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30-March-2003, 02:25 AM
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Planet X observer's thread
I ask for a little help from the faithful in the establishment of this thread. I need a couple of reliable (as it were) websites to check to get the latest location/observation information on PX.
The reason for all this? I have the opportunity to observe the heavens with several observatory-grade instruments, both visual and CCD-camera. I can only promise observations on clear Fri/Sat nites, when the two places I am associated with will be open (see http://www.mvas.org/archive/ao/ao20.jpg for the Friday nite site and http://www.mvas.org/archive/jbspo/jbpicnic.jpg for the Saturday nite site). Both sites are operated by the Miami Valley Astronomical Society of Dayton OH. In addition to my observations, I will be watched over by those much more experienced to insure that nothing is missed or misinterpreted. Why am I doing this? Well, hockey pucks...someone's got to stand up and say "Hey there, ya wacko -- I've gone out and looked lots of times, I've had help to make sure I'm doing it right, and guess what -- THERE AIN'T NOTHING THERE!!!" Information will be posted here as it becomes available. Photography is not possible (yet -- training not yet completed on 10" Meade LX200 with CCD camera, and still checking ebay for the camera for my scope) at this time, but when it is, photos and links to same will be posted here. It's my intent to keep this thread active/bumped for as long as possible -- which is to say it's liable to be here forever unless Nancy&Co admit they're as phony as a three-dollar bill...  Anyway...websites I can check, y'all??? |
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30-March-2003, 03:49 AM
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>Why am I doing this? Well, hockey pucks...someone's got to stand up and say "Hey there, ya wacko -- I've gone out and looked lots of times, I've had help to make sure I'm doing it right, and guess what -- THERE AIN'T NOTHING THERE!!!" <
It won't do any good. Plenty of people have been doing that for years. It doesn't make any difference. Besides, numerous believers, including Nancy, are now claiming to see PX with their naked eyes. (For example, check out the message board at godlike.com) No one's images are going to dissuade them, especially since they have their own pictures which they claim show PX. You'll just be dismissed as another disinfo agent. You're talking about people who want to believe, who trust in "intuition" over objective observation and who will see what they want to see. Even the failure of PX to appear in May may not change the minds of many of those who believe in PX and/or a pole shift. |
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30-March-2003, 05:05 AM
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I agree, it's impossible to "prove" Nancy wrong. She'll continue to tell people they can see it, and she'll continue to say she's seen it herself. However, if you really want to look, I post the general areas of observation on my site at http://m1.aol.com/deepspacegirl/visible.html (mostly for the Zeta followers so they don't look at the sun with their binoculars - Nancy has given no warnings to people about daytime viewing) She's also extended the timeline now to June 1st for the "pole shift". I expect another "extension" around the beginning or middle of May.
The coordinates Nancy has posted are For April 1, 2003 RA 04 09 40.9 Dec +11 12 52.4 For April 7, 2003 RA 04 09 40.9 Dec +11 09 47.5 For April 16, 2003 RA 04 07 52.9 Dec +10 14 12.3 She's also posted coordinates for quite a few more days in April and May, but most of those days the coordinates will be in astronomical twilight - pretty useless for imaging. You'll have to interpolate the coordinates on other days, no orbital elements have ever been provided, nor has the time of day for the posted coordinates. Enjoy your new instruments, and have fun! I hope that scope is already on a pier, those 10" and 12" LX200's can be mighty heavy to lift up onto the wedge. By the way, I usually tell her every week in her IRC sessions that I haven't seen it (weather permitting), and it usually gets me thrown of the channel <g>. But it's the truth. Some people just don't want to hear it. |
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30-March-2003, 03:04 PM
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30-March-2003, 04:40 PM
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And I though the double-negative was only a Cockney thing.
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30-March-2003, 04:47 PM
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RedShift
:P 486T=3/30.8:38
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because i know its "NOT" there.. but dont cared i look there anyway.. So? its the coOrdinates that matter to me when looking for X using red shift as the reference CD. HOWEVER: my real interest is in time Not Location and for me time means about FOUR HUNDRED years for X to ( S .. SWING BY {perrigee} the Sun ? maybe out about 10 times the distance of Saturn so the change in Monthy position would be very small and X as far as i look can be thought to be center screen and RA would change VERY VERY slowly = 200 deg/400yr or about 1/2 degree /year at perigee thats 30 minutes in 12 months or 1st approx = 1/2 Min/Month OR i'll say 30 seconds/month = sec/day |
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30-March-2003, 10:20 PM
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Numerous responses in one response...
Jay23 -- one reason I'm doing this is that the MVAS and the Museum are bound to get requests to 'show us Planet X' on the big telescope...we can now state in all honesty that "...even though we knew in our heart of hearts that Planet X doesn't exist, we have been looking anyway on a regular basis. We were right -- Planet X isn't there." A solid scientific response on the issue. If the Twinkiwoowoo in question chooses not to accept that answer, that's their creme-filled-brain problem. SarahMc -- my thanks for the link to your sitge. Will check regularly for updates.A June 1st pole shift? That gives me a few more weeks to get the compass needle bearings lubed and aligned... tazmandevil3 -- if you would, please, examine your dental coverage for costs of routine checkups and emergency procedures. I would hate to see you suffer extended out-of-pocket costs to repair that painfully chipped tooth when you BITE ME...(insert smiley here...or over there somewhere...)... Greenhalgh -- "While two negatives make a positive, two positives don't make a negative." "Yeah, right..." HUb' -- thanks for the coordinates. My personal favorite is StarryNightBackyard, although I do have RedShift2...still kinda learning to use that one. You might want to check the program C88 available at www.alcyone.de ...and see below for the latest on RedShift4. g99 -- Nope -- HUb' means the program RedShift (now out in version 4 -- http://redshift.maris.com/index.php3 ). TO ALL -- am saving coordinates and websites to look things up. Expect some semblance of regular reports, even if they're simply 'Nope -- still nothin' out there'...
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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30-March-2003, 10:25 PM
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30-March-2003, 10:47 PM
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__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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31-March-2003, 12:00 AM
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Generally speaking, posts would be made Sunday evenings. I work second shift Sun-Thurs, and as long as I answer the phone when it rings, I pretty much have carte blanche when it comes to web surfing.
My days off are Friday and Saturday. Specifically, if the weather is conducive to observing, Friday nites I'd be at the in-town observatory, and if nothing else is interfering (like the landlord says the grass WILL get cut this weekend...) on Saturdays I ought to be at the dark-sky site about 30 miles east of town. If something happens that I can't observe at all, I'll post that too. You should get some sort of answer weekly. Will try to make the answer meaningful ("I swear, it rained so hard that the Big Dipper filled up, and then it sprang a leak so bad it washed Aquarius away, and when that happened Orion jumped in to save him, but the stream was so strong that it washed them both around Taurus' legs, which p*ss*d the Bull off so bad it ran away, so I lost all my marker stars and that's the reason I couldn't find Planet X this week...either that or the dog ate my 15mm eyepiece..."). I'd like to extend an open invite to anyone with LEGITIMATE information on debunking X sightings to post it here. Let's keep it all in one thread and save a little bandwidth if we can. Of course, something new and exciting and worldshaking (like, conclusive evidence that the d*mn*d thing DOES exist) would merit its own thread. Posers...uhhh, POSTERS...are requested to use their own discretion in these matters.
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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31-March-2003, 01:11 AM
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Absolutely.
It was cold, dark, cloudy and raining this weekend. Sorry, no observing possible...plus, the landlord said all them there tree seeds had better be raked up posthaste... Howzat? |
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31-March-2003, 08:15 AM
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I've been reading Zetatalk for over a year and a half and I have to admit at times it has really had me thinking about our possible demise. I'me glad to see someone actually trying to see it and finding nothing. But one thing about the site stays unexplained. What's the point even if it is a hoax?
They have a very large website that must be expensive to maintain and seems to have a large viewing audience. What does whoever is doing this get out of this? My speculation is it is a psychology grad project on manipulating people throught the internet. Students would give you lots of manpower and the May 15th-30th is the end of the semester. Any other speculations? Stuart6200 |
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31-March-2003, 12:47 PM
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Keep in mind also that Nancy's site isn't a singular creation. A lot of it is stuff that's been culled from usenet and IRC sessions and arranged by her followers. It's been growing for 7 or 8 years now.
__________________
...And that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped. --Sir Bedevere |
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01-April-2003, 11:17 PM
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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!!! I had this super neat and extremely scathing update to deliver...and I hit the wrong key and wiped it out...pfudge...
Let's see... The Twinkie Patrol (dba Nancy&Co) are reporting numerous sightings and photographs of PX. Here are some of the latest. In these first two, please check out the bright red and distinctly cubical PX... http://www.darkinsight.com/helios2003/Sirius.jpg http://www.angelfire.com/psy/suppose...icture_010.jpg And while the next individual gets A for ingenuity and a C for photography, they get an F for consecutive brain cell use... http://www.zetatalk.com/teams/rogue/nancy16.htm By their own admission, these people are really Out There... http://www.crosswynd.com/outthere.htm Scroll down and check to see if you can pick up their broadcast -- special guest for the week of April 6 is Her High Woowooness herself, our own dear Nancy!! (If you can see the telecast, let us know the latest, willya?) And of course, these fine folk have their own large economy size load of links to more rampant paranoia... http://www.crosswynd.com/planetxinfo.htm Of course, for the more rational view of all this, I highly recommend the site run by The BABB's own Sarah McIntyre. Lots of frequently-updated information here on just why PX isn't... http://m1.aol.com/deepspacegirl/ I've taken to carrying a short digest of the facts against PX in my astro-junk bag, and I'm greatly appreciative to Ms. McIntyre for posting what I need to constantly update this little digest... Now, the apparent bad news...the weather forecast for this weekend doesn't look all that good for a formal observation. Rain and cloudy skies are forecast for Friday thru next Monday. BUT - I do have my small planisphere and 8x21 monocular which hides so nicely in my backpack, so I can at least get a couple of quick informal views out the door at work, and once I get home maybe I can assemble HUb'ble Jr and see what's what if it hasn't dropped below the horizon yet... I'm going to do some checking with StarryNightBackyard to triple check where everything is supposed to be for the next week or so. Everyone else, look up to the skies...and if you see Planet X, clean your glasses and check again...
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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02-April-2003, 04:55 AM
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What impresses me is that they can get a whole skyfull of black and a red dot that's so dim that nobody else sees it. A square red dot.
And judging from the Lawnchair Astronomer's photos, I rather believe that flash photography was involved. He has some nice pictures of nighttime insect fly-through/flight paths. |
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03-April-2003, 02:26 AM
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Well, I was just outside and glanced over that way and didn't see anything unusual.
Knowing that these people are mostly inexperienced stargazers I would imagine the ones claiming to see it are seeing Aldeberan.
__________________
"Ignorance has caused more calamity than malignity" H.G. Wells "Getting lost is part of exploring." Uniqua in "Backyardigans-Heart of the Jungle" "Trying to wrap my head around creationist astronomy is like trying to ride a unicycle around a Moebius strip: it’s off-balance, physically impossible, full of one-sided arguments, and in the end you don’t go anywhere." Phil Plait |
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03-April-2003, 04:22 PM
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In other news, has anyone else noticed the visual similarity between Nancy and Ann Widdecombe? I'd never seen a pic before. |
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03-April-2003, 05:11 PM
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My opinion is that these people really think they've involved themselves in something that will make their lives matter and that's what makes it a little sad and them a little dangerous at the same time. After a lifetime of disappointments, they're realizing they've set themselves up for another one and this time they've probably put all of their emotional eggs in that basket. |
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04-April-2003, 01:10 AM
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Official Observer's Official Observation
Go here http://www.badastronomy.com/phpBB/vi...?p=71054#71054 for the latest OOOO...ooooh, I made a pun... :-?
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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04-April-2003, 02:18 PM
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[quote="Iain Lambert"]
From my experience with these guys, I wouldn't be completely shocked if they discounted that one because the Death Star blew it up in A New Hope... Iain: THAT is hysterical! It does sound an awful lot lot "Alderaan", doesn't it?! Oh Lord, that's funny!!! Charlie In Dayton: For whatever it's worth, I'd just like to say "thank you". I've never been a PX believer, but when I heard about it initially I was somewhat concerned. Between reading posts and links and so forth here, and knowing that someone with access to some big guns of space viewing is looking and hasn't found the alleged body, I have slept immensely better in the last 6 or so months. There's something incredibly comforting in knowing that someone with access to what you have access to has looked and confirmed -and continues to do so- what most of us suspected (I.e.- we have more to worry about with Iraq, etc. than we do from PX). Again, thank you.
__________________
Who is the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows? |
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07-April-2003, 02:27 AM
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6 Apr 2OOOO3
The Official Observer's Official Observation for 6 Apr 2OOOO3 (how punny can this get?)...
Once again, the Zetans conspired to prevent direct daylight observations of PX on Friday night by moving a weather front through. Heavy rain, much air-to-ground lightning (very artistic strokes, though), and 60+ mph winds made for conditions less than conducive to astronomical observations. During the day of Saturday 5 Apr, there was generally cloud cover, although on occasion things would thin out enough to positively identify bright objects in the sky. Only one object on a constant track across the sky was noted. I'm guessing it was the Sun. The evening of 5-6 Apr began at the Sunwatch Indian Village with an indoor show&tell of telescopes, determining date by star position and sunrise, and some of Charlie Shirk's great HA and solar filter video of solar activity. (Gotta learn how to do that some day...). After the Village closed, several of us went to the dark sky site east of town. Some general maintenance work was done (installation of the new solid steel bolted-into-concrete pier for the 12" LX200 was accomplished), and on occasion breaks in the clouds offered some observations with the Mark I Mod 0 eyeball...while the area where PX is reputed to be had set, it is estimated that it would have been close enough to the horizon to create some sort of glow in the sky, as it's supposedly daylight naked-eye visible and should have approximately 2/3 the brightness of the full moon. Other than the standard already-located local urban glows, there were no unusual lights noted. Conclusion: as of the weekend of 4-5-6 April 2003, there still ain't nothing there yet... This concludes this week's Official Observer's Official Observation. We now return you to regularly scheduled programming already in progress...
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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07-April-2003, 02:45 AM
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I'll tell ya why...'cause there ain't nothing there (with apologies and/or the gnashing of teeth in the direction of tazmandevil3...yuk yuk yuk...). Go to bed and get a good night's sleep -- we need good people this summer to explain to the great unwashed why that red thing in the night sky is Mars, and this is all a perfectly normal albeit extremely rare occurrence; the last time it happened was before the dawn of recorded time, and they should see it while they can...they can start accurate stories for their descendants unto the seventh generation of how they got to look at Mars up close and personal. If it was me, I'd buy stock in companies that make binoculars...
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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07-April-2003, 08:41 PM
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Charlie--I echoe Jerod S. Thanks for your work, and keep us posted with the weekly "fireside chats"....
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14-April-2003, 03:13 AM
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Official Observer's Official Observation....
...for the weekend of April 12, 2003.
About halfway between Dayton and Cincinnati OH is the small town of Mason. Up until a few years ago, it was home to two of the most powerful radio stations in the US. WLW is still there, but the Voice of America's Bethany Relay Station is no more...rows of three hundred foot towers strung with fan dipoles, and thousand-foot-plus-length Beverage antennas strung on thirty-foot poles were stretched and pointed at the major land masses. Multiple 250,000 watt transmitters beamed America's story to the world from this little southwestern Ohio town...but no more. A few years back, the VOA sold the site, and now all that's left of the radio glory that was is the control building (now a radio museum) and the antenna switch matrix. (Someday, suitably charmed with pepperoni pizza and cold root beer, this reporter will tell the story of the night they shut everything down for four hours' maintenance, and in that time let us hook up our amateur radio gear...you'd be surprised what a 30dB gain antenna will do for a 50 watt peanut whistle RTTY signal...). Now, the edges of the site have been built into strip malls, warehouses, and other commercial property, as Cincinnati's urbanity sprawls north along the I-75 corridor. The center of the former 625-acre site is now a public park, and the thrice-yearly site of stargazes jointly attended and worked by both the Cincinnati and Dayton astronomy clubs. Saturday April 12 was the first of 2003, and conditions were very good. Clear skies, just a touch of haze around the horizon, light 10 mph breezes, temps in the mid-60's. Ahhh...spring hath sprung... I got there about 5:30PM, well before sunset, as Joe had promised he'd be there early with the club's solar scope. Indeed he was -- as a matter of fact, he had the club's little 90mm f5 with a Baader solar filter, and another scope of about the same size with a hydrogen Alpha filter in line. This reporter spent (in total) in excess of an hour comparing the views between the two. The hydrogen Alpha filter (later found to be hideously expensive) gives an orange view, and allows the viewer to see prominences (gas flares) around the edge of the solar disk. The Baader filter (which can be homemade!!-- see here for directions on building Baader filters for viewing or photography) gives a white-light image for viewing sunspots. The filters go over the objective end of the telescope in question, and the telescope is otherwise used as normal. (IMPORTANT NOTE - those little cheapo drug store telescopes can come with a solar filter that screws into the eyepiece. These should be avoided like the plague. They concentrate solar energy like a magnifying glass, and the filter can shatter from thermal shock with no warning, leaving the eye unprotected. Eye damage would be instantaneous and permanent, up to and including permanent loss of sight in the particular eye. Be safe - use proper solar filtering!!) While viewing, this reporter had the thrill of seeing a jetliner with contrail cross the solar disk. The aircraft had to be a looooooooooooong way off, because it was in focus! Later in the afternoon, various members of astronomical clubs from Dayton and Cincinnati assembled, and the evening's viewing was under way. (A real treat was a just-after-sunset pass of the ISS, which this reporter tracked with 10x binoculars.) There were by count at least twenty telescopes and four pair of binoculars in use at the park. Instruments included 7x35 handheld binoculars to 16x70 parallelogram mounts, simple 3" refractors and reflectors, 5" short- and long-tube Orion refractors, a 5" Takahashi refractor (okay, I'm impressed...), Dobs ranging in size from 4.5" beginner scopes to 13" Coulters to 16" Obsessions, SCTs of the Meade persuasion ranging from 90mm to 14"...there was some variant of glass there to suit everyone's taste. Early observations before sundown included the moon (the color and contrast of the Lunar image when the Sun is still up is extremely interesting -- there's some astrophotography material there), and after twilight, the smaller scopes entertained with views of Saturn, Jupiter, their respective moons, our Moon, and the ever popular M42. The larger light buckets on site were going for fainter M-class objects (okay, I'll take his word for it...the Sombrero Galaxy looks like a hat of some sort...). During the course of the evening, this reporter remembered his responsibilities to his fellow BABBlers...after viewing the particular area of the sky where Planet X supposedly is, and using several telescopes of varying design (just to make sure, y'know), an informal survey was taken. After suitable apologies for asking such a silly question, at least eight experienced stargazers (including at least one sitting officer of each of the clubs involved) were given the following scenario: "Extend a line through Orion's belt to Aldebaran, then drop a line down and another back over to the leftmost star in the belt to create a right triangle. Look in that area closely. Do you see anything in that general area that could conceivably be a daylight-visible naked-eye object?" Naturally, everybody queried responded in the negative (the Moon and the planets visible at the time were nowhere near the area of the sky in question). Explanations of just what the h*ll this was all about were proffered, and much hooting/hollering/merriment ensued. Promises to publicize the website where this report was filed were made, so everyone could get in on the fun. So -- for the weekend of April 12, 2003, the Official Observer's Official Observation must remain that so far, there ain't nothin there...
__________________
"If a tree is cut down in the rainforest, and is used to make paper to print a book, and the book is really bad, and there's nobody that will read it, do you still hear a sucking sound?" Charlie in Dayton, A.AsC. |
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14-April-2003, 09:03 AM
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Observer's thread
Thanks again Charlie for your weekly post. This is looking more and more like I won't have to pull up roots and run in a frantic panic over to Montana, from Spokane, WA, just in case the tsunamis were to throw themselves all the way over the Cascades; and not to mention the ceaseless quakes and the diet of worms! (Pity those that did order their lives around Nancy; They should file a class-action suit against her!) Well,no news is good news.... :wink:
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