I don't know if this has been discussed before: can somebody tell me what kind of adhesive tape was used on the Apollo missions?
After bringing up the usual stuff like "why do you hear no engine noise in the LM" etc., my opponent on one of the German debunking boards claims that there was no synthetic at that time that could withstand the conditions on the lunar surface.

TIA

Martina

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German Clavius Translation Team

No idea if it's what they used on the lunar surface (or if any tape was used at all), but duck tape (or duct tape, if you prefer) was originally used in WW2. I'm not sure what conditions on the lunar surface he was referring to, but a good old nylon flag didn't seem to have much trouble, so I'm not quite sure what he's arguing, or why tape in particular would be an issue.

Here's a link: http://www.pstc.org/technical_notes/...p?subject=duct

Thanks for the link - I thought of duct tape (the German army is still using the olive colored stuff known as "Panzerband"), but there are so many types of it.
It's the temperatures. We've been all the way through explaining the difference between convection, conduction, and radiation. I just checked back and here we go again #-o
Ah! Nylon is a good hint! He claims that there was no synthetic that would not crumble in the shadows or melt in the sun. *sigh* I even sent him to the freshly translated "environment/heat" Clavius section and he did not understand how heat transfer works. Guess we'll have to wait until the heat transfer primer page is done.

Martina

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German Clavius Translation Team

Sure the materials might crumble, but when?

They only needed to last long enough for the mission plus a safety margin, not forever.

The flags are surely dust by now.

That was the first thing I told him. He chose to ignore it.

The second thing I told him was that the temperature of the lunar surface is irrellevant. They did not use the tape to fix the moon.

Martina

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German Clavius Translation Team

But that's why there wasn't any dust on the lander struts, because they had to tape it to the moon to stop the LM floating away due to the low gravity.

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Hadn't thought of that
Are you interested in co-authoring a book or videotape about it?

Never mind, we're back to termodynamics 101 at the other board.
If that guy was successful in convincing my fridge and oven of his ideas, they would stop working in an instant.

Martina

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German Clavius Translation Team

I don't know much about tape, but there are certainly many elastomers that can handle the temperatures on the moon. Here is a list of some of them. These ranges are normal "operating temperatures", which include a safety margin, and are typical for industrial applications. The temperatures during lunar night are well below the operating ranges of these elastomers, but by the time night fell on the landing sites the synthetics had already done their job, so who cares. They can definitely handle the heat. Many of these have been around since well before Apollo. For instance, Neoprene was developed in 1931 and Buna was developed by the Germans just before World War II. Hypalon, which is good from -50 to 300 degrees F, was developed in the early 1950s.

Nylon is a thermoplastic, not an elastomer, and was invented in 1935. Here are some of its properties:

This Web page includes properties of some other plastics.

Was duct tape was actually used on the lunar surface (as opposed to the temperature controlled environments of the LM & CM)?

( #-o edited due to sieve-like memory - I just remembered Gene Cernan's fender repair job on the LRV on A-17.)

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Looks like duct tape to me.

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I don't know. They can fly a ship to the moon, but they can't drive the rover without pranging it? :roll:

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Howling from the Shadows

It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. --- JayUtah

You can't reason an irrational person out of an irrational belief. --- Noclevername

Apollo: The History and the Hoax
Enter the World of Athran

You must admit it did look a lot better and much more stylish with all that custom Alabama chrome. :wink:

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Don't forget that duct tape was designed for sealing ducts, which are used in heating and cooling systems. Thus duct tape can function in a pretty broad range of temperatures and is usually rating up to about 200 degrees F.

Duct tape is used for ducts! Wow, there's a radical idea. And I thought is was just used to patch cars, remove warts, fix tents, make prom dresses....

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Didn't the commanders on the last three missions each manage to damage the fenders of the rover? I'm sure that was all planned by the evil conspiracists. They never would have guessed anyone would be smart enough to figure out duct tape wouldn't work on the moon.

According to Idea Finder, duct tape originated as a water proof tape manufactured for the army in WWII and commonly called duck tape, because it was made with cotton duck fabric. It was later called duct tape because of its later use as a duct sealing tape. Though anyone that has used it knows that the stuff is a poor duct sealer because the adhesive degrades over time, especially with high heat. Though this may be more of a problem in the sunny south where our attic temperatures can be over 120 degrees on a warm summer afternoon.

Edited to correct typo

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I was aware that the tape was used widely during WWII but I did not realize it was originally manufactured for the army. I thought "duck" tape was just a common mispronunciation. Nonetheless, it has been called "duct" tape and has been marketed as a duct sealer for as long as I can remember. I agree the adhesive degrades with time, but for the few days on the Moon I believe it would hold up pretty good.

300MPH tape...or missile tape as it's called in industry. It's basically duct tape on steroids, I think you can buy it at some specialty hardware stores. NASCAR uses it. It looks like an olive-drab version of duct-tape.

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