Instead of writing it, I'd rather show it.

http://img6.picsplace.to/img6/26/MultiVersesGif.gif

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Nice picture.

but it would still be a universe.

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In your rush to call everyone "entrenched" or closed-minded or "limited" you fail to note that the "limit" here has a very natural boundary: that point at which the evidence stops. - JayUtah

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Just a lumpy one.

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In your rush to call everyone "entrenched" or closed-minded or "limited" you fail to note that the "limit" here has a very natural boundary: that point at which the evidence stops. - JayUtah

Science fiction was never meant to be an educational tool. - Editor Amazing Tales

Here's a slightly different way to think of multi-verses.

Massive *Cosmic* Black Holes are the key, BUT not to make whole universes out of just one.

Just *Time Reverse* a MBH from the universe level above ours (From its event horizon down to its Planck Singularity and then to one of OUR Voids) and you have Planck length Non-baryonic Dark Matter "leaking/streaming" into our universe. Do that for all the Voids and you have OUR 'space' traveling at the speed of "c" in every direction conceivable. Speed of light = "c" in empty space (NO baryonic matter yet)...Now GRB's make Galaxies, one day at a time. SIMPLE...GR and QFT unified.

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RussT
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Everything is, as it should be, otherwise, it wouldn't be!

You're just making all that up Russ...

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In your rush to call everyone "entrenched" or closed-minded or "limited" you fail to note that the "limit" here has a very natural boundary: that point at which the evidence stops. - JayUtah

Science fiction was never meant to be an educational tool. - Editor Amazing Tales

Not exactly...

http://physics.harvard.edu/people/facpages/randall.html

NARRATOR: Randall tried to calculate how gravity could leak from our membrane Universe into empty space, but she couldn't make it work. Then she heard the theory that there might be another membrane in the eleventh dimension. Now she had a really strange thought. What if gravity wasn't leaking from our Universe but to it? What if it came from that other universe? On that membrane, or brane, gravity would be as strong as the other forces, but by the time it reached us it would only be a faint signal. Now when she reworked her calculations everything fitted exactly. Our Bold.


http://www.bautforum.com/showpost.ph...4&postcount=66
Originally Posted by Tim Thompson
What if the other universes are not so "unobservable" after all? What if we have misinterpreted the observations, and the force we interpret as "dark matter", is really, gravity leaking out of the other universes, and into ours? I can readily imagine a multi-universe theory, which includes such an effect, and therefore is not simply "consistent" with observation, but actually predicts the observed effects we call dark matter & dark energy, as consequences of the communication of information between universes.

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RussT
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Everything is, as it should be, otherwise, it wouldn't be!

Is there anyway of testing this theory?

Tony

Russ, I should have put a simile there. It's what I've been wanting to say whenever the physicists and mathematicians start talking over my head, which isn't all that difficult. On the other hand they can't dry hump a sofa bed up four flights of stairs so the universe is in balance, as usual.

And Russ, I've already thought that about the gravition from dark matter, that it could be what was stated in your second paragragh. But "other" demensions sounds so woo woo to me that I've always kept it to myself.

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In your rush to call everyone "entrenched" or closed-minded or "limited" you fail to note that the "limit" here has a very natural boundary: that point at which the evidence stops. - JayUtah

Science fiction was never meant to be an educational tool. - Editor Amazing Tales

Okay, I see. I fully agree with mainstream that the initial conditions of how our universe(s) is working, MUST include, describing correctly how a Planck length/size singularity can be connected to those initial conditions, AND just what that Planck length singularity is capable of DOING.

So I agree that it doesn't explode, and that it 'causes' 'space' to expand. And that that expansion is seen in the Voids between the galaxy clusters.

You have to be careful here, with the dimensions concepts.

First, you have micro and macro dimensions. Now when you say dimensions, you are really talking about other realities that exist simultaneously in our 3d
space, but outside our ability to see or measure them. In the micro that's fine, that is what String/"M" Theory does, BUT, Lisa Randall above and MANY others are trying to figure out how to show that strings can be integrated into our universe through either the macro or micro 'other dimensions', which is the ONLY avenue open to them, SINCE the Big Bang says that ALL the Matter and space (space can somehow make more of itself at prodigous speeds) was created all at once in a 'closed system'.

Now, fractal universes are different, than dimensions. That says that there 'could be' a universe level above ours and below ours, theoretically going to infinity in both directions, and certainly we could NEVER tell how far above or below that they really do go...that's what leaves the possibility of GOD in the mix.

This is what makes Lisa's "Maths fitted exactly", possibly the greatest 'find' in the last 20 to 40 years.

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RussT
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Everything is, as it should be, otherwise, it wouldn't be!

I used to like this model - the idea that the dark matter halo around galaxies are really galaxies in other dimensions, so ours and theirs are all grouping together.

One question that's been nagging is that Dark Matter is supposed to not interfere with itself (ie. one piece of dark matter can go straight through another piece), otherwise it would all clump down into the centre just like the visible matter.

Now, of course it's possible that there's a number of side-by-side universes. In this case, we're limited by the apparent mass of the dark matter. Say there's 10 times as much DM as visible matter. Assuming similar sized galaxies, that would mean we're talking about 10 different universes. Of course, we feel the gravity of the closer ones more than that of the further ones, so maybe we can increase that amount and say we're in the middle of a group of (say) 20 universes, each on their own non-interacting (except though gravity) parallel plane.

Now, is 20 a sufficiently high number to make it look like "DM doesn't interfere with itself"? How many would be enough? Hmmmm, maybe since Gravity is so weak due to not sticking on any one plane very much, there could be much more?

Finally, and more critically, if the halo is comprised of other galaxies on other planes, then some of them must be near the outer edge of the halo - so how come OUR galaxies seem to always be in the centre?

I think 100% of all theories are made up.



I spent a lot of time thinking of ways in which my theory could not be disputed, like having our universe in a larger dark matter universe which aborbs the infinate light of the outer universe.

I used phoenetic symbols because the greeks were overused and the phoenicians were the ones that started it all anyways.

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^^^^^^^

I think 100% of all theories are made up.




You might have a point there........

Which means what? To "make something up" is not exactly the most precise of phrases. Unfortunately, it often carries the connotation that what is being "made up" is a LIE... something for which there is no evidence. If this is the meaning intended, then I should think 0% of all theories are "made up."

Of course that is disregarding many of the ideas put forward as theories in the Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Against the Mainstream Forum.

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A Lie is way off course!!!

Incorrect correlations is more precise and correct.

For example, if the correlation that the singularity involved in the initial conditions of the universe (Not necessarily 'starting time' for us) was NOT producing High Energy Gamma Radiation, BUT was producing...say, Non-baryonic DM...What else would come out of a Planck Length/Size singularity, accept Planck length/size material???

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RussT
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Everything is, as it should be, otherwise, it wouldn't be!

well as much it difficult to admit there just might be a Universe(s) superimposed on our own.

my favorite TV programs ever , was the program called the PSI-Factor. hosted by Dan Akroyd.( ( Blues Brothers fame). no longer on TV. shame really. it sure stretched my understanding of things. and by the way ALL cases were based on REAL CASES.).

where scientists were brought in , and these scientists were of the hightest caliber. top of their field.

there was one episode, if I remember right , was based in South America.

anyway an cloud of smoke like substance emerged from a South America home, in a room( what room , to long ago to remember) and expanded to fill the house.

now in the program they entered into this "smoke" but found and encountered nothing. and at the end of the program. this smoke like substance just disappeared.( there was more than one place on Earth that this smoke like substance appeared).

this was my first realization of the possibility of Universes being Superimpossed on one another.

alright bizzare but you explain it. they couldn't.

A question of supposition. If a man doesn't create it, it doesn't exist.

Just like God.

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so...ummm...what encompasses all the multiverses, does it expand as more 'verses boom into existance, or will it collapse on itself from all the extra 'verses creating a giant sucking sound like a vaccume?

hey, maybe it will pop like a water ballon and spill into the quasi-multi dimentional structure and make that expand too, or contract or explode itself into yet another...OW!!!....my brain hurts >:

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Jami Cat
Astronomy is looking up... :)

Space is infinite. Same as time.

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Reminds me of the concept of the 'collapse of the vacuum'

And what are those?

They look like galaxies.

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Punkrockbong, Speaking of looking like galaxies, is your avatar a real pic of a real galaxy or is it an artists rendering?

If it is a real galaxy, do you know which one or where I can see that pic, up close and personal?

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RussT
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Everything is, as it should be, otherwise, it wouldn't be!

I like good art.

idk, i just chose it from my list

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They're superclusters of galaxies.

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