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Old 03-November-2005, 01:14 PM
jkmccrann jkmccrann is offline
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Question Orbit of Chiron

Not quite sure where exactly this belongs, but I've just been looking for the orbit of that famous Centaur, Chiron, and I have to say I'm absolutely amazed at the number of astrological references Google gives me by simply typing in 'orbit of Chiron'

I've only been looking into this for 5 minutes and I've already seen a reference to the late Princess Diana

http://www.bsa.bristolastrology.net/chiron.html

Quote:
It is during the transits of Chiron that we are given the opportunity to heal by initially making us aware of the wound. As Chiron suffered an agonising death and took a long time to die, so do the Chiron themes in our chart take a long time to heal. But once we have embraced our wound, we will have gained the insight and the wisdom to move beyond it and to help those with a similar wounding.

One example of this is the late Princess Diana who had Chiron at 6.5 degrees of Pisces in the 3rd house opposing the Mars-Pluto conjunction in Virgo in the 9th house. The Mars-Pluto aspect indicates that Diana was capable of putting out tremendous practical energy regarding her philosophies and beliefs, but the opposition from Chiron initially indicates wounded communication, perhaps in the form of confused thinking in what it was that she most wanted and desired.
I can't for the life of me work out what on Earth Chiron has to do with Diana, but there you go................
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Old 03-November-2005, 04:23 PM
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It's hardly surprising. You'll find that astrology devotees commonly attempt to shoehorn such things into their pseudoscientific pursuits. BTW, in case you havent' seen it, The BA wrote an excellent piece on astrology here.
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Old 03-November-2005, 05:53 PM
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They're claiming that Princess Di died from Mars and Pluto? o.O
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Old 03-November-2005, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkmccrann
...I've just been looking for the orbit of that famous Centaur, Chiron...
Here's an image of Chiron's orbit. It is not stable in the long term. After only 3 orbits, it's orbit has noticably changed. It's currently a Saturn-crosser. In a few thousand years it will be both a Saturn-crosser and a Uranus-crosser. That's dangerous territory it orbiting in.
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Old 09-November-2005, 08:13 PM
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Now I thought that the huge book by Gehrels (HAZARDS DUE TO COMETS AND ASTEROIDS) had Chiron becoming an Earth crosser over time.
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Old 10-November-2005, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by publiusr
Now I thought that the huge book by Gehrels (HAZARDS DUE TO COMETS AND ASTEROIDS) had Chiron becoming an Earth crosser over time.
Not exactly. Chiron could become an Earth crosser at some point in the future, any Centaur stands at least a small chance of that. As I recall from a paper by Hahn and Bailey in 1990, it had a chance of becoming an Earth crosser before being ejected (most likely) from the solar system. The Centaurs are on chaotic planet crossing orbits and frequently approach the outer planets and have their orbits changed. Some of them will become Jupiter Family short period comets as well.

From Hahn & Bailey, Nature, 348, Nov. 8, 1990, p. 132-136:


Quote:
Abstract

Numerical simulation of orbits like that of the giant Comet Chiron show a distinct asymmetry between past and future. Simulations extending + or - 100,000 years from the present suggest that on this timescale, Chiron is about twice as likely to have been a short-period comet at some time in the past as to become one in the future. The mean half-life for such evolution is about 0.2 Myr, much less than the approximately 1-Myr lifetime for ejection from the solar system, implying that Chiron may have been a short-period comet in the past, and will probably become one in the future.
Jim.
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Old 10-November-2005, 06:52 PM
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Are there any other Centaurs or other bodies that may strike Chiron? The role of potential impactors in relation to other bodies also needs to be looked at.
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Old 11-November-2005, 07:10 AM
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Given that in a few hundred years Chiron may have a close encounter with Uranus, can its trajectory be fine-tuned to make it hit Mars? Or Venus? If Chiron was swung straight in from Uranus, how fast would it hit Venus?

And of course, we'd have to be ready to destroy or divert any resulting shrapnel that came our way subsequently.
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Old 16-November-2005, 09:14 PM
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That's an idea! It would deposit all kinds of water on Mars and maybe bulk up its atmo if it comes in just right--breaking up on a near pass and gradually filtering down or Mars--or hitting Venus dead on and maybe blowing some atmosphere off.
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Old 17-November-2005, 12:45 AM
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It would be a hell of a show too. Monster comet followed by amazing collision.
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Old 17-November-2005, 03:48 PM
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Boys with toys...
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Old 17-November-2005, 04:42 PM
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Blow Shoemaker-Levy right out of the water that would.........
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Old 17-November-2005, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonewulf
Boys with toys...
I should say in my defence that I'm not really thinking of the spectacle, but of serious efforts at terraforming. Plus I think it'd be a real plus to the whole solar system ambience if Venus had a moon too, which the collision might generate.

Talking of not thinking about the spectacle, obviously the collision should be on the outward leg of the orbit so we get as much monster-comet time as possible...
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Old 18-November-2005, 09:01 PM
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Chiron is still a bit small to do that--though I could be mistaken. I think some rampaging extrasolar object could. It would be a chance to see Venus as the Earth was eons ago, slowly developing. Anything to blow off 90% of its atmosphere and spin it up.
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Old 18-November-2005, 10:11 PM
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Am I the only one that thinks that trying to get two celestial bodies to slam into each other might have more detrimental than beneficial effects?
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Old 18-November-2005, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonewulf
Am I the only one that thinks that trying to get two celestial bodies to slam into each other might have more detrimental than beneficial effects?
Yep, you're on your own there.
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