Beginner scope for sats

[stargazer123]

Yet another ad nauseum thread, right?

I'm actually not that interested in viewing planets. I'm more interested in man-made objects, namely satellites. I'd say my price limit is around $300, but could go a bit higher if that's gonna be way too low.

[RickJ]

Seeing satellites by eye in a scope and seeing detail requires computer controlled mount and knowing the orbital elements to program into it. Cost of this is FAR beyond your price point. Add a zero for everything and you'd have a very basic system. Inexpensive ones don't have this ability that I am aware.

Best to just watch them with the naked eye or binoculars. I've seen as many as 49 in one hour using binocular of which 11 were rather easy naked eye objects. But you do need a very dark, light pollution free, moonless sky to see that many. That was my record about 20 years ago during a meteor shower. Two of us were watching for the satellites (no Heaven's Above or other prediction source back then) and he'd find some and I'd find some. Since we knew the sky well it was easy for us to tell the other where to look. Working alone I'd not see that many, probably 60% were discovered by each of us individually.

While I've had as many as 8 nights in a row in which satellites zipped through my telescope's field of view when observing visually this is rare. None were predicted and I couldn't begin to try to follow them, they move way too fast. I just note it and go on. They appear as dimensionless points of light that zip through the field in one a few seconds if using low power. At high power they are gone in one second or so. Way too fast to react to. This is why you have to have that computer mount to see anything visually. With a web cam in an 8" or larger scope you can let it run as you try and track the ISS with a second finder scope with a reticle. If taking at high speed, say 1/500th second you will catch it on a few frames as it bounces around in the FOV. Most will be useless. Visually you'd likely see little. At least that's been my experience.

Rick

[winensky]

Welcome and no, we all started learning at some point and there are many on this forum who feel that helping out newcommers is one of the most rewarding aspects of astronomy.

Now, by "sats" I assume you mean Satellites. If this is the case you have jumped into one of the most technically demanding areas of astronomy in terms of tracking, and the telescope mounts and software required would cost many times your stated budget. Do not be disheartened. I have two other questions which bear on your decision.

Do you have other observational interests; planetary, lunar, deep space, (meaning nebulae or galaxies)? If so, how much of your observing would be satellites and how much other targets? If your answer is Everything! then a good pair of binoculars may well serve as they have the flexibility to follow satellites by hand but also provide for good observing of the moon and some clusters and nebulae when utilizing a tripod. They will also let you observe the movements of Jupiters four largest moons.

The second question:

Do you have a local astronomy club or interest group? If so, contact them and they will surely invite you to a few nights of observing which will give you a feel for what equipment is available, its cost and dare I say where your real interests lie. The members of the club will be able to discern your level of experience and so guide you to the equipment best suited to your needs.

You probably already have the links for the ISS and Irridium flares sites. If not type these into GOOGLE and they will provide times and coordinates for your location.

God luck, I know this has probably raise more questions than provided answers. I am sure that others more experienced than I will join in and offer sound advice. Clear Skys.

[stargazer123]

I figured tracking orbiting objects would be out of my price range. Oh well, had to ask.

So change the focus to lunar and planetary, and add the ability to use it for the odd STS/ELV launch. What would the recommendation be then?

Is it a good idea to get a computerized scope for a first?

[thoth II]

I'd just start with what music junkie did thread:

http://www.bautforum.com/astronomical-observing-equipment-accessories/88282-beginner-questions.html:// (http://www.bautforum.com/astronomical-observing-equipment-accessories/88282-beginner-questions.html)

you could sure get a good 6 or 8 inch dobsonian for that money, and they're great for beginners.

Because LEO satellites are moving fast, they should be viewed by beginners under low power (because the higher the power, the faster they move without precise tracking equipment) ; so naked eye and binoc is probably best. Same with STS launch.

[stargazer123]

I actually have a pair of cheap 10-30x60 binocs for STS/ELV launches. I just just hoping to follow it once it performs SRB separation.

[thoth II]

I actually have a pair of cheap 10-30x60 binocs for STS/ELV launches. I just just hoping to follow it once it performs SRB separation.

It is moving very fast under magnification of telescope, so I know I couldn't do it with a telescope myself. And after SRB, it's always too faint for me to see with binocs. I've only followed STS up to the SRB separation point with binocs.

It'll take some fancy equipment and experience to follow it.

[stargazer123]

Alright then forget the STS/ELV for now. I'll just use my binocs for that. I'll concentrate on planetary, lunar, and some light star viewing.

What's so great about a Dobsonian? I see them recommended a lot.

[schlaugh]

What's so great about a Dobsonian? I see them recommended a lot.

Dobs (http://www.vikdhillon.staff.shef.ac.uk/teaching/phy105/telescopes/dob.jpg)are very easy to use, easy to aim, and relatively low cost. The bulk of your money goes toward optics an that's a good thing. You can almost always upgrade to an equatorial (http://www.telescopesandbinoculars.co.uk/acatalog/eq6mount.gif)mount later.

The trade off is that you can't use dobs for long-exposure photography because a dob cannot slew to counteract the Earth's rotation to keep an object in view; that requires a motorized drive and almost always an equatorial mount.

[JustAFriend]

If you don't need goto, this is in your price range and a nice little scope:

My C-130 on a cheap pipe mount (http://www.bautforum.com/astronomical-observing-equipment-accessories/84246-cheap-diy-german-pipe-mount.html)

[stargazer123]

Dobs (http://www.vikdhillon.staff.shef.ac.uk/teaching/phy105/telescopes/dob.jpg)are very easy to use, easy to aim, and relatively low cost. The bulk of your money goes toward optics an that's a good thing. You can almost always upgrade to an equatorial (http://www.telescopesandbinoculars.co.uk/acatalog/eq6mount.gif)mount later.

The trade off is that you can't use dobs for long-exposure photography because a dob cannot slew to counteract the Earth's rotation to keep an object in view; that requires a motorized drive and almost always an equatorial mount.

I don't plan to do any astrophotography.

Is GoTo that big a deal?

[stargazer123]

I don't plan to do any astrophotography.

What's a good brand for a Dob?

Is GoTo that big a deal?

[schlaugh]

What's a good brand for a Dob?

I have an Orion XT-10 which means it's a 10-inch mirror. But you DON'T need to go that big if just getting started. Check out this site (http://www.scopereviews.com/list.html)for some scope reviews by real-world folks, albeit dated.

Better yet, try to find a star party as mentioned by winensky. You can test drive a range of scopes and it'll correctly set your expectations about what you can realistically observe with various scopes (e.g. reflectors vs. refractors) and magnification.

GoTo is useful but not recommended as an initial investment. For $300-ish you'd be better off buying a small Dob or even a very good set of binocs.

[stargazer123]

I realize I'm not gonna be able to see all that much with an entry level scope. I have a lot of hobbies right now and need to trim back, so this would just be a small thing.

[hhEb09'1]

I realize I'm not gonna be able to see all that much with an entry level scope. I have a lot of hobbies right now and need to trim back, so this would just be a small thing.I just purchased this scope (http://www.bautforum.com/astronomical-observing-equipment-accessories/87909-skywatcher-maksutov.html#post1482717), I'll let you know when we get it. :)

[thoth II]

I realize I'm not gonna be able to see all that much with an entry level scope. I have a lot of hobbies right now and need to trim back, so this would just be a small thing.

For the $300 you could get a good 6 or 8 inch dob. You really can see a great amount of stuff with even that if you use it regularly over next 5 years. I myself have used a 6 inch Dob over last 10 years and have seen a lot of stuff.
So these 6 inch dobs are definitely not just cheap toys.

[NickW]

300 bucks for a 6 inch dob is not a bad investing and is a great entry level scope (in my opinion).

If you dont want to spend that much, you can get a decent set of binocs for about 50 bucks and probably get a lot of pleasure out of that as well.

[MrObvious]

I just purchased this scope (http://www.bautforum.com/astronomical-observing-equipment-accessories/87909-skywatcher-maksutov.html#post1482717), I'll let you know when we get it. :)


I had one a few years back. Lovely scope but the baffling was not the best so viewing when near bright objects such as the moon and sometimes even a very bright star lowered contrast and was distracting.

The mount that came with mine was very cheaply made. It wobbled like crazy.
If you put a green laser on it and bumped it you could have your own light show for a few tens of seconds.

But optically it was great.
Sharp as a tack and no chromatic problems.

Best use is for separating doubles, it did that really well considering its size and cost.
I saw mars and the ice on one pole while I had it, Jupiter and Saturn, mind blowing for someone that had never seen such things so big and clear before. It was my first scope. I'd mention big is the size of a pea at a distance but it was a really clear and sharp view.

Best upgrade is to get a better eyepieces of semi reasonable quality. No need to go expensive as that defeats the point of the scope. I had a 40mm Plossl which was fantastic. But for the Planets I wanted something with a bit more reach. I upgraded the telescope before I managed to get any better quality ones however.
The views from the 40mm at m42 were stunning at a dark site.

[mugaliens]

Or one could always peek out the window of the ISS...

...if one were ever that lucky!