For your reading enjoyment. Interesting stuff about the big telescope. Be sure to check out the reader comments posted below the article.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/794743/posts

So you people were lying the whole time when you said no telescope could spot the lander. I'm starting to see the conspiracy now.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Tommy on 2002-11-23 20:59 ]</font>

Tommy, did you even read the article? The VLT is a brand-new instrument, and it has far higher resolution than any previous telescope.

Nobody was lying. It has been utterly impossible (until now) for Earth-based, or Earth-orbiting, telescopes to resolve something that small at that distance. Even the VLT may just barely be able to resolve the Apollo landing sites:

You may be hallucinating then. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img]

This clearly indicates they are not trying to spot the landers themselves but the shadows. Hence, those here have been speaking the truth.

As for others, is it possible that many people didn't know about this telescope or that the attempt was being made? Even those that DO have good knowledge of telescopes have pointed out that the resolution to see the equipment itself is not yet available. Your charge of lying by all on this board is a harsh one and demonstrably false.

Donnie beat me by that much. [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_lol.gif[/img]

Ahh. Likely a troll.
Tommy, what specific evidence do you have that has not been addressed by BA's web site, http://www.Clavius.org or this forum? Remember that we are a bunch of science and engineering professionals and enthusiasts here. We want hard data, not theories and handwaving. If you can provide this we will debate it openly. If not I suggest we ignore this troll from here on.

Here, I found a news release that explains what Donnie B. means by this [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] :

http://www.eso.org/outreach/press-re.../pr-16-02.html

Your all part of the conspiracy!!!
NASA has gotten into your confused minds and warped them like so many others. Spread the word!!!

OK, I hereby resolve not to feed the troll anymore.

I am not a troll.
You are a troll in sheeps clothing.
What to do when the troll dressed like a sheep accuses the actual sheep of being a troll.

i sure would like to use the VLT to look at Jupiter right now [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

The name is pretty funny to me. VLT-Very LARGE Telescope [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

You are a odd one.

mooner, saturn v, asdf....

What are you saying?

I've never said a telescope couldn't see the Apollo landings, I just said that the Hubble couldn't see the landing sites.

ahh another weekend troller to add to the list. This same person (a am assuming it is the same person. Similar tactics as SaturnV and asdf (and probobly others).

Tommy, why troll this board? We will ignore you from now on once you show signs of trolling. So just leave us alone.

While it is fun to show you are wrong, it is pointless to do it 4 different times under different disguises. Just go back to your homework i bet your high school teacher wants if finished by monday.

[fix spelling again]
_________________
"I am not conceited, i'm perfect"
"It takes Thousands to fight a battle for a mile, Millions to hold an election for a nation, but it only takes One to change the world." by Dan Sandler 2002

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: g99 on 2002-11-24 01:53 ]</font>

I've always attempted to make it clear in my replies that the landing sites are invisible to our current telescopes also. I've further attempted to clarify this by saying that we either need a scope much closer to the Moon or one much, much larger on the ground. With the VLT it looks like we might just be about there in the second option.

However, even this doesn't seem to be quite there yet. Being able to see something is not the same thing as being able to recognise it. I think in this case even the highest resolution would be just enough to get a spot on film. We'd still need to get an order of magnitude better to actually get a clear image.

Does anyone have info on just what the maximum theoretical resolution of the VLT will be at the Moon's distance when all 4 mirrors are used?

I'm afraid in terms of proof, the VLT attempt will be about as effective as the Clementine IR images of the A15 landing site. Of course, that's not the main purpose of it. The purpose is to test the limits of this new telescope, and the Apollo sites just make a perfect target of opportunity.

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...And that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped. --Sir Bedevere

Off topic (well sort of): Do we currently have satelites orbiting the moon? If so have they tried to resolve the regions where they landed and show people like B.S. that we actually did land there?

He would probobly say that we digitally put the lander there.

Second, can we have satelites orbit the moon? or will earth's gravity pull it into a unstable orbit?

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GIYUL :-)
"It takes Thousands to fight a battle for a mile, Millions to hold an election for a nation, but it only takes One to change the world." - Dan Sandler 2002

Heh, just think of OWL. The Overwhelmingly Large Telescope. It will have an apeture of 100 meters.

Also, they are just testing the individual telescopes. They don't have the interferometer up and running, to my knowledge. So when they have that going they will be able to see the lander better.

According to the article that nebularain posted they will be able to start combining three of the mirrors in mid-2003.

What's the over/under on how many more posts before Tommy is banned? Whatever the figure may be, put me down for the under.

__________________
"Is that a laser pointer? Well...that's fantastic! I mean...wow..that's just...GREAT!"
-Donald Rumsfeld before a Nov. 2001 speech
(His enthusiasm was muted, however, when he learned he could not guide a bomb with it.)

Whatever the number it seemes Phil doesn't even bother to warn them anymore since it does no good. He's now gone as quick as the last troll was....no warning, just banned.

BANNED at 9!

My money says BOO is next! [img]/phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]
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Be alert! The world needs more lerts.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kaptain K on 2002-11-24 14:43 ]</font>