shhhhhh onion skins !

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1 + e^i*pi = 0

I proposed this mechanism

Hydrogen is absorbed into the Earth's core as dense plasma (dissociated protons/electrons) - possibly 'dissolved' in Fe. FeHx (x = large) is possible - one can imagine large magnetic field with spinning hot dust and gas. Later Earth cools and plasma reverts back to hydrogen atoms. H could be 95% of original Earth but in very condensed state. This would account for expansion and also for possible subsequent contraction as H reacts to form other compounds and H2 escapes into space. Process would only involve diameter change of a few mm per annum. There may also have been occasions of sudden release of Hydrogen or Hydrogen compounds leading to extinction events. Asteroid collision perhaps?

Appendix

FeHx inside planets

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...eb9f17c517f136

I read somewhere that hydrogen can dissociate into electrons and protons when dissolved in metal under high temperature and pressure.

where is the evidence for any of this?

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Yes, I know. But have a look at e.g. this:

http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/GG/ASK/earths_core.html

quote from this link:
And than look at the composition of the upper mantle, etc...(just google for compostion of the Earth)

You didn´t present any mechanism how all this material "filled up" the expanding Earth. Coming from nothing? What´s the roll of the Hydrogen, BTW? Blowing up the Earth and filling it ... with ... how...?

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1 + e^i*pi = 0

Evidence for a previous smaller Earth is already very strong being the spherical match of the elder continents and their mineral and geological features. (I suggest attempts should be made to match precise geological/mineral formations across the Pacific by assay to establish the certainty of this.) This theory is currently discounted for lack of a satisfactory expansion mechanism.

For example

It is possible that a high temp and pressure hydrogen is 'dissolved' in iron not as atoms but as protons and electrons - in a compressed plasma state. Thus the H component of Earth occupies very little volume until it reconstitutes as atoms

That isn't science but it is akin to alchemy.

The mechanism rodin is looking for is simple plate tectonics. Yes, it is still a theory. But the *measurable* changes due to plate tectonics make it plain that it is the reason/cause of continental drift. not to mention Hawaii.

For the earth to *expand* there would have to a penalty-less increase in volume for which the absorbed hydrogen theory is just absurd. I can only picture such a thing causing a fusion-like reaction that would incinerate the earth.

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Sorry, you didn´t answer my question: Where do all the other elements, compounds (Ni, Si, ... Silicates, Basalts, ...) come from which fill in the expanding Earth.
Compressed plasma state Hydrogen and its "reconstitution as atoms" (Hydrogen atoms???)

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Die Lücke, die wir hinterlassen, ersetzt uns vollkommen [The gap we will leave behind will take our place entirely] (Carl Heinz Schroth)

1 + e^i*pi = 0

Okay, those that know more, feel free to jump in here. For dissolved hydrogen to be the source of the extra volume, that would mean the Earth was always around 1 Earth Mass, right?

It's not getting many more matter, it's just converting the matter it has to a less dense version. So wouldn't that also require a LOT more energy to push the surface out that far against the same gravity we have now?

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one of many problems. Also to "convert" as rodin speaks about would require a philosophers stone and a magician named Gandalf.

Continental drift does not explain the sphere jigsaw absent the younger oceans.

The 'fusion' of an electron and a proton - or for that matter the creation of the same from a neutron by 'electron' neutrino absorption (solar flux) would not take place as a sudden bang, but occur over perhaps tens or hundreds of millions of years. The core is after all hot and some speculate that there is nuclear fusion going on down there.

There are a number of ways hydrogen could be created or released.

Yes good point. A lot of potential energy must have been released. Or accumulated from the Solar flux. Or both.

Now this is interesting. You know I differ in a number of ways from Neal. One way is I thi6nk the Earth expa6nded and contracted some hence perhaps the driving force for subduction. Look @ Mars. It expanded but did not subsequently contract. Probably more docile because smaller and/or further from the sun (less solar flux per cubic whatever)

http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=d44Jj_...eature=related

I thought the "jigsaw" nature of some continents, confirmed by analysis of minerals and rock types, was one of the sources of the continental drift theory.

..the old super-continent (Gondwanaland?) split-up. The tectonic plates have subduction but also areas that expand - these are seen on the Ocean floors.

It all works without the alchemy/magic being proposed for expanding the Earth.

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If the extra volume came from this dissolved hydrogen wouldn't the earth be blown up like a big balloon?

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Okay please note I'm not trying to de-rail here - but could the singular land mass have been caused (eventually after everything calmed down) by the second body impact that is believed to have caused the moon? i.e. the added mass/possibly added water ended up meaning that 1/3rd of the earth was above water. had it not occurred we may have had more water and none of the surface would be land? hmmm.

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I am not following you. Are you saying the impact that caused the moon (mass to leave Earth) had a net increase of mass to the Earth?

I've always thought that too.
Waterworld? Europa!
"Attempt no Landings There" (But it doesn't say we can't have splashdowns!)

This response shows a misunderstanding of what I suggest has happened. Please read my posts on the subject. The hydrogen once released would permeate to the surface. Some would react. Some would escape into space. A slow process. The emergent atomic hydrogen would react for example with carbonates to produce water (seas) and hydrocarbon. Plus some molecular H2 may be trapped, or still permeating thru.

Pangea or Rodinia cannot account for the perfect match of the jigsaw across the Pacific. The match across the Atlantic was caused by the continents ripping apart. The equivalent match across the Pacific must have the same cause.

Once again

http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=oJfBSc6e7QQ

I agree. He is on the wrong track here

http://www.nealadams.com/discuss.html

But spot on with these animations

http://www.nealadams.com/nmu.html

Know why Jupiter has a hydrogen atmosphere? Because unlike Earth and smaller planets the hydrogen produced during planetary evolution cannot escape its gravity. I bet underneath is ice, frozen hydrocarbon etc.

Odd that stellar evolution/growth/shrinking is readily accepted yet planetary and moon(etary) expansion for which there is visual forensic evidence is not.

BTW I do not KNOW where the hydrogen came from but I can see that its emergence fits the FACTs and I suggest possible mechanisms.

How about those with deep and specialist knowledge test the hydrogen-driven evolution theory? What FACTs (if any) refute it? And how secure is their basis?

Originally Posted by Neverfly
Tree Rings.

reply byDhD40
shhhhhh onion skins !

Facile


posted by Captain swoop
where is the evidence for any of this?

Same as for plate tectonics. and any other 'simple' or whatever words you want to use for unproved theories you would like to state are 'established', theories


Lepton states:
That isn't science but it is akin to alchemy.

another facile remark with no scientific value whatsoever.


LotusExcelle assures us that :
But the *measurable* changes due to plate tectonics make it plain that it is the reason/cause of continental drift.

Asserted but unproven conjecture,, try again.


Lepton further adds to the scientific debate with:
Also to "convert" as rodin speaks about would require a philosophers stone and a magician named Gandalf.

,, Mods please,, this is too much. this goes on and on. people are not allowed to interject scientific debate with such purile manure according to the rules of this board. Please end it.

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posted by Captain swoop
where is the evidence for any of this?

Same as for plate tectonics. and any other 'simple' or whatever words you want to use for unproved theories you would like to state are 'established', theories



I should not have included this in my post about facile, unscientific manure. apologies Captain Swoop.

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Certain key evidence wanted

> matches of precise geological/mineral features across the Pacific

> evidence that the Earth day was shorter before EE and longer before EC

Meanwhile do view the amazing videos by Neal Adams wrapping NASA maps of planets and moons around spheres then removing the newer surfaces

Shockingly convincing

What has held the expanding planets hypothesis back IMO is

> Neal's kooky science

> The FACT that abiogenic oil is an obvious consequence.

I have it on good authority the Oil co's pay the car makers (in the US @ least) to keep fuel consumption high...

this is getting off topic, but i really want to see this proof.

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rodin:
I suppose your question is why all continents looks like they are part of one sphere?

the answer would be quit simple that probably they just collided to each other from all sides after all there was one continent which split into what exist now, and there is no reason why that process could happen more than once.

currently, i think the prevailing theory is that it has happened a few times in the past 4 billion years or so. they go one way until they crash into each other, then they go the other way until they crash into each other again, then they go the other way.. like a bunch of really huge bumper cars going in really super duper slow motion- only every time they "bounce" off each other, a little bit of each land mass stays on the one it just separated from.

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I learned this from a trader whose information is reliable deep and honest

Like many current theories this does not stand up to serious scrutiny. All sections of the puzzle match and are oriented in such a way as to show the coastlines have drifted apart. A sequence of bumps and collisions would show a randomised, not structured, arrangement