Last weekend, (or was it the one before) Ian Punnet had guests on Coast to coast Live (precursor to C2C) who were discussing UFO stuff and one of them stated that the 2012 disaster had been averted by the future humans who crashed their ship at roswell in '47. Had something to do with a box they brought with them, and a Brown dwarf companion star that Civilian Astronomers had not yet discovered, but Military Astronomers had been watching for years. Don't ya just hate those Military Astronomers, they have all the best stuff, and the rest are using beer bottles to watch the sky. Where did I put those hip waders....

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Those who repeat History are doomed to learn it.

im laughing too hard to come up with a coherent response to THAT idea...

A real disaster is going to happen, as I´m turning the age of...oh, lets forget about that...

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What brings us together is stronger than what pulls us apart

The first round's on Argos.

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The last time I felt a warm fuzzy feeling, I was informed by my doctor that it was just gas.

You bet it.

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What brings us together is stronger than what pulls us apart

Ha! Military astronomers! That's priceless.

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There is a growing tendancy to think of Man as a rational, thinking being, which is absurd.- Marvin the Martian.

It's gotten to the point where careful investigation is needed just to tell parody from reality. I think that means reality is broken.- Noclevername.

Would that be the folks at the US Naval Observatory, and the like?

Intrigued I just had to do a search for the phrase "military astronomers". Didn't get but a few dozen hits, and many of them were not the actual phrase, and the remaining all seemed to be space-alien (or alien-debunking) sites. This historical one was interesting:

OBSERVERS, PUBLICATIONS, AND SURVEYS: ASTRONOMY IN THE UNITED STATES IN 1849 (PDF)

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I believe their tense structure is wrong, they probably want the future past imperfect tense: "The 2012 disaster will shall have been averted by the crash in 1947". I'm sure a time-traveling version of Gillian shall have been able to help us with this.

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At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

One Earth, One Sky - IYA 2009
All moderation in purple

Hey, Douglas Adams points out that time travel screws up verb tenses something awful. (Pointed; he's dead now.)

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Gillian

"Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

"You can't erase icing."

"I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

That's OK, Gill; the pretorite present is a perfectly acceptible tense construction.

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There is a growing tendancy to think of Man as a rational, thinking being, which is absurd.- Marvin the Martian.

It's gotten to the point where careful investigation is needed just to tell parody from reality. I think that means reality is broken.- Noclevername.

I was thinking of his comments about it. But I hadn't made the connection with his death. Do you think that by revealing that time travel was possible (why else would someone have to worry about tenses if it wasn't), that THEY ® did him in to cover up THEIR time travel activities? It sounds like a conspiracy!

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At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

One Earth, One Sky - IYA 2009
All moderation in purple

What will I see in 2012?

My son by that time is 8 yo and and I will be less worrying about his wittyness and restlessness as what he is now at 3.

I probably moved to another place.

We will be dominated by robots. (thinking of the movie AI)

And here I thought I just worked for the military and not actually in it.

...will have had pointed.

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Relight the Firefly!

"It is quite clear that Occam's razor does not sharpen in your pyramid." (Nicolas)

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." (Paul Simon)

This was documented in Futurama Episode 3ACV19 "Roswell That Ends Well".

WARNING: FOR THOSE FEW WHO HAVEN'T SEEN THIS EPISODE, CONTAINS SPOILERS!

Military reassembly of Bender.

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To expound on my original point further...Tom Van Flandern was a Military Astronomer. Oops, my bad, I will give everyone time to clean up the rootbeer they just spit on their monitor and keyboard. The clowns on C2C live didn't bother to explain how a couple of LGM's, with a box, and apparently no idea on how to fly their saucer anywhere except into the ground, could possibly counteract the effects of a small star.

That is the great thing about being a "male bovine digestive bio-mass dispenser." You don't have to know what you are talking about in order to talk about it.

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Those who repeat History are doomed to learn it.

Oh, I agree. One of the reasons for BAUT is to point out bad astronomy.

What will start? Please be specific.

What radiation? How has the moon protected us? Given its distance, motion and size, it certainly couldn't act like a shield against anything. All in all, this sounds like very bad astronomy.

Almost every religion has made astronomy based predictions about events that are to take place around 2012? I wasn't aware of that. Please give us the specifics behind these scientific predictions.

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

1> won't find out exactly until it starts, would just be speculating - call it chaos if you like.

2>the moon has protected us from asteroid/meteor/ite collisions for millions of years. gravity can act like a lens to bend light and radiation, sending us an extra dose when in conjunction, and can block out a lot of the suns radiation when a total eclipse occurs, the 2012 will mainly pass over the sea and thus wont make a huge difference to temperature. the 2017 will cross the usa and will drop land temperature by many degrees for several hours.

3>they havnt specifically said 2012 but the time-scale is within reason and the combinations of sun/moon position along with solar activity and earths orbit/angle of rotation fit far too well for it not to be eventful. most major fluctuations of radiation/temperature have spurrned a change in the evolution cycle, some major some not. most religions do talk of days of chaos where only the "good"/followers will survive - its built into our instincts as its happened so many times in the past.

we now have 1000's of satelites in orbit which are affected, and in the chain are cell phones, sky tv, network/computer communications, power grids and thats with a normal dose - a large enough dose could affect the magnetic fields/gravity and current cycles of the oceans. never mind a paranoid politician with a jumpy bomb finger when all his spy satelites are knocked out.

So should I sell all my stock now and buy the boat?

Maybe quit all work altogether and start a Calivinball major league team...

Hey I don't want to spend my last days huddled in fear and workin for da man... know what I mean?

Alright... Well, the Moon does not 'protect us' by a whole lot. Granted- it has taken some impacts - but so has the Earth- it's just a game of Cosmic Billiards.

Protects us from radiation? How!?!?!

I notice you manage to get Global Warming into this one... And here I thought it was a fleet of Aliens in UFO's with some major big hair dryers like what you see in 'Spaceballs.'

And this 'radiation' (what kind? Unicorn radiation?) is going to magically affect Gravity, Magnetic fields AND ocean currents? Care to elaborate what makes any of this even remotely possible?
Maybe it's coming from a Kryptonite orb in Space...

we'll see a leap year :-)

thought this was an astronomy forum so really shouldn't need to explain basic scientific principals and actions esp. not to someone with 4300 posts under their belt.

i direct you to your nearest library/encyclopedia/text book to read up. its also covered in years 1/2 of any scientific degree course.

what i suggested was to use a telescope and carefully record the sun activity etc.

Welcome to Conspiracy Theory Forum- where All Claims Are Expected to be Backed Up by the Claimant With Evidence.

So let's just say I'm really not very bright and I was Home Schooled by a one-eyed Marmot named Timon.
I have 4300 posts because I don't always know how to be quiet- not because I'm smart.

So... Explain it to me.

This is the sky over New York City on Dec. 21, 2012, at about 7 p.m...

So, in 2012 the stars will be connected by an array of white lines? Kewl!

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"Transport of the mails, transport of the human voice, transport of flickering pictures - in this century, as in others, our highest accomplishments still have the single aim of bringing men together." St. Exupery

So, you don't know what "it" is, but you know it is coming in 2012?

First, the moon is a quarter million miles from Earth, with about 1/80th of the Earth's mass. It's a tiny target, and hardly useful in preventing collisions with Earth.

Second, do you have evidence of an asteroid that is to strike Earth in 2012?

The moon does not act like a focus for radiation towards Earth.

What solar radiation (beyond and above what we always receive) are you referring to?


Are affected by what?

By the way, you wouldn't know Matt Cox, would you? This is starting to sound familiar.

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

Yes, this is an astronomy forum, and in astronomy (the science) there has been no evidence presented for something that would cause a cataclysmic event to occur in 2012. That idea comes from incorrect assumptions about the Mayan calendar system.

And we're supposed to see what?

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

sorry if i offended, here are some good places to start

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_radiation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_field
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_lens
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cycle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_variation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_radiation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Allen_radiation_belt

are a selection of links to start with

now, although the moon has a relatively low gravity/em it still interacts enough to keep the earths orbit smooth and shift millions of kilos of water. there are so many types of radiation coming from the sun that a body the size of the moon could interact, also the moon can act like a hoover sweeping up space debris(some get through but the majority of big stuff doesnt).
2012 will have a major increase of sun activity, coupled with an interesting orbit pattern for the sun/moon/earth. we are already starting to see the warming effects and thus the increase in co2 add this to more radiation reaching us and the moons positioning in all of this will make for an interesting time. (the moons position also effects the actions of earths protective layers as its just close and big enough)

hope i made it a bit clearer for you.

Have you read and understood all that you linked? As well as the actual interaction between them?

I wouldn't consider the Moon to be a "hoover."

In addition, Gravitational Lensing CAN influence something to change course- but what you are implying would still only be trace amounts in reality. It can doesn't mean that it does- or that it does it how you want it to.

Add to that Earths own Magnetic field and atmosphere- and you will find where the TRUE guardian is- and it ain't the moon.

If I see Van Allen Radiation Belt one more time in a CT thread...


OH! That reminds me... A_Vision- what is the conspiracy? You haven't said yet..

Thanks, but could you tell me where, in those general articles, is evidence of a cataclysm in 2012? By the way, if we wanted to use the sun (far more massive than the moon) as a gravitational lens, the focus would be out at about 550 times the distance between the Earth and the sun.

What do you mean by keeping the "orbit smooth"?

Tidal effects are not the issue here.

I'm afraid I'm still going to have to ask for your evidence.

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I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

THIS looks like time travel...

You quote a_vision on things he says...before he posts? Most likely he deleted the post, but it looks funny anyway. Go on, try following the link to what you're quoting...

No real comments on 2012 from me as they've all been said. I have had some discussions with people on the street about this too, and generally say the same things most'f ya'll do to calm them. It's a good resource if nothing else.

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None to speak of

Ah, shucks, I wasn't supposed to let anyone at these time-space coordinates know about my time machine.

Actually, I think he repeated about the same thing two or three times, and I suspect a mod did a little cleaning up. One difference: the missing first post did have the line about "bad astronomy."

__________________
I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser