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Old 08-July-2005, 05:46 PM
Platinum Rhymer Platinum Rhymer is offline
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Default Is Space Teleportation Really Possible?

It is, according to this article on Space.com.

http://www.space.com/businesstechnol...portation.html

I dont think this is possible, either that or we are light years away from it.
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Old 08-July-2005, 06:37 PM
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Bad use of the term "light years away!" [-X :wink:
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Old 08-July-2005, 07:50 PM
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Sounds cool, but we've got to master the art of local teleportation first.

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Old 08-July-2005, 08:12 PM
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A problem I see is that with quantum physics to teleport an object, we need to measure/observe it, causing the Schroedinger Wave function of the object to collapse and choose one of many different realties. To replicate, we must observe, but if we observe, we interact causing change, therefore what we want to replicate is not the same object it was before we looked.
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Old 08-July-2005, 08:51 PM
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I dont even think local teleportation is possible....
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Old 08-July-2005, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kesh
Bad use of the term "light years away!" [-X :wink:
Not if he means that by the time we make teleportation practical, the Sun will have moved several light years along its galactic orbital path... :wink:
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Old 08-July-2005, 09:28 PM
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gzhpu is probably correct; if we are going to teleport the quantum states of an object, the process of observation will destroy the quantum states of the original. I think it has to do with something called the No-Cloning theorem.
I did discuss this with David Darling on his now defunct forum; he reckoned a human would take 10e30 bits of information to teleport- it may in fact be more than that to get it right.
A possible alternative is nanocopying-just make a rough copy of a person using their DNA and a nanoscale mind scan; this does produce a copy, but it is not a quantum scale copy.
I used the nanocopying concept in this little story
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Old 08-July-2005, 09:35 PM
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How about big ships and big machines, could we teleport them?...like brign a teleporter or whatever you would call it, to a distant planet and just teleport everything there....I dont know, I still think its just not possible but you can never say never
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Old 08-July-2005, 10:24 PM
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Well, the "quantum state" of the teleported object might not be perfectly preserved, but so what?
If the alternative is to propel the object with a rocket it will be subjected to acceleration, cosmic radiation and general wear&tear during transit.
The question is which mode of transportation leaves the object more intact.
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Old 08-July-2005, 10:32 PM
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Technically method two, as method one completely anihillates the original, or else you just have a long-range three dimensional copy machine.
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Old 08-July-2005, 10:40 PM
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copieng is good 8)

One space probe... 2 space probes, 4 space probese 8 space probes...
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Old 08-July-2005, 10:40 PM
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I personally never liked the pull-them-apart / put-them-back-together types of teleport systems (like Star Trek) for all the reasons that people have discussed. I particularly dislike the Star Trek system where you can have a receiving end with no receiver.

Larry Niven's Transfer Booths idea is the only one that even made a slight bit of sense to me. I searched around and found this explanation (it jives with my memory from reading the stories)
Quote:
Mr. Niven has wrote his theory on teleportation in one of his stories:

"But I needed a theory that would allow instantaneous transportation and would still leave a passenger intact. What I came up with was a kind of super-neutrino. The displacement booth converts its cargo into an elementary particle of no rest mass, a relativistic mass equal to the weight of the cargo (for conservation of matter), an internal structure complex enough to carry the quantum states of every elementary particle in the cargo, and a neutrino's ability to pene_trate almost any barrier. I called it a transition particle."
From this website.
So all the information is wrapped up in the internal structure/states of the particle. It doesn't matter if the thing being transported is a block of iron or a human, the details are folding into the particle.

But of all the common science fiction ideas, I think the transporter is the least likely.
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Old 08-July-2005, 10:42 PM
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If we could somehow move something from one place to an other instantly,...

Doesn't that vilote the rule that nothing can move faster than light?

So se in theory could be looking through a very very powerfull telescope and see myself on the spot where i left. because the light hasn't reached me yet.
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Old 08-July-2005, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorge
If we could somehow move something from one place to an other instantly,...

Doesn't that vilote the rule that nothing can move faster than light?

So se in theory could be looking through a very very powerfull telescope and see myself on the spot where i left. because the light hasn't reached me yet.
I agree, though at least some of the ideas for teleportation assume that you still can't trasmit at faster than light.
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Old 08-July-2005, 11:30 PM
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well sending data at near speed of light might work but then again, maybe by the time we can do that, we ourself can move close to that speed.
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Old 09-July-2005, 01:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorge
well sending data at near speed of light might work but then again, maybe by the time we can do that, we ourself can move close to that speed.
Umm, we can send data at light speed right now.
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Old 09-July-2005, 01:45 AM
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I think he meant actual stuff, physical stuff.
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Old 09-July-2005, 02:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Platinum Rhymer
I think he meant actual stuff, physical stuff.
yes, I mean something with more mass than light.
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Old 13-July-2005, 09:24 PM
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The amount of energy you would need would be such that a sleeper ship or long haul cargo ship is a better option. Anti-hydrogen or some lighter element production might be simpler.

One thing you might want to look up is the concept of a cubic wormhole. A cube with a wormhole on each of its faces.
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Old 13-July-2005, 09:27 PM
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ok help my ignorant little mind here...

How the heck can one be sure they teleported a beam of light? I mean seriously, how do they know it's the same beam?
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Old 14-July-2005, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by publiusr
One thing you might want to look up is the concept of a cubic wormhole. A cube with a wormhole on each of its faces.
Here is my picture of one;


the negative mass/energy that holds the hole open is concentrated into a cubic framework. as described by Matt Visser in his 1995 book Lorentzian Wormholes - From Einstein to Hawking. These holes would be very useful if they were possible.
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Old 14-July-2005, 06:36 PM
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That is some cool artwork. Now if only we could find one a 100 AUs out or so.
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Old 14-July-2005, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skrap1r0n
ok help my ignorant little mind here...

How the heck can one be sure they teleported a beam of light? I mean seriously, how do they know it's the same beam?
They didn't - they teleported the state (i.e polarization) of the photon(s). It's somewhat unfortunate the name teleportation was used for this phenomenon, since it often conjures up the wrong image of what has happened.
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Old 15-July-2005, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swansont
Quote:
Originally Posted by skrap1r0n
ok help my ignorant little mind here...

How the heck can one be sure they teleported a beam of light? I mean seriously, how do they know it's the same beam?
They didn't - they teleported the state (i.e polarization) of the photon(s). It's somewhat unfortunate the name teleportation was used for this phenomenon, since it often conjures up the wrong image of what has happened.
so break this down then.

The created coherant light using a standard method for creating a laser, then transported it over a distance and emitted it from a seperate/isolated emtter and the photons came out coherantly even though the last emitter was only designed to emit photon is whatever state it recieved them?
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Old 15-July-2005, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skrap1r0n
Quote:
Originally Posted by swansont
Quote:
Originally Posted by skrap1r0n
ok help my ignorant little mind here...

How the heck can one be sure they teleported a beam of light? I mean seriously, how do they know it's the same beam?
They didn't - they teleported the state (i.e polarization) of the photon(s). It's somewhat unfortunate the name teleportation was used for this phenomenon, since it often conjures up the wrong image of what has happened.
so break this down then.

The created coherant light using a standard method for creating a laser, then transported it over a distance and emitted it from a seperate/isolated emtter and the photons came out coherantly even though the last emitter was only designed to emit photon is whatever state it recieved them?
AFAIK coherence was not what they were trying to replicate.

What they did was entangle pairs of photons and then measure one of the photons' polarization. That meant they immediately knew the polarization of its entangled partner, which they could then communicate somewhere else, and write that polarization on a different photon.

The significant aspect is that a classical measurement will only give you a 50% chance of getting the right answer, while a QM measurement can give you 100% fidelity as long as you have no interactions that disrupt the entanglement. I believe >70% fidelity has been measured experimentally.
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Old 15-July-2005, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatKelley
Technically method two, as method one completely anihillates the original, or else you just have a long-range three dimensional copy machine.
If you use entanglement surely all you can do is copy, unless you destroy the original?
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Old 15-July-2005, 05:53 PM
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Apparently in order to successfully teleport the information, the quantum state of the original particle is destroyed, or at least randomised.

However how this would apply to a massive object made of umptillions of particles is another matter.
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