Saturn...and some questions

[Grand_Lunar]

What's could be better than seeing the lord of the rings in a telescope? Showing it off!

Like the New Horizons launch controllers, cloud cover got in my way of seeing the ringed planet. Finally, after perhaps six years of waiting (I was in the navy during that time, with no access to a telescope), I finally saw Saturn with my very own eyes. Well, through a telescope. And I was fortunate enough to catch my folks when they were awake to see it. It brought back memories for my mom and simply awed my dad. That made me even more proud of this oppurtunity.

My dad brought up an question that I wasn't sure of: how big an instrument do you need to see the moons of Saturn, say Titan? Mine is a 4.5 inch reflector. Is it enought?
Also, does light pollution effect the color of planets in a scope? My dad described it as appearing pink in color (I see only gray, due to my color blindness). I live not far from Fort Lauderdal and Miami. The glow from the cities is visible on the horizon.

Also, when is Jupiter visible? I read it is in the dawn sky, but I want to be sure. Just so I also can look at this giant as well.

[slotdrag]

Yes the city lights can affect the color through the scope. I have a 3.5 scope and have seen titan. I live in Wichita Ks. Darker skies here. And both jupiter and venus are up at dawn. good luck.

[Romanus]

I think with a 4.5", Titan and Rhea should be very easy. Seeing Dione should also be possible, and even Iapetus if the sky is dark and it's in a favorable part of its orbit.

[JohnW]

I think with a 4.5", Titan and Rhea should be very easy. Seeing Dione should also be possible, and even Iapetus if the sky is dark and it's in a favorable part of its orbit.
I've seen all four of these in a 4" refractor in light-polluted skies. If seeing is good, they should all be doable.

[hhEb09'1]

It helps to know where to look, since they'll hardly be much different than the background stars. The astronomy mags have tables, and there are online references too.

[JohnW]

It helps to know where to look, since they'll hardly be much different than the background stars. The astronomy mags have tables, and there are online references too.
It also helps to sketch what you're seeing. As well as giving you something to check later, sketching can encourage you to look harder.

[Grand_Lunar]

Thanks for the help, people.
I think I did manage to see a moon tonight, but not sure which one it was. The light pollution certainly didn't help. I'm guessing it was Titan, since being the largest, it ought to be more visible.
Given that the night was cloudless was a bonus as well. Also, I let the 'scope cool down. That might have helped too.
Is there an ideal magnification for observing Saturn with its moons? The first night, I used a 120x setup; a 12.5mm with a Barlow. The next night, I used a 125x setup; 4mm.

Gotta ask this too: does the telescope brand detirmine the quality of the view? Mine is a Tasco.

[hhEb09'1]

according to my starware, Titan was about 130 seconds away from Saturn, about mag. 8, more or less off to one side and a bit above (we're seeing the underside of Saturn now I think). The next brightest moon, Rhea, would have been closer to Saturn and a little bit below on the same side, but it's mag. 9.5.

[Grand_Lunar]

I really have to find a chart to make of what I'm seeing!

Another question, a bit off topic. I looked at Jupiter this morning, and it seemed, at a magnification of 125x, that I could just see a 5th moon, beyond Callisto. Any idea which this would be? I suspect it to be a moon, as it's more or less in the same plane as the Galilean moons.

[hhEb09'1]

No clue. My starware doesn't show any stars or asteroids in the vicinity. But my starware doesn't have Planet X in it, either. :)

[ngc3314]

I really have to find a chart to make of what I'm seeing!

Another question, a bit off topic. I looked at Jupiter this morning, and it seemed, at a magnification of 125x, that I could just see a 5th moon, beyond Callisto. Any idea which this would be? I suspect it to be a moon, as it's more or less in the same plane as the Galilean moons.

Either bad or good luck (depending on your point of view). There was a magnitude 9.5 star projected in that location several hours ago. Project Pluto's excellent Guide8 program lists it as SAO 158955 (among other names). Jupiter does constantly drift against background stars, but we seldom notice them if they're not in a plausible place to look like moons.

[Wolverine]

I really have to find a chart to make of what I'm seeing!

In the interim, these freebie utilities from S&T may help:


Jupiter's Moons (http://skyandtelescope.com/observing/objects/planets/article_830_1.asp)
Saturn's Moons (http://skyandtelescope.com/observing/objects/planets/article_1136_1.asp)

[Dave Mitsky]

I really have to find a chart to make of what I'm seeing!

Another question, a bit off topic. I looked at Jupiter this morning, and it seemed, at a magnification of 125x, that I could just see a 5th moon, beyond Callisto. Any idea which this would be? I suspect it to be a moon, as it's more or less in the same plane as the Galilean moons.

What you saw was a "field" star. The four Galilean satellites (Io, Europa, Ganymede, and Callisto) are the only ones readily visible through most amateur telescopes.

http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=37077

Dave Mitsky

[Grand_Lunar]

I see. Literally.

How powerful a telescope, or at what magnification, would be needed to see one of the other moons besides the Galilean moons?

Oh, and thanks for the links Wolverine. I also had a feeling this thread would be moved.

[redshifter]

I'm not sure any other Jovian moons besides the 'big 4' are readily visible with most amatuer equipment.

'Gotta ask this too: does the telescope brand detirmine the quality of the view? Mine is a Tasco.'

Yes and no. Good optics will provide better, clearer views esp. at higher magnifications, but the atmosphere quality on any given night has a greater effect on the quality of views. If your scope is a reflector, make sure it's collimated properly. Also, if you're using the Tasco eyepeices that usually come with Tasco scopes, you might consider an upgrade.

[Grand_Lunar]

How do I ensure my reflector is collimated? In fact, what does that mean?

Where can I find other styles of eyepieces? And how can I be sure they'll fit?

[redshifter]

There should be some directions on collimating in your manual, if you have one for that scope. If not, do a Google search. Basically, collimation is making sure the secondary and primary mirrors line up properly with the focuser and each other. Try www.telescope.com for eyepieces as a starting point. Your Tasco scope might have a .965" focuser which will require an adapter in order to use 1.25" eyepeices. There are very few decent quality .965" eyepeices on the market, you'd want to step up to 1.25" for much better quality. The .965" and 1.25" are the inside diameter of the focuser.

[Grand_Lunar]

Thanks again, Redshifter.

Is there a particular brand of eyepieces that you recommend? The site you directed me to advertises for Orion. I myself was thinking of Meade.

[Chip]

Would just like to mention, when I was a kid, Saturn was the first object I focused on with a cheap wobbly secondhand telescope. Viewed from a modest suburban backyard, low and star-like on the horizon, when the fantastic rings came into view, it was the best, most exciting introduction to astronomy one could have.

[Grand_Lunar]

I know the feeling, Chip. ;)

[redshifter]

Ditto! Saturn through a rickety 60mm dept. store scope (after much fiddling) in a light polluted sky is what hooked me. Made me want to get a real scope and start seeing what else was out there.

[braveheart]

Here's a link on "How to collimate your Newtonian reflector"
http://skyandtelescope.com/howto/scopes/article_787_1.asp

[Grand_Lunar]

Thanks, Braveheart.

I've realized after reading the article that I need to do that. Unfortunately, I don't have the tools mentioned. Are there certain types of stores that have them, or would I be better off ordering online?

[Grand_Lunar]

Another question, fairly simple.

I notice that when I have both eyes open, that the image looks sharper than when I look with one eye. Is this common?

[redshifter]

I get the best results when covering the eye I'm not using to look through the eyepiece as opposed to closing it. Less fatigue. For collimiation, you might want to consider a laser collimater, or at least a 'chesire' eyepiece, both available at www.telescope.com. You could get these items locally at any decent astronomy shop as well.

[glasspusher]

You can collimate the scope by eye if you need to. A laser collimator makes it a lot easier. If you do get a laser check to see if it is ajusted properly. I bought one from Orion Telescopes and used it right away and found that the scopes collimation was way off, adjusted everything and thought that the view was going to be great. That night I found things were not so good. I went back and readjusted by eye and things were fine. So I made a set of "V" blocks and found the laser was way off. So it was a simple operation to adjust the laser using the "V" blocks and the full length of my house as a range. One thing the laser won't do that a Cheshire will, is get the secondary offset correct.

[Dave Mitsky]

http://www.amateurastronomy.com/collimate.html

Dave Mitsky

[snabald]

I have seen 3 moons with my 4.5" reflector ... I know the brightest one was Titan...

[naios]

I use a deluxe laser collimator (orion sells it, mine is a generic "knockoff") and it really pays off in ease of use, efficiency and accuracy. You just tweak the mirror settings until you line up the pinpoint of your laser with the centre of the bullseye.

[Grand_Lunar]

Where did you purchase such a fine item, Naios?

[naios]

I ordered mine from Khan Scope in Toronto.

[Grand_Lunar]

Was it realtively inexpensive, compared to others?

BTW, kind of ironic being ordered from Khan scope, given your avatar! :)

[naios]

You know, you are completely right. I am buying from Khan, how ironic. Anyhow, the price is substantially more than the other devices I've seen, however I am able to get the job done very quickly. When putting stars out of focus I can see that it is really in fact, aligned very nicely.