliver
Associate Professor
Associate Chair/Undergraduate Coordinator
Department of Astronomy
University of Florida
Project AST@RHO http://astrho.astro.ufl.edu
see the night sky at http://concam.net/rh/
and at http://nightskylive.net/ (look in the archives to find movies of nights).

She'd probably just claim that you're using faked or archived data rather than the current images. And of course since you're an astronomer you've signed a national security agreement with NASA not to reveal the truth since otherwise you'd be unable to practice your profession.

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Everything I need to know I learned through Googling.

I'll bite. Why?

Hmmm...

3m56s interval between frames = 1 degree sky rotation between frames?

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"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?"
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Close ... its more about night to night stuff.

Like the Earth, I've been unaffected by what Nancy says.

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I must not PX. PX is the mind-killer. I will face my PX. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the PX has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Difference between a solar day, 24h even, and a sidereal day, 23h 56m 4.0905s.

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Here's an interesting page on calendars.
http://wwwcsif.cs.ucdavis.edu/~vemur...i/calendar.htm

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I must not PX. PX is the mind-killer. I will face my PX. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the PX has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Of course, but why do we do it?

It allows us to do photometry on a star over a series of nights with the star at the same airmass and position on the image.