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Swift
04-September-2007, 07:15 PM
Just saw this on CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/04/fossett.missing/index.html)
World aviation record-holder Steve Fossett is missing and a massive search is under way in western Nevada, a Nevada aviation spokeswoman said Tuesday.

Fossett took off from a private air strip known as Flying M Ranch, 30 miles south of Yerington, Nevada, at about 6 p.m. local time Monday, with enough fuel for four to five hours of flight, according to the Civil Air Patrol.

Civil Air Patrol Maj. Cynthia S. Ryan said authorities are searching hundreds of miles of rugged terrain in western Nevada. They also are analyzing information from radar intelligence to try to track Fossett.

Nicolas
04-September-2007, 07:17 PM
Not good. Not good at all.

I'm not familiar with the Nevada desert, does the average surface there allow for succesful emergency landings?

Larry Jacks
04-September-2007, 07:18 PM
Hope it turns out well. Fossett is someone I admire for his sense of adventure and fun.

Swift
04-September-2007, 07:23 PM
Not good. Not good at all.

I'm not familiar with the Nevada desert, does the average surface there allow for succesful emergency landings?
Mostly desert, so he won't have to worry about drowning. But a big mixture of mountains and flat areas.

Larry Jacks
04-September-2007, 07:27 PM
I just found a little more information here (http://www.recordcourier.com/article/20070904/NEWS/70904002).

Fossett, 63, was last seen taking off from the Hilton Ranch south of Smith Valley in a single engine Citabria Super Decathlon heading south.
Civil Air Patrol Nevada Wing Mission Public Information Officer Maj. Cynthia S. Ryan said three crews are in the air looking for Fossett’s blue and white aircraft and that more are on the way.
“We will be launching more shortly,” she said.
The search area covers hundreds of square miles of rugged terrain. The Civil Air Patrol has called area airports looking for Fossett.

A Super Decathlon (http://www.princetonairport.com/sdspecs.htm) is a fun plane (I took my spin training in a regular Decathlon many years ago) but I don't know if that would be my first choice for a night flight, especially over rugged terrain. A Decathlon is often used as an aerobatic trainer and for intermediate class aerobatic competitions. As such, the stability is less than more conventional planes. Flying at night over sparsely populated terrain is more challenging due to a lack of visual references. Most Decathlons aren't set up for instrument flying and the lower stability makes it somewhat more challenging to fly under those conditions. Fortunately, the plane has a slow landing speed and rugged construction. If Fossett ran into trouble (such as an engine failure), then there's a pretty good chance that he could survive impact if he had the plane under control.

There's an old joke about what to do if you lose power in a single engined plane at night.

1. Fly the plane - keep it under control.
2. Set up the proper glide speed.
3. When you get near the ground, turn on your landing light.
4. If you don't like what you see, turn the light off.

djellison
04-September-2007, 07:31 PM
:( I hope they find him in one piece. One of the old-school of explorers, stuck in the modern era breaking records.

Doug

sarongsong
04-September-2007, 07:40 PM
Mostly desert...a big mixture of mountains and flat areas....and Nevada has the largest percentage of military-controlled land area of all the States...

Nicolas
04-September-2007, 07:49 PM
Having military controlled area is a good thing when you're lost, unless it's a minefield. I hope he's alright and this is just one more amazing story on his list.

01101001
04-September-2007, 08:05 PM
Steve Fossett is not the only thing missing.

http://www.stevefossett.com/

HTTP 404 Not Found
The Webpage cannot be found

It probably got real busy.

As usual, Wikipedia is current:

Wikipedia: Steve Fossett (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Fossett):

Fossett was reported missing on September 3, 2007 after taking off in his single-engine Citabria Decathlon from a ranch in Nevada.

Larry Jacks
04-September-2007, 08:32 PM
Having military controlled area is a good thing when you're lost, unless it's a minefield.

It depends on whether the controlled airspace might hamper the search & rescue operations. I've read that over 80% of all the land in Nevada is owned by the federal government. Some of it is among the most restricted airspace in the country (e.g. Groom Lake). In the perhaps unlikely event that Fossett wandered into that airspace, it might present problems to the Civil Air Patrol and other searchers.

Nicolas
04-September-2007, 08:51 PM
Ah, that way. Well yes, you have a point there. But maybe, if the airspace is that restricted, the military were also able to track his craft.

Doodler
04-September-2007, 08:53 PM
Not good. Not good at all.

I'm not familiar with the Nevada desert, does the average surface there allow for succesful emergency landings?

I'm a little rusty on my geography, but southern Nevada is pretty much sand and more sand. Unless he was spectacularly unlucky and the plane fell apart in midair, he won't be hurting for safe parking.

Doodler
04-September-2007, 08:55 PM
Ah, that way. Well yes, you have a point there. But maybe, if the airspace is that restricted, the military were also able to track his craft.

Given that Fossett's a guy who's been around the block a few times, I'd have a LOT of difficulty believing he'd be anywhere near restricted airspace as a part of a normal flightplan.

01101001
04-September-2007, 09:48 PM
I'm a little rusty on my geography, but southern Nevada is pretty much sand and more sand.


Western Nevada is pretty rugged.

Google Map: Yerington, Neveda (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&sll=38.990904,-119.163208&sspn=0.23429,0.512238&ie=UTF8&ll=38.987168,-119.161835&spn=0.468603,1.024475&t=h&z=10&om=1)

CNN (http://edition.cnn.com/2007/US/09/04/fossett.missing/?imw=Y&iref=mpstoryemail)

Fossett took off in a single-engine plane from a private air strip known as Flying M Ranch, near Smith Valley, 30 miles south of Yerington, Nevada, on Monday, with enough fuel for four to five hours of flight, according to Civil Air Patrol Maj. Cynthia S. Ryan
[...]
Ryan said authorities are searching hundreds of miles of rugged terrain in western Nevada.

Van Rijn
04-September-2007, 10:01 PM
I'm a little rusty on my geography, but southern Nevada is pretty much sand and more sand. Unless he was spectacularly unlucky and the plane fell apart in midair, he won't be hurting for safe parking.

Getting down safe is one thing. Nevada is mostly empty, so getting found (when people don't have a good idea where to look) is another.

Larry Jacks
04-September-2007, 10:06 PM
News reports say that he didn't file a flight plan. Unless he told someone where he's going, the searchers don't have much to go on. Nevada is big, largely empty, and often very hot. Even if he landed safely, he'd need to be found fairly quickly or dehydration would become a big factor.

I have not heard any reports of his ELT (emergency location transmitter) going off. ELTs normally activate automatically on impact (or a hard landing - don't ask me how I know). If he went down in rough terrain, the ground could be blocking the ELT signals.

Fossett is a very good pilot who no doubt has had a lot of survival training. If anyone could have survived this, he could.

Swift
04-September-2007, 10:17 PM
Ah, that way. Well yes, you have a point there. But maybe, if the airspace is that restricted, the military were also able to track his craft.
From CNN
Ryan said authorities are analyzing information from radar intelligence to try to track Fossett.

Six search aircraft with three-man crews, coping with gusty winds, are taking part in the Nevada search. Helicopters and planes from Naval Air Station Fallon, in Fallon, Nevada, the Nevada Air National Guard and the California Highway Patrol are helping

I'm guessing that "radar intelligence" includes military tracking of their airspace.

01101001
05-September-2007, 12:59 AM
Associated Press (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5h4Tt3Ok0yMNfSsatpddlmScxyEiQ)

Teams searched a broad swath of rugged terrain in western Nevada near the ranch where he took off, but searchers had little to go on because he apparently didn't file a flight plan, a Federal Aviation Administration spokesman said.
[...]
The search area is varied, ranging from high desert terrain with dry lake beds and sagebrush, but also some rugged mountain peaks, she said. Gusty winds were hampering the search and could end up suspending the air search effort, Ryan said.
[...]
Branson said in a statement that Fossett's flight Monday was preparation for a shot at yet another mark: He was searching for dry lake beds that might be suitable for an attempt to break the land speed record in a car.

Let's hope he found a dry lake -- the walk-away-from way.

"Steve is a tough old boot. I suspect he is waiting by his plane right now for someone to pick him up," he said. "The ranch he took off from covers a huge area, and Steve has had far tougher challenges to overcome in the past. Based on his track record, I feel confident we'll get some good news soon."

sarongsong
05-September-2007, 01:51 AM
...I'm guessing that "radar intelligence" includes military tracking of their airspace....including "a Nevada Air National Guard C-130 equipped with heat-sensing devices", according to one of TV's Talking Heads (i.e. Nancy Grace).

NEOWatcher
05-September-2007, 05:50 PM
Now comments from Branson...
CNN: Branson fears missing Fossett is injured (http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/05/fossett.missing/index.html)
MSNBC: Rescuers hope grit, experience will aid Fossett (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20588788/)

First: notice the slight change in tone between the two?

Anyway, It's nice that they are getting comments from Billionaire friend Branson...but, I have one question for Branson... "How are you using your power and influence to aide in the search for your pal?"

The mention of the locator watch not being activated makes it sound not so good.

Then maybe there's the "he wanted to get lost" aspect of it, and Branson's in on it. :shhh:

Doodler
05-September-2007, 06:12 PM
The smartest thing Branson can do right now is stay the heck out of the way. The US has a pretty top shelf S&R capability, so the reality is, the only way he can really make much impact is if he wants to pick up part of the tab for the full court press that's underway.

NEOWatcher
05-September-2007, 06:19 PM
The smartest thing Branson can do right now is stay the heck out of the way. The US has a pretty top shelf S&R capability...
I can buy that, but it would be nice to hear him give the credit where credit is due. It would at least let us know the offer might be on the table.

Did the reporter even ask?

Larry Jacks
05-September-2007, 06:22 PM
The smartest thing Branson can do right now is stay the heck out of the way. The US has a pretty top shelf S&R capability, so the reality is, the only way he can really make much impact is if he wants to pick up part of the tab for the full court press that's underway.

Yeah, there isn't much Branson can do. One of his Virgin Atlantic 747s wouldn't exactly be an effective search platform. The Civil Air Patrol has decades of experience at search & rescue. Still, it's a big area. Every now and then, a plane that has been missing for years (even decades) is found.

Reports this morning indicate that Fossett's ELT isn't being detected. That makes me wonder if he went down in rough terrain where the signal could be blocked. ELTs can be manually activated but generally go off on impact. They're tough little transmitters so it takes a lot to put one out of commission.

schlaugh
05-September-2007, 07:54 PM
Other reasons why the ELT might not be detected:

- As said, it's in rough terrain and the signal is blocked

- The impact wasn't hard enough to activate it but Fossett is incapacitated and can't manually activate the signal.

- The ELT battery is dead (and someone missed a critical item during the last maintenance inspection)

- Impact was hard enough to knock the ELT out of commission - and Fossett as well.

- The ELT malfunctioned for some other reason

- Fossett doesn't want to be found

Basic info on ELTs from AOPA:
http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/regulatory/elt.html

Search and Rescue Satellite-aided tracking:
http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/

hhEb09'1
05-September-2007, 08:11 PM
Then maybe there's the "he wanted to get lost" aspect of it, and Branson's in on it. :shhh:I hadn't noticed that. What shape are the accounts in?

mugaliens
05-September-2007, 09:53 PM
Having military controlled area is a good thing when you're lost, unless it's a minefield.

It depends on whether the controlled airspace might hamper the search & rescue operations. I've read that over 80% of all the land in Nevada is owned by the federal government. Some of it is among the most restricted airspace in the country (e.g. Groom Lake). In the perhaps unlikely event that Fossett wandered into that airspace, it might present problems to the Civil Air Patrol and other searchers.

:doh:

If he'd wandered there, he would have been escorted to wherever he finally touched down, whether he had his aircraft under control or not.

sarongsong
05-September-2007, 11:46 PM
Don't some areas have a 'shoot first' policy?

davidlpf
06-September-2007, 12:04 AM
Don't some areas have a 'shoot first' policy?
at least the 51st area does.

Van Rijn
06-September-2007, 12:37 AM
It would be extremely hard to get to the most restricted area without picking up an escort, and nobody that has a clue would head that way in the first place. It's not going to be, "there's a plane crossing the line, shoot it down!"

schlaugh
06-September-2007, 12:54 AM
It would be extremely hard to get to the most restricted area without picking up an escort, and nobody that has a clue would head that way in the first place. It's not going to be, "there's a plane crossing the line, shoot it down!"

True. A potential exception might be if Fossett was incapacitated while at the controls and the plane kept flying uncommanded. The flip side of that POV: it's unlikely that the Citabria Super Decathlon he was flying had much of an autopilot so how far could it fly on its own before crashing? How stable could it be?

By now the Air Force (I would hope) would have reported shooting down a plane whose pilot refused to obey instructions near Groom Lake. Maybe.

sarongsong
06-September-2007, 03:14 AM
...if Fossett was incapacitated...Seems very likely...September 5, 2007
...Fossett was wearing a Breitling watch capable of emitting an emergency distress signal when manually activated, and he's [Branson] concerned that no signal has been sent...
AvWeb (http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/SteveFossettMissing_Search_196081-1.html)

NEOWatcher
06-September-2007, 01:05 PM
Ok; so Branson is trying (http://www.bautforum.com/1065009-post13.html) to do something. (Google Satellites)

CNN hasn't picked that up yet...they're probably still looking on the internet for Branson/Fosset facts instead of following the story.
Thank's to the Great North and Great Britain we actually hear something.

djellison
06-September-2007, 04:30 PM
The only thing that I can think of now is that for some reason he went straight into one of the nearby lakes. There's a few around - one fairly close to the airport is a good few miles in each direction. But even if that had happened, there would surely be some debris on the surface.

Doug

Argos
06-September-2007, 04:43 PM
Isn´t this incapacity to find him disturbing? I mean, people can really wander unnoticed on the Nevada desert?

Nicolas
06-September-2007, 04:57 PM
The Nevada desert tends to be large...

If he was anywhere the military REALLY didn't want you to be, they'd know he was there. As for the endless desert surrounding those places, I don't think the military consider the ability to spot a single person there as a high priority.

01101001
06-September-2007, 05:55 PM
Isn´t this incapacity to find him disturbing? I mean, people can really wander unnoticed on the Nevada desert?

Yeah. Recent news article said it would take up to a week (maybe 6 days now) to cover the possible range with 10 aircraft, about 600 square miles (1500 sq km), most of it sparsely populated.


Rescuers to probe lake as Fossett search enters fourth day (http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gTQCd4ZynKmFO3BssvRraEr_dPrQ)

The 63-year-old world record-breaker's plane disappeared over a vast expanse of rugged mountainous terrain covering some 600 square miles (155,000 hectares). Officials have compared the hunt for Fossett's plane as like "searching for a needle in a haystack."

Another story said 1700 square miles.

And they are searching that nearby lake:

While rescuers had no information to suggest that Fossett's light plane had crashed into Walker Lake, in Mineral County, Allen said officials wanted to take to the water "if only to rule it out."

tony873004
06-September-2007, 06:24 PM
600 sq miles is only 25x25 miles. (or 600x1, or...) , and 1700 is only about 40x40. I imagine the area they need to search is much larger than either of these figures. Your link claims he took off at 7am, while the other reports I read claim 8:30

01101001
06-September-2007, 06:40 PM
600 sq miles is only 25x25 miles. (or 600x1, or...) , and 1700 is only about 40x40. I imagine the area they need to search is much larger than either of these figures. Your link claims he took off at 7am, while the other reports I read claim 8:30

Maybe it's the area searched so far.

Forbes (http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/09/06/ap4089192.html)

The search across more than 1,700 square miles has covered only a fraction of the territory that could be hiding the plane. Finishing the fly-overs of the most likely landing spots could take another week.

How about 60000 sq miles?

Record-Courier (http://www.recordcourier.com/article/20070905/NEWS/70905006):

The search area includes 60,000 square miles of rugged territory ranging from the basin and range in the east to the Sierra in the west.

Or 7500, concentrating on 600.

Chicagoist (http://chicagoist.com/2007/09/05/chicago_adventu.php)

More than 10 planes have been conducting a grid search of over 7,500 square miles with a concentration on a 600-square-mile area.

Take your pick

===

Just for those unfamiliar with the emptiness of the state of Nevada: Wikipedia: Nevada Population Density Map (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Nevadapopulationdensity.png)

Lots of less-than-1-person/square-mile there.

sarongsong
07-September-2007, 12:09 AM
...CNN hasn't picked that up yet...they're probably still looking on the internet for Branson/Fosset facts instead of following the story...Oh, they're currently quite busy awaiting words from the other fellow that can't be found (since 2001)... :(

sarongsong
07-September-2007, 05:19 PM
Odd...September 4, 2007
...Fossett already had sought approval from the U.S. Bureau of Land Management to use a 15-mile-long playa in remote east-central Nevada...in Eureka County, about 225 miles east of Reno and 200 miles from where crews are searching for Fossett's plane...Civil Air Patrol Maj. Cynthia S. Ryan said authorities were told Fossett took off on Monday to scout sites he could use for testing. That puzzled [BLM spokesman Chris] Worthington.
"That was news to me because he already found this lake bed some time ago, unless he was looking for a backup later on,"...
San Jose Mercury News (http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_6801441?source=most_viewed)

01101001
08-September-2007, 12:53 AM
Who were all these other people that crashed?

Douglas County Record-Courier (http://www.recordcourier.com/article/20070907/NEWS/70907006):

The search for famed aviator Steve Fossett has turned up six previously undocumented crash sites around Nevada and California.
[...] Civil Air Patrol Maj. Cynthia Ryan said there are more than 150 crash sites logged in the search area.
“That we’re finding so many crash sites is an indication of the search we’re doing,” she said. “We’re putting the area under a microscope, so to speak.”
Ryan said investigating the old sites would have to wait until the search for Fossett is complete.
[...]
Ryan said about half of the 17,000 square mile search area has been gone over during the five days since Fossett flew [...]

About 8500 of 17000 square miles, for those collecting the estimates.

AFP: Fossett survival skills prompt hope as hunt enters fifth day (http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iM_k7XWQm8_pFbqKlACFnyXChd6A)

Rescuers hoped Friday that Steve Fossett's legendary survival skills would enable the aviator to hold out until he is found as the search for the missing adventurer entered its fifth day.

The 63-year-old veteran of several world record-breaking solo plane and balloon flights has not been heard from since taking off from a private airstrip 80 miles (130 km) southeast of Reno, Nevada, early Monday.

On Thursday officials expanded the area of remote, mountain terrain being searched to 10,000 square miles (25,900 square kilometers) -- an area nearly the size of the state of Massachusetts -- and have said the search for the airman is like "looking for a needle in a haystack."

10000 square miles being searched. Searched? To search?

Van Rijn
08-September-2007, 01:11 AM
Isn´t this incapacity to find him disturbing?


Sad, yes. Disturbing, no.


I mean, people can really wander unnoticed on the Nevada desert?

Oh, definitely. Years ago, there was a NOVA episode on the Bermuda triangle myth, and they compared the losses there to an area in the eastern U.S. with much higher population density - which also had more examples of planes that were never found than in the so-called triangle.

It isn't always easy to see someone, and a plane can cover a lot of area. We're only guessing where he might be, so it's a real needle in the haystack situation.

sarongsong
08-September-2007, 01:18 AM
...six previously undocumented crash sites around Nevada and California...more than 150 crash sites logged in the search area...Yikes!---beginning to look like The Bermuda Triangle West---without the water!

01101001
08-September-2007, 06:10 PM
No significant progress. Effort continues.

You Might Help Find Steve Fossett (http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/YouMightHelpFindSteveFossett_196093-1.html)

The search for Steve Fossett may get some potent help from above today, and you might be able to help. DigitalGlobe, which supplies many of the images from space for Google Earth, is expected to have fresh imagery of the search area today sometime and that might enable the activation of something called the Amazon Mechanical Turk. Essentially, as the images of the area are made available, anyone with a computer can conduct a pixel-by-pixel search for Fossett. The system is set up to allow masses of humans, able to differentiate objects (like airplane wreckage on a mountainside) and make judgment calls that computers don't do well.

Reno Gazette-Journal (http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070908/NEWS/709080333)

Allen said rescuers did not believe Fossett had packed more than a bottle of water and no food aboard his plane because he had planned a three-hour flight. However, several natural water sources in the area were searched, he said.

It could be weeks before Fossett is found.

"Searches of this nature -- typically, they can go on for as long as two weeks and longer," said Nevada Civil Air Patrol Maj. Cynthia Ryan. "We are still scratching the surface."

tony873004
08-September-2007, 08:16 PM
DigitalGlobe, which supplies many of the images from space for Google Earth, is expected to have fresh imagery of the search area today sometime
In Google Earth, how do you tell if the image is "fresh"? There are no dates on the images other than (c)2007.

I'm looking at Google Earth today, and comparing its image to the Google Earth image I posted in the "Finding Steve Fossett" thread. They're identical. You would expect a slightly different shading from a different light angle, or different seam areas, etc.

So it seems like they're encouraging us to look for Steve Fossett's plane using Google Earth images taken before he went missing???

It did say "today sometime", so maybe "sometime" hasn't arrived yet, but it would be nice if they were a little clearer on this issue. I want to scrutinize the area I highlighted in the "Finding Steve Fossett" thread.

Doodler
08-September-2007, 08:37 PM
Isn´t this incapacity to find him disturbing? I mean, people can really wander unnoticed on the Nevada desert?

An interesting aside, a woman was found a few days ago after being missing for 17 days. And this involved a stuck truck on a road.

Its stupendously easy to disappear in the wilderness, particularly if you don't know how to make yourself found, virtually impossible if you actively want to avoid being found (SEE: Unibomber)

frankuitaalst
08-September-2007, 09:36 PM
[QUOTE=01101001;1066547]No significant progress. Effort continues.

You Might Help Find Steve Fossett (http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/YouMightHelpFindSteveFossett_196093-1.html)


This site seems to work !
Beeing directed to amazon you get a series of pictures of the desert .
You are asked to note whether or not you detect something on this picture ( about 85*85 m ) from 1500 m . Nice . Then transmit your resukt for further processing . How big is Nevada ie how may pictures must be analysed ?

frankuitaalst
09-September-2007, 12:30 PM
Pictures to examine are 85m*85 m , as if they were taken from 1500ft .
I wonder if amazon mechanical turk can get enough men at work :
Supposing they offer the total Nevada state , covering about 300.000 km˛ and each person does 100 pictures then more then 400.000 people must get involved as 40*10e+6 pictures must be analysed . Really a hughe terrain !

01101001
10-September-2007, 01:10 AM
For those not sufficiently convinced of Nevada's emptiness:

AP: In Nevada, 'Open Space' Is a Way of Life (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i5NefqK8mBj3xLRYxomD1qlqhpeg)

From outside Nevada, it's hard to fully appreciate just how expansive, how desolate the truly wide open spaces of the state can be.

Against that vast emptiness, the search for aviator-adventurer Steve Fossett and his single-engine plane is a search for a needle in a whole county full of hay stacks.
[...]
"There's just very, very few human beings out there," said Guy Rocha, Nevada's state archivist.

So much of the state is so desolate that the Nevada Commission on Tourism urges visitors to carry plenty of water and gasoline when traveling to many of the destinations it lists. Cell phone coverage is spotty, and often nonexistent.

The area of western Nevada where the search for Fossett is concentrated is considered one of the state's most barren, relatively unchanged in more than a century.

"I don't think the general public watching on TV really has too much of an idea of just how rugged and remote this area is," Rocha said.

Last news I saw, about an hour ago: they found yet another undocumented wreck proved not to be Fossett's.

Maksutov
10-September-2007, 11:19 AM
I'm sure the CTs are conjuring up all sorts of stuff by now. One will probably claim that Fossett disappeared into a Crater. Judge for yourself.

BTW, it's not "The Bermuda Triangle". If you read the authoritative CT books on it, you will realize it's "The Bermuda Polygon".

Larry Jacks
10-September-2007, 02:24 PM
Last news I saw, about an hour ago: they found yet another undocumented wreck proved not to be Fossett's.

That should give people some idea of just how remote and rugged the search area really is. The searchers are finding wrecks that have been there for years (perhaps decades) that no one knew were there.

Serenitude
10-September-2007, 02:40 PM
Last news I saw, about an hour ago: they found yet another undocumented wreck proved not to be Fossett's.

That should give people some idea of just how remote and rugged the search area really is. The searchers are finding wrecks that have been there for years (perhaps decades) that no one knew were there.

It makes me think of the divide in resources given to the average person, possibly :(

Larry Jacks
10-September-2007, 07:43 PM
It makes me think of the divide in resources given to the average person, possibly

There some truth to that. Fossett is a world famous pilot so his disappearance results in a very large search (but not nearly as big as some others such as Amelia Erheart or John Kennedy, Jr.).

Doodler
10-September-2007, 09:20 PM
It makes me think of the divide in resources given to the average person, possibly :(

It could also be that they're the result of previous CAP searches which weren't successful. Typically, you give an active search a few days to a week, then you call it a failure and it goes into the cold case file.

Fossett's probably another week or so from the same cold file, himself.

sarongsong
10-September-2007, 11:06 PM
...BTW, it's not "The Bermuda Triangle". If you read the authoritative CT books on it, you will realize it's "The Bermuda Polygon".Tee-hee...authoritative CT books?...examples, please. :)
Google:
"The Bermuda Polygon" (http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&rls=en&q=%22The+Bermuda+Polygon%22&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8) = 7
"The Bermuda Triangle" (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=opera&rls=en&hs=fVB&q=%22The+Bermuda+Triangle%22&btnG=Search) = 480,000

KaiYeves
11-September-2007, 12:29 AM
authoritative CT books?

An oxymoron if I ever heard one. I read the most terrible woo-woo book about the Triangle (Sorry, my paranormal investigator side just has to say it that way) a few months ago. Aliens, ancient airships, sea monsters and more. Lots of kinda grainy black and white photographs. I think it was from the '70s or something. Absolutely no objective thinking or letting the other side talk. But I was in an unpleasent grammar class and needed some escapism. 'Don't think I believed it for more than a few minutes, but it did give me a few nightmares.

01101001
16-February-2008, 06:06 PM
Officially Dead

AP: Fossett Remembered for Daredevil Spirit (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gDuKsPXpMfOO6UIIbOe2yiGISUwwD8URDDL00)

Self-made business tycoon Steve Fossett, whose thirst for adrenaline drove him to fly around the world solo in a balloon, climb mountains and aim for speed records, has been declared dead, 5 months after his small plane vanished. He was 63.

Fossett, who in 2002 became the first person to circle the world solo in a balloon, was known for his methodical pursuit of pushing endurance envelopes, including swimming the English Channel, completing the Ironman Triathlon and competing in the Iditarod dog sled race.

"Steve's lived his life to the full, and he hasn't wasted a minute of his life," his rival-turned-comrade, British billionaire Sir Richard Branson, said after Fossett's single-engine plane disappeared on Sept. 3. "Everything he's done, he's taken a calculated risk with."

01101001
15-July-2008, 05:25 AM
AFP: Private search for Steve Fossett underway in Nevada (http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5jAUa7FcqJAbzagx3ILjq0ySxjprQ)

The first of two searches for millionaire adventurer Steve Fossett got underway on the Nevada-California border on Monday, nearly one year after the aviator's mysterious disappearance.
[...]
His group, made up of experts in aviation, hiking, mountains and climbing, has no fixed timetable for the length of the search.

Hyman, an investor who has led expeditions at Mount Everest and throughout Central America, said finding Fossett could be crucial to understanding why last year's search-and-rescue efforts failed.

"They really brought it all out, so why didn't they find him?" Hyman said. "The answer must be that he can't be seen from the air. What's blocking the eyes in the sky? He's probably under rocks, under a ledge.

"We just want to find Steve and we want to help with the methodology with search and rescue."

KaiYeves
15-July-2008, 09:21 PM
The Marvel Adventures Iron Man origin story reminded me very much of Steve Fossett's disapearance, but I'm not sure when the comic was written, so I don't know if it's intentional or just me.