We are all familiar with these names:

Bill Kaysing, Bart Sibrel, David Percy, Ralph Rene ....

But, raise your hands, how many of you have heard about .. Wayne Green ... ???

He has a website at:

http://www.waynegreen.com

.. and he has written a 56-page book entitled "Moondoggie" about The Moon Hoax.

On the front page of his website, he writes in an October 30, 2001 essay:

"I've been writing about NASA faking the Moon landings. I agree, we've been sold a great bill of goods. We saw and believed what we were seeing and being told. Heck, we wanted to believe. We all wanted so much to believe in America's great achievement that the voices of the few skeptics were drowned out. When René sent me a copy of his NASA Mooned America, which was obviously a self-published book, I laughed at the whole idea. I get a lot of conspiracy-theory books like that—full of speculation and short on reliable references. Short on facts.

But René was citing facts and he had clear color NASA photos which, once I looked at them critically, backed up René.

Since then I've read every book and viewed every video on the subject, plus I've written about what I've found, always asking if anyone had facts which would refute the growing mountain of evidence of a hoax. Instead, I got letters and calls from more whistle-blowers."

In an October 21, 2001 entry, he writes:

"Well, not totally. I've gotten some comforting thank-yous from people whose lives I've changed and that makes it all worth while.

One of them was just featured in an article in Business 2.0, making me proud of him. He's become a leader in the security field. He's the same chap, by the way, who while working at NASA, accidentally found computer tapes which proved they'd faked the whole Apollo 11 Moon Landing trip."

Now on to his book, "Moondoggie".

At http://www.waynegreen.com/wayne/waynesays.html, Mr. Wayne Green writes:

"Moondoggle — $5

My wife Sherry recently signed up for a video production class at nearby Keene State College. The course naturally entailed her having to produce a short video. Instead of doing one on how to wash your sox or something like that, she decided to tackle the NASA Moon landing controversy.
She got every photo, video, and book she could find about the Apollo Moon missions. She read René’s book, NASA Mooned America, Bill Kaysing’s book, We Never Went To The Moon, and Bill Brian’s Moongate. She read the autobiographies of the astronauts. I helped her by going through the three Moon books and making a list of the reasons why it looks to me as if the missions had to have been faked.
Sherry did a nice job of exposing some of the more obvious fakery in her "Moongate" short — which got her an A for the course. But this got me busy writing about each of the 45 key reasons that convinced me that NASA had to have faked the whole show. The result is a 56-page booklet which I have seriously underpriced at $5. It’s called Moondoggle. If you want to be outrageous and really upset the believers in the feat of the century, arm yourself with the booklet.
Yes, I know, the whole idea that something as important to our country as the Moon landings could have been faked is so ridiculous that almost anyone’s first reaction is that you are crazy to even suggest such a thing. Unfortunately, I don’t believe this will turn out to be the biggest government hoax of the century, but it sure will at least be the second biggest. You’ll get many times your five dollars worth of fun when you arm yourself with the information in this booklet. You may even want to get some extra copies to upset your true believer friends."

So ... all in all ... this is where to go, if you want to visit Mr. Wayne Green:

http://www.waynegreen.com
(for the front page with the October 2001 entries)

http://www.waynegreen.com/wayne/waynesays.html
(for Wayne Green´s Moon Hoax book, "Moondoggie", with - as he puts it - "the 45 key reasons that convinced me that NASA had to have faked the whole show.")


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Vacuum on 2002-06-24 20:08 ]</font>

I guess all the good moon hoax titles were already taken.

Let's avoid the Christmas rush and start hating him now.
(just joking BA)

I think it's safe to say that nobody here will fork out the money to by that "book". I see no indication that this guy has anything new to add to the debate.

BTW, Vac, welcome to the board. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img]

Why don't you invite this guy over here? We'll be happy to give him the real story.

BTW, where is Jay when you need him? This will be quite a treat for him. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_razz.gif[/img]

__________________
~AstroMike

To heck with "Moondoggle", I'm going to shell out my 10 bucks for "The Bioelectrifier (Blood Purifier)". It's guaranteed to wipe out every virus, fungus, microbe and yeast in your bloodstream.

Uhhh, on second thought, maybe I'll pass.

If you look at all the selections, this person or company puts out a wide variety of guides and stuff appealing to a wide range of interests. Moondoggle appears to be trying to cash in on the HB's gullibility with, as was pointed above, no new "evidence".

This is my self admitted ignorant opinion as I do not plan on purchasing this book.

TT

Off topic, but....
Including all the benificial ones that help keep you alive?

So the Moon landings are just the second-biggest government hoax of the century?

Any nominations for what he thinks is the biggest?

Here's mine: I bet he thinks nuclear weapons don't work. Hiroshima and Nagasaki and all the tests in the Pacific were hoaxed.

Simon Wrote:
Off topic, but....
Including all the benificial ones that help keep you alive?

That's the way the description read. It said "all". It went on to say that once all these "impurities" are gone, the immune system can fight virtually anything including "AIDS and the bubonic plague".

Apologies for getting off topic, but I was using it as an example to show what else he was involved in and take a guess at his credibility.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Thumper on 2002-06-25 12:18 ]</font>

Well if he's referring to blood organisms only, blood SHOULD be sterile. When you refer to normal helpful flora, its mostly gastrointestinal tract and skin. Still sounds crackpot to me though.

Agreed...

You may noticed on this page, NASA has a listing for Kaysing's book:

Kaysing, Bill and Reid, Randy. We Never Went to the Moon: America's 30 Billion Dollar Swindle. Cornville, AZ: Desert Publications, 1981. This curious and cheaply-put-together compilation concludes without documentation or real evidence that "THE TRIP TO THE MOON WAS A HOAX"--to use the typography as well as the words in the authors' conclusions. Hardly definitive!

__________________
~AstroMike

I like these quotes from the Moondoggie blurb...

I don't even want to ask...

Dang it... THEY always have all the fun...

__________________
"Ignorance has caused more calamity than malignity" H.G. Wells

"Getting lost is part of exploring." Uniqua in "Backyardigans-Heart of the Jungle"

"Trying to wrap my head around creationist astronomy is like trying to ride a unicycle around a Moebius strip: it’s off-balance, physically impossible, full of one-sided arguments, and in the end you don’t go anywhere." Phil Plait

"You may noticed on this page, NASA has a listing for Kaysing's book."

You may have also noticed that they describe William Brian's book thusly:

"Brian, William L., II. Moongate: Suppressed Findings of the U.S. Space Program, the NASA-Military Cover-up. Portland, OR: Future Science Research Pub. Co., 1982. As the title suggests, this is a sensationalistic expos‚ arguing that "the true circumstances surrounding the Apollo missions and related discoveries were carefully suppressed from the public." The author claims that far from NASA's space program being a civilian effort as advertised, "the military had almost complete control over it and...many NASA findings were withheld from the public." The title of Chapter 10, "Evidence of Extraterrestrial Interference in the Space Program," will suggest the highly speculative and tenuous tenor of the book, much of which is quite technical, to boot. Lightly footnoted with references alike to scholarly sources and The National Enquirer, the work should be consulted with great caution by those without a solid grounding in space history and technology."

Actually, Donnie, I like that one! In fact, if I had the time right now to develop a web page of mine own, I'd do that one up. A proper send-up of a government conspiracy page.

After all, the conventional firebombing of Tokyo did more damage than whatever little firecrackers that they dropped on Hiroshima or Nagasaki, so those couldn't have been any massively destructive atomic bombs. And the Enola Gay certainly didn't have enough shielding to survive the radioactive fallout, nor engines powerful enough to get away in time. And besides, there aren't any stars in the photo backgrounds....oops, how'd that slip in there?

The (oh well, I'd think it through if I had time) Curtmudgeon

Growing mountain of evidence of a hoax? More like a growing mountain of evidence of ignorance.

But the question have any of these people have given you their full names, documentation, visual or audio evidence? How can you be sure they're not impostors trying to lend you a hand.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they were no computer tapes. I think they recorded the data onto telemetry tapes.

Doubt it. Then how come she and you can't see that these people clearly haven't done their research.

LOL! She probably got an F instead.

No thank you. I wouldn't waste my money on such psuedo-scientific, propaganda garbage anyway. And quite frankly, I wouldn't want to be in your shoes, since they are too many scientists, engineers (like Jay), and photographers who aren't fooled by this pseudoscience.

__________________
~AstroMike

How about Charles A. Lindbergh's 1927 solo, non-stop flight across the Atlantic? A Lindbergh impostor (unknown twin?) could have taken off from Roosevelt Field and flown to some remote Canadian airfield (where the plane would be destroyed along with the blueprints). At the "right time," the real Lindbergh could have taken off from some remote Scottish or Icelandic airfield in an identical Spirit of St. Louis, buzzed the Irish, and impressed the arrogant French by landing in their country (after skillfully avoiding the instantly lethal Maginot Line). [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

Edit: Well, it's probably not technically a government hoax, but Lindbergh did received military aviation instruction:

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Alan G. Archer on 2002-06-25 20:03 ]</font>

Curt (what should I put in here?) Mudgeon,

I'd love to take credit for it, but in fact there have been a few doubters about nuclear weapons. One claimed that Hiroshima was attacked by igniting phosphorus in midair, and the whole idea of nuclear weapons was a bluff to keep the Russians in line.

There have also been fictional works based around the concept -- one had a title like "The Trinity Factor" or some such. The idea was that although nuclear fission worked in reactors, when they tried to detonate the first implosion bomb at Alamogordo, it fizzled... as did every subsequent attempt. It seems that something was stepping in to suppress the supercritical chain reaction.

Alas, I'm afraid that (for good or ill) those darn nukes really do go boom.

It just dawned on me... maybe the "biggest government hoax" was the JFK assassination. Oh, darn, that would be boring -- don't conspiracists have to take an oath that they believe JFK was killed by the CIA, or something? Otherwise you can't join the club and get the official decoder ring...

Well, since the NASA astronauts were all military test pilots, I guess it all hangs together!

By the way, Neil Armstrong had resigned, and was (officially) a civilian, at the time of Apollo 11. Just for you trivia buffs... [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

The book was called "The Jesus Factor". I read it back in the '70s. The premise was that fission bombs worked, but only when they were standing still- some unknown factor caused the reaction to fizzle if the bomb was in motion, Hiroshima and Nagasaki were faked and the world's nuclear powers had spent three decades maintaining the fiction that their deterrents worked, for reasons which I can't remember due to the amount of weed I smoked back then.

It had a few neat little plot devices (the clandestine film of Truman telling Stalin "after we spent all that money the damned thing didn't work" was kind of nifty), the requisite amount of paperback-novel sex and was generally a better rainy-day read than our modern conspirabuffs provide.

As for the JFK assassination- of course that's the leading candidate for "greatest gummint hoax", by which I mean that the assassination itself was a hoax. Remember the UFo that snatched Elvis? Who do you think was driving it?

Minor nitpick: The Maginot Line was to protect France from the Germans and so was between France and Germany and so was in the east of France. Approaching from the west, Lindbergh had not to cross the Maginot Line to enter France.

Harald

Cher Monsieur, celui est absolument vrai.

The Maginot Line was still in the planning phase when Lindbergh made his historic flight.

I was being silly.

He probably thinks the Holocaust is a hoax if he dumb emough to buy into Ralph Rene's load of crap ("The Last Skeptic of Science").

__________________
~AstroMike

I'd like to see his wife's little movie showing how it was all done. My guess is it doesn't exist - you know, the dog ate it, or the instructor didn't return it - other than in his mind. But if it does exist, I'd rather pay the five bucks for that than for his booklet. I need a few laughs, and I suspect the booklet is the same old tiresome stuff. An amateur video though. . . .

Uh-oh, here come the hoax debunkers already!

As everyone now knows, the Maginot Line was never where it was claimed to be nor when. What's the point of telling the enemy where and when your impregnable defense will be deployed. Although it would seem to make sense to put it between Germany and France, the French knew that that's what the Germans would expect, so they put it along the northwest coast facing England.
So Lindbergh actually did fly over the Maginot Line during his staged flight.
Ooh this hoax stuff is fun! [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

Well, duh! What do you think happened to Glenn Miller??

CJSF

__________________
Two years ago moved from my town
I was looking up past the city lights
But the city lights got in my way

See the constellation ride across the sky
No cigar, no lady on his arm
Just a guy made of dots and lines

-from "See The Constellation"
by They Might Be Giants

My wife made a film short that exposes the whole Glenn Miller hoax. He got tired of the big band life and sneaked off incognito to Ottawa where he ended up playing backup sax for Paul Anka on his first big hit, "Diana".

Miller now lives in relative obscurity in a two room shack on Glenn Miller Road near Belleville, Ontario, Canada, his thinking being that the clue is so obvious no-one will notice. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Christopher Ferro: Well, duh! What do you think happened to Glenn Miller?

An interesting story, that. As far as I can remember, the original claim was that a couple of French women recognised him, quitely followed him, and watched as he sneaked into a brothel. Then, when his death was announced over the wireless the following day, they came to the conclusion that he had suffered a heart-attack while, er, you know, pleasuring himself. But the official story was that he never actually made it across the English channel, and his plane went unaccounted for.

Interestingly, when I watched a Channel 4 documentary on this subject, an ex FBI agent—and avid Glenn Miller fan—claimed the conspiracy theory was in fact that his "face had been ripped off" by German secret service agents, and his body set alight! Seriously. I immediately thought he was using the tried and tested technique of mucking-the-water, just to divert serious people away from asking serious questions.

Surely you are not serious?

CJSF

__________________
Two years ago moved from my town
I was looking up past the city lights
But the city lights got in my way

See the constellation ride across the sky
No cigar, no lady on his arm
Just a guy made of dots and lines

-from "See The Constellation"
by They Might Be Giants

I am sorry to intrude on you with reality, but yes, I am serious. Perform a search on Google with the keywords "Glenn Miller" +brothel.

I believe the original claim was that he was sported entering a brothel, but then rumours later circulated that his plane was accidentally shot down, and later that it simply crashed over the channel. The NAZI's picked up on this and attempted to air the original story, including other reports that substantiated this view, but before long all sorts of conspiracies were circulating, and so the claim lost interest and all credibility. In my opinion, this is basically what the FBI agent was doing—attributing to and escalating those so-called myths (had his face ripped off indeed). Of course, none of this means the original story is true, but it does raise the question..