How are we going to attach the suspension wires to all those little grains of dust? Gaffer tape?

One sad thing about this clip. Even if it's definitely proven to be a fake, It will still provide ammo for their case. They can use it to illustrate how easily it would be to fake the landings.

I know, I know. It wouldn't really be that easy, but that's what they'll claim. And for people unfamiliar with filmmaking, it will be a pretty strong argument too. This clip even had me wondering for a few seconds, before I had a chance to compare it to the real version and had the anamolies pointed out to me.

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...And that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped. --Sir Bedevere

They would have to show that it could be faked using 1960's technology though, and I doubt that video was.


Kelly

Oh no...not another gaffer tape thread....

1

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a push to 1 for no Earthly reason

What if it's real. Something NASA was working on to fake the moon landing. Then I'd have the last laugh.

What if pixies are real? Then we'd all be amazed.

My point: saying "what if" does not lend any credibility to an idea. The landings were real, no matter how many times someone says "what if".

Your a Pixie.

On 2002-11-18 20:44, asdf wrote:
So? my turn at Cr
did you doenload any of the Videos?
If so ? what your opinion?/?



You'v a Pixle.

The simple answer seems to lie in asking the company, TVF, if they made it. I hadn't looked at the video until today - now I'm almost certain I've seen it - or something very much like it on TV. My recollection is it was part of an ad for Motrin, or some such headache remedy, but I can't recall if it was a real ad or a "news" clip.
Anyway, this "viral advertising" approach that TVF uses is something that may be of interest to my company so I've written to TVF to get more information and made reference to a couple of their works that I've seen (including this clip).
Let's see if they acknowledge it's theirs - they won't likely say who they made it for - and if they'll give me a ballpark estimate of the cost for a clip of that length.
When I hear back, I'll let you know.

TVF? Tom van Flandern? The net is cast wider! [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Nope. It would be fun if it was van Flandern, but it's The Viral Factory in London England. They did a salmon commercial where a fisherman fights off a bear to salvage his catch ("We go to any lengths to bring you the freshest salmon" - or some such tag line). They also did a takeoff on the Mastercard "priceless" ad campaign. A bit too raunchy to describe here, but hilarious.
I know (because they own the domain name) that they did the moonlanding out-take. That's how they spread their viral ads - with web addresses. Let's see if they acknowledge that it's their work. Of course, if the customer is Kaysing or Percy or Sibrel or one of the other ardent HBs, it may be that there's a non-disclosure clause in the contract.
Anyway, it isn't Tom.

"Save Target As..." 1.31 MB

Are you sure you are not confusing this with any number of outtakes you may have seen on It'll Be Alright on the Night, or a similar such TV program?

That could well be, Karamoon. Although we don't get that particular program here in Canada, I have seen ones like it. I don't know why I'm recalling it as a painkiller commercial - it's just one of those niggling memories that may be totally wrong. I do know that I have seen the clip, or something very similar before, though.

Thanks for the link. I've seen that site before but had lost the address.

Why is it called viral advertising? That sounds underhanded or undesirable like pop-up ads crossed with computer viruses (or virii?).

CJSF

__________________
Two years ago moved from my town
I was looking up past the city lights
But the city lights got in my way

See the constellation ride across the sky
No cigar, no lady on his arm
Just a guy made of dots and lines

-from "See The Constellation"
by They Might Be Giants

The idea is to "create the films which people send around to all their friends and colleagues", spreading much like a virus (computer or otherwise), I suppose.

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Everything I need to know I learned through Googling.

They did a salmon commercial where a fisherman fights off a bear to salvage his catch

I'm still laughing over that one. I'm perfectly willing to believe this video clip is something like that, or that it may just be a clever prank.

We might be seeing what I'll assertively call the Milne Effect. David Milne wrote a summary of the hoax theory for a small, free newspaper, and it has been widely circulated and accepted as genuine scholarship. See

http://www.clavius.org/bibmilne.html

for details.

If we take http://www.moontruth.com at face value, someone intends for the implications of the video to be believed. If so, we have another example of the indiscriminate way in which hoax believers accept, analyze, and circulate evidence. They simply accept whatever evidence supports their conclusion, regardless of how poorly conceived or unreliable. And they reject whatever evidence contradicts their conclusion, regardless of how sound and incontestable.

But we simply don't know how seriously we're supposed to take the accompanying text at http://www.moontruth.com. It fits the hoax believer pattern of issuing many assertions with little or no proof. But it also fits the marketing paradigm of telling a gripping story that isn't necessarily something you're supposed to ruminate on.

Yes, that's the principle. The company was founded on a belief that if you send something interesting to 5 people, the odds are good that most of them will send it on to 4 or 5 people they think will be interested. In no time, through the miracle of the Internet, thousands of targeted people will have seen the ad. It grows like a virus, but without the negative connotations and with direct human control.

If it's something raunchy, you wouldn't send it to your grandmother so the receivers are, by and large, the group you want to see your ad. I think it's a brilliant strategy and an extremely cheap way to focus on the market. The key to success, of course, is having the ad be more entertainment than marketing.

Look at the "John West Salmon" clip in the link Karamoon provided. You'd likely send this on to a number of friends who would also see the humour - and they might even remember the name of the product and try it.

To quote the spirit of Bob Eggleton, channelled at the 1999 Worldcon Hugo Awards Ceremony.

"Wow! This is so Cool!"

Graham

Ammo... blanks. hehe.

The funny thing is I just viewed the video. I left the site to write something, and came back to that site just out of curiosity, and view the video again. Suddenly it's a broken link. Interesting...

(edited this msg to add what I stupidly forgot to write in the first place)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: jest on 2002-11-20 21:24 ]</font>

The video is accessible this morning.

__________________
Everything I need to know I learned through Googling.

I'm the first to admit I don't know everything, but I'm curious again. Those triangle-shaped light trusses, such as the one that falls in the faked lunar landing - were those even around in the 60's?

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jest

"Don't worry, everything is getting nicely out of control." -Douglas Adams

I don't know if they existed in the 1960's, but I do know this, these lights weren't used for the EVA training. See these following.

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/Hi...-S69-31147.jpg

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/Hi...-S69-31152.jpg

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/Hi...-S69-31104.jpg



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: jrkeller on 2002-11-21 15:12 ]</font>

Two questions - were these photos taken at Bethpage or Houston? (I'm guessing Houston)

In the second photo what is the large black cylinder behind the technicians? (at about 9:00 in the photo)

There were taken in Building 9 at Johnson Space Center.

You'll find this mildly amusing. My extroverted conspiratorial ways (which are nearly non-existent but I know a bit about how they work) initially thought "See? There's one of their sets!" hehe. I am of course a true believer that they landed on the Moon, I'm just saying that I bet you anything someone less open-minded will see those images and post them on their moon-hoax site.. you just watch.. lol

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jest

"Don't worry, everything is getting nicely out of control." -Douglas Adams

Thanks.

Before joining the military and becoming a pilot, Armstrong studied in clown school for the circus. That is the secret moon cannon that Armstrong used to be the first man shot out of a cannon on the moon. It was supposed to be a surprise, so they didn't tell anyone. The cannon went horribly wrong, and that explains Armstrong's reluctance to do publicity. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Seriously, don't know.

I think Jay's already done a good job pointing out the differences between the clip and the actual lunar footage. The salient point is that the hoax clip doesn't look anything like it was shot in 1/6 g, while the official record is absolutely consistent with that environment. So what is purported to be a ruined take because of the collapsing light bar, wouldn't have been a convincing take in any case. Any HB that claims this was an out-take during the "actual shooting" of the A 11 EVA should be asked to explain why it is so obviously shot under different gravitational acceleration.
Anyway, it's all academic. We know where - or at least by whom - and approximately when it was made (within the past couple of years).