So the ESA originals are corrupted with a carefully designed spoof perpetrated by some German pranksters for the sole purpose of keeping jerks like me awake all night convinced that I'm harboring a Martian mind-agent who's here to take-over the earth. Damn these Krauts are clever! No wonder they invented the Volkswagen.

Isn't that Dianetics?

Anyway If this is something you want to persue I think you need to start your own thread.

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No; JPEG artifacts. That chap J.P.Morgan was intelligent enough to realise the true situation, after some discussion; are you?

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New Orion's Arm Site . The Starlark . Against a Diamond Sky (OA Novella Collection) . OA Flickr set

BillyG, Maybe this would be a good time to ask you to have a glance in the direction of the board rules and so on.

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Well, let's see. Am I in violation of article 2, 3, 12, 13, or 14?
Hard to tell.

Since the mainstream opinion is that the Hale Crater 'artifacts' are indeed a spoof then ha,ha,ha. Great joke and great work, whoever did it.
If the planet is being reformed into a Martian environment so the martians are more comfortable when they get here then I guess it's true that everyone who drinks water dies.

Kind of hard to argue with that logic, right?

On a lighter note, we humans probably can't help what we're doing re. changing the environment et al. It's natural, and to think we're other than natural is hubris. Get over it.


Sorry to have offended. I'm just fed-up with being jacked-around by the mainstream science and when I see something that lets me think there is something really substantial happening, I get excited. I want to believe the Hale Crater 'artifacts' are evidence of a MArtian culture that perished, but perhaps that's just too 'out there'.

Now I'm going to go get drunk. Thanks everybody. You're great.

May I come back?

Second thoughts about going out and seeking obliteration. Just had an offline chat with JPMorgan, you know, the intelligent one .... He got pretty thoroughly subliminated by superior wisdom and had the sense to let the sleeping dogs lie. Bright man.

How come these artifacts resolve so well for me on my primitive computer, and so well for so many others, yet for the avid spacemen here they are dismissed? I don't get it. Artifacts do not resolve into detail. Artifacts are rather easily identified, tend to be regularly distributed and affect entire images.

Do you -mugaliens- work for the ESA? After reading through many of your prolific postings (and you are a busy fellow) I don't get why you are so positive about otherwise somewhat radical points of view, but dismiss the images in the Hale Crater photos as artifacts. I mean, I don't want to get out of hand here, but when evidence of tampering can be so obvious and .jpeg processing noise is so discernable to even a moderately talented or experienced operator, why are you being dismissive?
Download the .jpeg, go the the area in question, enlarge, kill all the chroma and take a look. What I got cannot be artifacts. Worst case is that some really super-talented joker got into the images and overlaid old ariels of some bombed-out city, but the fit is darn near perfect and works over several images and under several different lighting conditions with correct shadows, shading and sun angles.
If it's a hoax, it's brilliant and I want to meet the guy who did it.

I hope there's evidence of life on Mars, past or present....I'll bet you do too.

If they were ruins and so obvious don't you think someone at ESA would have noticed?

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Someone did and it's being stomped on hard.

This forum limits .jpegs and the file I want you to see is 240kB. Send me an email billg@makahiki.net and I'll send you something interesting.

If you have it offsite, you can post a link here. I'll note that JPEG compression was one of the key issues in the earlier discussion (Photoshop manipuluation was another), so we would expect to see artifacts in a JPEG image.

This really should be in a separate Conspiracy Theory thread, though.

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

OK.
Look I don't know if this is allowed, but here's the link that got me started on this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcR7V...eature=related

I also have the entire set downloaded, but not online. If you will please post me an email at billg@makahiki.net, I'll be happy to send you more detail.

-BG

In the link, the characters after the & should be 'feature=related' Not'...eature=related'

Clearly not true in many cases, for many people: There are too many claims that can be identified as JPEG or other image artifacts (for example, internal camera reflections).


They certainly don't in the case of JPEG compression artifacts. That depends on what is being compressed: High detail areas will not be the same as low detail areas.

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

This thing's editing me. Put all this together in one line after the youtube.com/

watch?v=qcR7VX-FWD&feature=related

Now let's see if the blog takes this.

I don't know how to get a link up on this thing. Please send me an email and I'll get you the stuff, or go to youtube and search on 'Crater Hale Civilization'. There's lots of hogwash, but one sterling fellow has a 10-minute post on how to get your very own downloads directly from ESA.

I don't think this exactly rates as a conspiracy thing, but if I'm bugging you I'll be happy to go elsewhere with a thread. I just don't know how to do it yet, so please help me.

Well I just received a gentle admonishment from the sysop for being harsh with my language and demeaning of others.
Please accept my apology should those offended be so inclined. I meant no offense to any national or challenged group, mental or otherwise, and will henceforth constrain myself should the thread see fit to re-accept my postings.

This:

isn't a proposed conspiracy?

Anyway, just go to the "Conspiracy Theory" forum and click on the "New Thread" button, then write your post. But, if all you have is a Youtube video, it isn't going to be much of an argument. Given your complaints about the supposed quality of arguments here, I would have hoped for a little more.

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

But ESA published the photos intact with all the information.

It's possible that folks just haven't looked deep enough or that the scale of the Hale Crater is not appreciated. If there was a 'conspiracy' to obfuscate, ESA would have simply smudged the information as NASA has done on many of its photos in the name of protecting the public from disturbing information. It would appear that ESA is of a higher mind and for that reason I salute them. If anything it's an 'anti-conspiracy' since the information is there if one bothers to look.

Also, if you take the CNN/Fox News pov, the public just might be quite disturbed if indisputable evidence of another civilization surfaced in the mainstream media, so to protect us from oruselves, the information has not been fed into the commercial pablum system. Besides, this could deal a seismic blow of (ahem) Biblical proportions to the foundations of organized religion. And we _can't_ have that.

OK. I've done enough damage here. I'll go start a rope, or string or whatever, but don't say I didn't warn you. Go have a look for yourself and come join me elsewhere when you too become convinced, or whatever. If these photos are a hoax, they're a very good hoax and nobody has as yet told me how they did it..unless of course, it's real.

Ciao

What is your evidence for this claim?

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I know this is old, and you've changed your thinking some, and congratulations for that. I just want to tie up some loose ends about these former views, for people who might be trying to learn about this material, with this, created for the main topic:

People who wind up at the (formerly) recommended Hale Crater video may have have been drawn by this descriptive text and these keywords. Now, they might be drawn here. If so, I hope they consider reading the whole topic Crater Hale Revisited.

Also:

And...

Here's a little more for the more discerning searcher:

Keywords: skeptical, skeptic, skepticism, critical thinking, debunk, truth, reality, image compression, jpeg, jpg, artifacts, mars express, mars, martian, hale crater, fields, buildings, technology, baloney, bilge, bunk, bunkum, claptrap, flapdoodle, flimflam, hogwash, hokum, hooey, hot air, humbug, humbuggery, malarkey, poppycock, tommyrot, tripe, wrong

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I've enjoyed your well-craft responses, Van Rijn. The deterioration of this thread has inspired me to create a thread for discussing a potential solution to the scourage of image artifacts.

More, here.

Alternatively, we can always BARF the files, which will eventually result in a compressed image size of 0 bytes. However, the decompression program would then be rather large...

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If I set the budget, we'd have Ares and more. Unfortunately, I don't set the budget, and Ares is just too expensive and too far out for us to accomplish our goals within the budget we were given.

If we halt the ISS, all versions of Ares, and transport Orion and Altair aboard DIRECTv3's Jupiter family of Shuttle-Derived Launch Vehicles, we just might make it back to the Moon by 2020.

Billy, they're a Google Earth image of cornfields in Iowa.

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If I set the budget, we'd have Ares and more. Unfortunately, I don't set the budget, and Ares is just too expensive and too far out for us to accomplish our goals within the budget we were given.

If we halt the ISS, all versions of Ares, and transport Orion and Altair aboard DIRECTv3's Jupiter family of Shuttle-Derived Launch Vehicles, we just might make it back to the Moon by 2020.