Chatroom
 

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Forum > Space and Astronomy > Astronomy
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

   

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 31-December-2004, 12:25 PM
Cosmojoe Cosmojoe is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 9
Default UNIVERSAL CONFUSION

A couple of things I'd like to see what other people think about:


Our universe is supposidly ever expanding...exactly what is it expanding into? I always pictured it expanding into some sort of static void or just some white noise. Anyone else have theories about this?

If there was a big bang, it obviously happened in "space." Where was this entitiy that exploded? space? Where did this space come from in the first place?

I also believe we live in a giant atom. Look at it all....

Nucleus=Sun
Planets=electrons

We're just a part of a grand scheme of collective galactic infrastructure that equals a greater whole than we can imagine......
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 31-December-2004, 01:11 PM
Kaptain K's Avatar
Kaptain K Kaptain K is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Elgin, Tx
Posts: 7,589
Default Re: UNIVERSAL CONFUSION

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmojoe
A couple of things I'd like to see what other people think about:


Our universe is supposidly ever expanding...exactly what is it expanding into? I always pictured it expanding into some sort of static void or just some white noise. Anyone else have theories about this?
The universe does not "require" anything to expand into.

Quote:
If there was a big bang, it obviously happened in "space."
The big bang did not happen in space. The big bang created space.
Quote:
Where was this entitiy that exploded? space? Where did this space come from in the first place?
See above. There was no space before the big bang. The big bang was the creation of space-time (there was no "before the big bang", either)

Quote:
I also believe we live in a giant atom. Look at it all...

Nucleus=Sun
Planets=electrons
Events on the atomic scale are not classical mechanics. They are quantum mechanics. Electrons do not "orbit" the nucleus like planets orbit stars. They exist in a probability cloud that defines where might be found at any given time.

Quote:
We're just a part of a grand scheme of collective galactic infrastructure that equals a greater whole than we can imagine......
__________________
Any day you wake up on "the right side of the dirt" is a good day.

T. Anderson
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 31-December-2004, 02:51 PM
Ut Ut is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Sydney, NS
Posts: 2,506
Default Re: UNIVERSAL CONFUSION

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmojoe
A couple of things I'd like to see what other people think about:


Our universe is supposidly ever expanding...
That is one interpretation of GR, and just so happens to be one which seems to have observational evidence, yes.

Quote:
exactly what is it expanding into? I always pictured it expanding into some sort of static void or just some white noise.
If this were the case, the static void or "white noise" would, by its nature of existance, would also be a part of the universe. At least if you define the universe as "everything that exists". Which most of us do.

Quote:
Anyone else have theories about this?
Nope. Such speculation does not fall into the realm of theory since, even if taking a more limited definition of universe as being everything that can ever be observed, we can never observe "outside" of the universe and therefore can never have any knowledge about what lies without.


Quote:
If there was a big bang, it obviously happened in "space."
Why is this obvious?

Quote:
Where was this entitiy that exploded?
The big bang wasn't an explosion. Not in the sense you're almost certainly thinking of. Rather, the big bang was a rapid expansion of space.

Quote:
space?
No. It was space.

Quote:
Where did this space come from in the first place?
It was created in the big bang. It continues to be created as the universe continues to expand.

Quote:
I also believe we live in a giant atom. Look at it all....
You're free to hold whatever beliefs you wish. Understand, though, that beliefs have no bearing on reality.

Quote:
Nucleus=Sun
Planets=electrons
For instance, this analogy. An atomic nucleus has one proton for every electron the element contains. It also contains a slew of neutrons to hold the nucleus together. Each proton and neutron is comprised of three quarks. No such analogy is seen in the sun. The sun is made up of an obscene number of hydrogen and helium ions.

It breaks down further, too. Every electron is said to be intrinsically indistinguishable from any other. You can look at Jupiter and tell it's not Mars.

Also, despite what your grade 9 physics book may have shown you, the Bhor model of the atoms with cute little orbits doesn't exist. I suggest you take a gander at this for the real picture. Electrons exist in clouds around the nucleus -- that is to say, the actual position of any electron within its orbital is ambiguous until it is actually observed. A single electron could quite literally be anywhere between the nucleus and Pluto.

Quote:
We're just a part of a grand scheme of collective galactic infrastructure that equals a greater whole than we can imagine......
And yet here you are, imagining it... Impressive.
__________________
"I'm making wheatloaf. It's like meatloaf, only with wheat"
"Isn't that just...bread?"
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 01-January-2005, 09:39 PM
iron4's Avatar
iron4 iron4 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 272
Default

Quote:
Where did this space come from in the first place?
I like a theory called Loop Quantum Gravity, and its cosmological branch, Loop Quantum Cosmology. In this theory, spacetime was contracting before the Big Bang, and after Big Bang it expanded
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 10:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.0.0
©  2006 Bad Astronomy and Universe Today