Pan-Himalayan Railway Completed

[sarongsong]

October 15, 2005 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4345494.stm)
"The pan-Himalayan line climbs 5,072m (16,640ft) above sea level and runs across Tibet's snow-covered plateau...links the Tibetan capital, Lhasa, with the north-western province of Qinghai [China]..."
Trains.com says its the world's highest.

[Sammy]

That would be one heck of a ride!

I found this comment in the link interesting, and saddening:

But even before the railway line opens there are concerns about its future. The National Climate Centre said in June that rising temperatures would affect operation of the railway by 2050.

Looks like they built the trackbed on the permafrost. The whole road could become a victim of global warming.

[jkmccrann]

I think the bigger issue is what this raliway does to the culture and uniqueness of Tibet. Another step along the road to the pacification of the area for the Han.

Even though I do think that is sad, I would question the viability of Tibet as an independent country. Given all that, I would hope the permafrost does create some questions about the immediate future of the line.

[Laminal Cockroach]

Well gradually all the countries have to develop with time sometime in future, so why not, but the fact that the temp is gonna create peoblems by 2050 is really worrying such a huge investment for only 45 years, were they really aiming for that? but i think the railway is a great achievement itself... hope i can go to nepal sometime before 2050 to get a ride must cost hell of a lot... :lol:

[sarongsong]

Sunday, October 16, 2005 (http://goasia.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.rednova.com/news/technology/273280/rail%5Flink%5Fbrings%5Frest%5Fof%5Fworld%5Fto%5Fti bet/index.html%3Fsource=r%5Ftechnology)
"The first fully-loaded train to cover the entire Qinghai-Tibet Railway route arrived in Lhasa on Saturday...550 kilometres of the tracks were laid on frozen soil...Unlike traditional track-rolling missions, the first train was not loaded to full capacity with sand or rocks, but arrived...carrying aid. Major State firms have donated 12,300 tons of various materials, including chemical fertilizers, wheat flour and steel products..."
Can't seem to find anything on the train's specs and manufacturer, yet.

[publiusr]

Here is hoping they help tackle the Bering Strait Bridge.

Ride Amtrak to London!

[Bob]

I don't have a link but I read recently (probably in the NY Times) that the passenger cars on this railway are pressurized like airplanes and have enhanced ultraviolet protection. The track is raised because the permafrost melts every summer.

[Sammy]

I don't have a link but I read recently (probably in the NY Times) that the passenger cars on this railway are pressurized like airplanes and have enhanced ultraviolet protection. The track is raised because the permafrost melts every summer.

(bolding added)

If that's the case, I wonder why there is a concern about climate change.

[TheBlackCat]

The track is raised because the permafrost melts every summer.
It's called permafrost because it doesn't melt in the summer. The surface frost melts, but the permafrost layer, which is buried a little ways below the ground, never melts (hence the name). If it does melt, such as if you were to build a normal house on it, the ground would become weak and sag and the house would collapse (I saw a house in alaska that was leaning at about a 60 degree angle because it wasn't insulated to protect the permafrost).

The metling permafrost would be at least as big a problem for Alaska and Western Canada. The trans-alaskan highway, the main connection artery between the western US/southwest provinces and Alaska/northwest provinces is the trans-alaskan highway. It is built on permafrost, using a layer of insulation under the road so it doesn't melt. However, if global warming caused a general permafrost melt the road could collapse. Similarly, the trans-alaskan pipeline, which pipes the crude oil from northern Alaska to ports in the south would also collapse and spill its contents, since it is specifically built to operate with the permafrost.

[Bob]

It's called permafrost because it doesn't melt in the summer.

True enough, and I was only quoting from a newspaper article, but if you google permafrost+melt you will find that global warming is causing large areas of the earth's surface which have been permafrost for thousands of years to now melt at the surface in the summer. I leave it to you to decide whether these areas should no longer be called permafrost areas.
And here is an article about the Tibet railroard. It mentions the surface buckling and twisting in the summer.

http://www.tibet.ca/en/wtnarchive/2001/7/30_3.html

[Blob]

For centuries Tibet has been the embodiment of an exotic fantasy. A Buddhist Shangri-La, mysterious and remote, locked away within high mountains from the frenetic modernity of the outside world. But as the first train ever pulled up to Lhasa station on July 1 having hurtled across frozen tundra for more than 1,000 kilometers, a new chapter in Tibet's history began.

Read more (http://www.phayul.com/news/article.aspx?article=China's+'magical+road+of+heav en'&id=13226)

[publiusr]

Interesting.

[jkmccrann]

Reading this Newsweek article, sounds almost like a Chinese Government Propaganda Puff Piece!

Newsweek Opines on the New Tibet Railway (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13879454/site/newsweek/)

But why is Melinda Liu of Newsweek cheering the whole thing on from the sidelines? Are Newsweek seeking to get something out of China? Do Newsweek not engage in any critical comment in relation to China?

Just found this contribution from Newsweek a bizarrely chirpy and upbeat piece about what is in fact for many in Tibet, and elsewhere, actually quite a controversial issue.

Very strange, is anyone aware of Newsweek pursuing some sort of agenda in regards to China?

[farmerjumperdon]

True enough, and I was only quoting from a newspaper article, but if you google permafrost+melt you will find that global warming is causing large areas of the earth's surface which have been permafrost for thousands of years to now melt at the surface in the summer. I leave it to you to decide whether these areas should no longer be called permafrost areas.
And here is an article about the Tibet railroard. It mentions the surface buckling and twisting in the summer.

http://www.tibet.ca/en/wtnarchive/2001/7/30_3.html

I was under the impression that there was very little surface area that was permanently frozen. Even way up in the frozen tundra, doesn't the surface melt at least a little bit every summer.

I understand that under the Antarctic ice sheet and big glaciers the ground might never thaw, but thought all exposed soil thaws at the surface when the sun beats down on it during the peaks of warmer weather; and that permafrost referes to the permanently frozen layer under the surface.

[sarongsong]

...is anyone aware of Newsweek pursuing some sort of agenda in regards to China?#2 to Time magazine, Newsweek may simply be 'trying harder', and they certainly don't wanrt to lose their '08 Olympic press pass.

[Gillianren]

I was under the impression that there was very little surface area that was permanently frozen. Even way up in the frozen tundra, doesn't the surface melt at least a little bit every summer.

I understand that under the Antarctic ice sheet and big glaciers the ground might never thaw, but thought all exposed soil thaws at the surface when the sun beats down on it during the peaks of warmer weather; and that permafrost referes to the permanently frozen layer under the surface.

That's my understanding as well.

[Donnie B.]

So maybe they excavated down to the permafrost level and laid the tracks there...

You know, like traveling to the Sun at night.

[Roy Batty]

So maybe they excavated down to the permafrost level and laid the tracks there...

You know, like traveling to the Sun at night.
:lol:

[yaohua2000]

I'd backed from my tibet rail trip last week. Tibet is a beautiful place in summer, and I've uploaded some photos and videos at Wikimedia Commons here (http://tools.wikimedia.de/~daniel/WikiSense/Gallery.php?&wiki=commons.wikimedia.org&img_user_text=Yaohua2000).

At the trial period, a sleeper ticket is very difficult to get, so I purchased a "hard seat" ticket from Beijing to Lhasa, only RMB$ 389 (less than US$ 50), very cheap. The 4064-km journey takes 48 hours. I made a short rest in Nagqu (A small town about 300 or so km from Lhasa) on the way to Lhasa.

[yaohua2000]

Panoramic view of Nagqu railway station (4513m above sea level):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/20060731095739_-_%E9%82%A3%E6%9B%B2%E7%AB%99_-_Panorama.jpg

Train approaching at Nagqu railway station (.ogg video):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d9/20060731103218_-_K917_-_%E9%82%A3%E6%9B%B2%E7%AB%99.ogg

The trip through the world's highest rail tunnel, Fenghuoshan tunnel (.ogg video):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/66/20060801102742_-_T224_-_%E9%A3%8E%E7%81%AB%E5%B1%B1%E9%9A%A7%E9%81%93.ogg

Nanshankou railway station in Qinghai province (.gif video)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/20060730234344_-_%E5%8D%97%E5%B1%B1%E5%8F%A3%E7%AB%99.gif

Nachitai railway station in Qinghai province (.gif video)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e0/20060731001950_-_%E7%BA%B3%E8%B5%A4%E5%8F%B0%E7%AB%99.gif

The starting station of the line, Xining railway station in Qinghai province:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c1/20060802033713_-_%E8%A5%BF%E5%AE%81%E7%AB%99.jpg

The starting station of the new line completed in 2005, Golmud railway station, 2829m above sea level:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/20060730225824_-_%E6%A0%BC%E5%B0%94%E6%9C%A8%E7%AB%99.jpg

World's highest railway station, Tanggula railway station (5068m above sea level):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/de/20060731061434_-_%E5%94%90%E5%8F%A4%E6%8B%89%E7%AB%99.jpg

The terminal station of the line, Lhasa railway station, 3650m above sea level
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/df/20060731234006_-_%E6%8B%89%E8%90%A8%E7%AB%99.jpg

The three-language signage, tibetan, chinese, and english
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2c/20060730230539_-_T27_-_Toilet.jpg

The oxygen supply connector under each passager's seat
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/eb/20060801122829_-_T27_-_Oxygen_Supply.jpg

The ticket
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/20060729120356_-_T27_-_Ticket.jpg

[Swift]

Thanks for the pictures. I find it very interesting that they supply oxygen lines - did you use them? The Tanggula station is beautiful.

[yaohua2000]

Thanks for the pictures. I find it very interesting that they supply oxygen lines - did you use them? The Tanggula station is beautiful.

I walked around in the Lhasa city in early morning (around 4:00am before sunrise), but it suddenly rained, and I got a cold, so I tried the oxygen supply on the train on the way from Tibet to Qinghai, but seems not to be very effective.

[publiusr]

Oxygen lines--now I've heard everything.

[farmerjumperdon]

Very cool photos. Thanx.

[sarongsong]

Oxygen lines--now I've heard everything....then there's those underground airlines (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:FVhszbZMlBcJ:eng.lacity.org/techdocs/sewer-ma/f200.pdf+%22underground+airlines%22+construction&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=3&client=opera),...Airlines may be constructed either underground or above the ground surface...that never fail to raise a smile when WARNING! signs for same are occasionally found while hiking in/near cities...

[yaohua2000]

A 75-year-old Hong Kong man has become the first passenger to die on board the world's highest railway line running from western China to Tibet.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20286280-23109,00.html

[publiusr]

Sad.