NFL Draft 2007

[Donnie B.]

Time for the NFL version of the hot stove league to get cranked up.

One of the big stories this year was New England trading a 4th round pick for wide receiver Randy Moss, who has had a number of behavior issues (on and off the field) in the past. This has created a pretty heated controversy in these parts.

Noted sportswriter Dan Shaughnessy wrote a column yesterday berating the Patriots for that move (and also for picking another controversial player in the first round), saying that the Pats have abandoned the high ground in favor of a win-at-all-costs attitude. Needless to say, that stirred up a lot of discussion via email and on the local sports talk radio stations.

Meanwhile, the Boston Globe web site ran a poll on the deal. Almost 90% of respondents approved of it.

Today Shaughnessy responded to the controversy with this rejoinder. (http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2007/05/01/shame_is_fleeting_and_love_is_blind/)

What do you think? Are the Pats selling their souls here, or are they taking a chance that Moss may be willing and able to bring his behavior up to the Pats' standards, rather than lowering theirs to Moss' level?

[Fazor]

Well, I don't like Moss, but I don't like the Pats either. Although I will say it does seem like a new dirrection for them to head, as they always appeared to steer clear of the troublesome players in the past.

I was dissapointed to see another year go by where the browns didn't draft any Ohio State players (although, as much as I would have loved to see Ted Ginn go to the Browns, they already have plenty of talent at the WR positions). It'll be interesting to see Brady Quinn, but unless they beef up their O-Line, it doesn't really matter who their QB is. Honestly, I thought Tim Couch was a talented QB. And so was Fry. And so was [insert name of countless other QBs to have gotten beaten up and shipped out of Cleveland]. Honestly, I'm tired of thier "Star young QB" approach; why is it only obvious to everyone other than the management that the QB spot isn't the big offensive problem? Oh well, the OL has been Cleveland's problem since the last few years Bernie was at the helm.

[Lurking Nerd]

I thought that New England had done this type of thing in the past a couple of times. They get someone who has a slightly tainted history and that person plays great for them.

I think this move is a bit of a risk but what player isn't. With the success the Pats have had, Moss would be smart to work like they want and enjoy the wins that are sure to follow. If he doesn't, I can't see that organization treating him like the spoiled player he's come across as. I believe that they'll bench him and/or release him sooner rather than later if he doesn't produce. If that's the attitude they have here, I think the risk is worth the gamble.

[Serenitude]

Moss is slightly tainted in the same way the Peyton Manning is slightly good :p

If I were New England, with a reputation for business and class, I wouldn't have touched Moss with a 10 foot pole. They got much better at WR without him anyway. He won't bring much positive, and will melt down and become a cancer because Tom Brady likes to keep defenses guessing by giving the ball to many different people, and Moss will demand the ball every play. Moss criticizing Brady = Moss loses.

As for the Browns, I like the move. I don't think Couch had much talent - notice he couldn't even keep a job as a third string backup anywhere in the league after exiting Cleveland. Frye isn't much of a passer either. Cleveland does have a habit of baiting it's fans with "Quarterback Savior" gimmicks, but this looks to be the real deal.

As for my Texans, yet another draft goes by without the words "Offensive Lineman" in the important rounds. Maybe we can get Schaub killed just like we did Carr. Yay us :)

[LurchGS]

I honestly can't say I'm a football fan, though I kinda track the Bears. I hear there's some team here in Denver that plays in a stadium that looks like a giant toilet bowl...

I've been to a few games recently, and despite having had a full night of sleep the night before, I fell asleep in the middle of two of them. Playoff games. Close games.

Football is about as boring to watch as bowling or golf.

Of course, some network - I think it was VS or NFL.. something like that - got their ducks nicely lined up. Replayed the previous weekend's games with all the BS taken out. All the timeouts, most of the measurements, all of the halftime "analysis".. It's actually watchable.

Football and Baseball are the only two professional games I know of that are improved by television - football because you can turn it off.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled fanfest...

[Fazor]

Hmm...Football as a boring sport. I take it you haven't played it much. :) As for Baseball being improved by tv? I disagree there also. Love going to ball games. Love listening to them on the radio. TV, well slightly less love than the other two options. :)

[Donnie B.]

I have learned that I enjoy both football and baseball much more on high-def TV. The widescreen format give a more expansive view of the action, and that combined with the higher resolution and surround sound makes it a lot more like going to a game in person. Except nobody spills beer down your back.

Lurking Nerd, I agree with your comments about Moss (mostly -- he's definitely more than slightly tainted). I'm looking at this as a low-risk experiment. They got him for a 4th-round pick in a weak draft, and he cut his contract from $9.5 to $3 million for the year (with another $2M in incentives). So if he steps out of line, they can cut him loose with minimal loss.

You know if it came down to a choice between, say, him and Brady, ol' Randy would be out the door faster than he could run a 40. As I see it, they've given him a chance to fit in with the Patriots, rather than dropping their standards to gather Moss.

[Lurking Nerd]

Whoops. Didn't mean to imply that Moss was only slightly tainted. I was trying to say they acquired players in the past that were slightly tainted and it seemed to work out. So now they are going to try someone with a worse history. Other than that, I meant the same things Donnie B said, only he said it a whole lot better than I could.

[swansont]

Moss quit on the Raiders. I was reading a comment elsewhere, from a sportswriter who votes for the hall of fame, on whether Moss was HOF material if he resurrects his career with the Pats, and his answer was, "no," and his reasoning was that it would be proof that Moss dogged it in Oakland. And that's not what hall-of-famers do. I think he has a point.

I agree with Serenitude and Fazor about drafting O-line to help your QB (or RB for that matter). No QB is going to do particularly well if they get sacked 60-70 times a year, and are hurried a proportional amount of times. I'm a Dolphins fan, and a few years back when Ricky Williams quit for the year everybody blamed that for the horrible season. But they ignored that he would have been running behind bad a O-line that also didn't protect the QB, and that's really what limited the whole offense.

[Donnie B.]

swansont, as a Dolphins fan, what do you think of the first-round selection of Ginn?

[Fazor]

As an OSU fan who watched Ginn through his entire career, I can say he is as exciting to watch as they say he is. I will warn that his NFL career might go quite a different dirrection however. When he parted the college arena, he still showed noticable weakness in route-running (although was getting much better) and ball handling (catching, both passes and punts, though once he had the ball I don't know if he ever dropped it). He has amazing speed, which in college made him a standout. In pro, most of the guys have the speed to at least keep up. We'll see.

p.s. please don't take this as an anti-Ginn post, I love to watch the guy and wish him all the best. I'm just not sure he was first-pick material for a team like Miami, that has needs in soo many areas.

[Serenitude]

As an OSU fan who watched Ginn through his entire career, I can say he is as exciting to watch as they say he is. I will warn that his NFL career might go quite a different dirrection however. When he parted the college arena, he still showed noticable weakness in route-running (although was getting much better) and ball handling (catching, both passes and punts, though once he had the ball I don't know if he ever dropped it). He has amazing speed, which in college made him a standout. In pro, most of the guys have the speed to at least keep up. We'll see.

p.s. please don't take this as an anti-Ginn post, I love to watch the guy and wish him all the best. I'm just not sure he was first-pick material for a team like Miami, that has needs in soo many areas.

I agree. If he has any pro career at all, it'll be as a punt and kick return specialist. Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad choice to spend your 9th pick on, passing on Brady Quinn for...

[Fazor]

I agree. If he has any pro career at all, it'll be as a punt and kick return specialist. Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad choice to spend your 9th pick on, passing on Brady Quinn for...
Even as such (punt/kick returner) he often tries to make too much out of too little. He did best when he just Forest-Gump'ed it ("Run, Teddy, Ruuuun!") but too often he dances around and tries too hard for the big play. Not to mention the fact that he dropped the catch about 1/4 the time (3 out of 3 times in a single game). I think he'll be an okay pro-baller, but he's not going to be feared like he was in college.

[swansont]

swansont, as a Dolphins fan, what do you think of the first-round selection of Ginn?

I don't know; I'm on the skeptical side, but the proof is in the playing and am happy to be shown wrong. We've recently seen that small (by NFL standards), extremely quick players can be game-changers, e.g. Devin Hester, Dante Hall, in the return game. But not first-round material unless they can contribute in the passing game. Hall has never really done that, and with Hester it's too soon to know, and they were 5th and 2nd round picks, respectively. So it certainly wasn't a "safe" pick to assume that Ginn will do what they haven't.

I don't disagree with passing over Quinn, though. The Fins got a decent QB prospect (Beck) in the second round. If they took Quinn, then they have the problem of him not having anyone to throw to, since Chambers could be double-covered the whole time with a stiff at the other wideout spots. Plus there's more pressure to start the QB right away if he's drafted in the first round, and that can turn out badly if the supporting cast isn't there.