I have recently been battling Geopathic healing and have come accross a very specific claim that should be easy to refute. Unfortunately, I don't really want to embarrass myself by writing to NASA, and surely someone must have done this already.

Geopathic healing, water dousing, and Feng Shui all make claims about earth vibrations. This site (http://www.fengshui.co.uk/GeopathicStress.htm specifically states that "NASA builds in imitations of this earth's electromagnetic frequency into their space shuttels, known as Schumann Resonators to safeguard the health of astronauts when they are outside of the influence of the earth and its vital frequency."

Has anyone ever debunked this?

Welcome to the board!

How do they determine what's "outside the influence of the Earth" in the first place?

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Hi, runningman. Welcome to the board.

The simple answer is that the claim is factually incorrect; NASA does not incorporate "Schumann resonators" on the Shuttle. Period.

The premise is also wrong. Earth doesn't have a fundamental frequency; it has all sorts of different characteristic electromagnetic and acoustic frequencies. Schumann resonance, due to the "waveguide" formed by the Earth's surface and the ionosphere, causes a set of characteristic frequencies in the ELF (Extremely Low Frequency) band.

Actually, there seems to be a decent debunking of this nonsense claim here.

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"Slapping a guy on the head is just as funny now as it was eighty years ago."

Well, basically, they start with a little bit of science. Schumann resonance actually does exist. It refers to electromagnetic waves that travel between the surface of the earth and the ionosphere.

The pseudoscientists have developed an intricate theory that these waves are impacted by underground water, and that there are places on the earth where the waves are distorted. Since we have evolved over millions of years to depend on a specific frequency, being in the wrong place is responsible for all manner of health problems.

So, now the medicine show enters the picture. You can correct these problems by hiring someone to rearrange your furniture. You can also hire someone to tap into these forces and find water for you.

However, several of them make the claim that even NASA recognizes the necessity of these waves and equips space craft with devices to replicate this resonance. (Any vehicle above the ionosphere would be outside of the influence of these waves.) This is a specific claim that should be able to be refuted. I'm just wondering if anyone has already done this?

Thanks, sts60, that reference was just what I was looking for.

Touching on Water Dousing, I'll step out on a limb and say that I have practicle experience using dousing rods to find water, for a well on my dad's place.

However I can not explain -why- it works. However I have three thoughts on what might cause it to seem to work.

1. Gravitaional changes. The water bearing strata is denser then dry strata, therefore a minor increase in gravity is picked up by the rods, causing them to tilt in towards each other. Not really a pratical idea by a remote posibility.

2. Changes in Ground Conductivity. Self explainatory, in that water increases the conductivity of soil. The rods pick this up somehow. Also Not really a pratical idea by a remote posibility.

3. Random chance. During dousing you get a lot of rod cross overs. Random chance dictates that some of these will be over a water source. This is probably how dousing really functions.

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http://worldsofothersuns.home.comcast.net/

Random Chance.

If you can do it in front of the JREF you could be rich

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I was just sitting here contemplating the immortal words of Socrates who said, "I drank what?"

"Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that, in glory and triumph, they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot." --Carl Sagan "Pale Blue Dot"

Yep, that and if you dig a deep enough hole pretty much anywhere you will usually find water (though how much and weather it refills at a worthwhile rate is a different matter) which is counted usually as a hit by dowsers.

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Girl: Mister Darwin! The stupid people are breeding and taking over the planet!
Charles Darwin: Tut tut, little girl, don't worry! I'll take care of them with my CHAINSAW OF NATURAL SELECTION! Ahahahahahhaha!!!!!!
-QUeen of Wands 12/08/2003

You know, if you look at our new banner, the BA might not be boxing on the moon, he might be dousing water (look at how he's holding his hands) and the artist just didn't do a good job of showing the rod.

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At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

I respond to this in my next post about what NASA might actually have, and why.

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol.

Perception isn't reality. It's merely an abstraction thereof, and quite often not a very good one at that.

I am human. Fully human.

I wonder if they're confusing Schumann Resonance with the Schuler Cycle, also known as Schuler Tuning? Discovered by Max Schuler, a German engineer who's principle is used in all mechanical gyroscopes to minimize the effects of translation on errors. The principles are still used in B-52s, and other older aircraft.

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol.

Perception isn't reality. It's merely an abstraction thereof, and quite often not a very good one at that.

I am human. Fully human.

Bring them on! I don't mind being an experiment to prove that dousing works by random chance. If it turns out to be gravitational or conductivity, I'd have to eat my hat on TV I guess.

Would be entertaining eaither way.

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"There is no problem that cannot be solved by a suitable application of high explosives" - US Army Demolitions School

http://worldsofothersuns.home.comcast.net/

Here's the thing I like about this forum. Not only does the conversation wander to cover a lot of interesting information, but much of it is just so darned useful in everyday situations. I mean, here I've been blithely just hopping into my F-16 and rolling out in the morning on the way to work all this time, and I've not once taken the Schuler effect on my INS into account...

Interestingly, the last link contained this bit:
A bit of casual searching didn't enlighten me. Does anybody else know about this?

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"Slapping a guy on the head is just as funny now as it was eighty years ago."

Ah. That explains the drift!

Obscure, but true.

If you really want to get your feet wet with early, practical computer applications, visit the Memorial at Pearl Harbor. Take some time to wander through the naval museum next to the main building, particularly the manually-cranked fire control computers used to calculate (wind) shell ballistics based upon not just wind, but atmospheric conditions, as well.

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol.

Perception isn't reality. It's merely an abstraction thereof, and quite often not a very good one at that.

I am human. Fully human.

Either way you wouldn't win the $million. The $million is for a proven Paranormal effect. If you proved that it was caused by a normal effect that we just hadn't thought of, it'd no longer be paranormal and thus would be Ineligible for the money.

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Howling from the Shadows

It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. --- JayUtah

You can't reason an irrational person out of an irrational belief. --- Noclevername

Apollo: The History and the Hoax
Enter the World of Athran

Darn it! I so wanted to by a Prowler with the money too!

__________________
"There is no problem that cannot be solved by a suitable application of high explosives" - US Army Demolitions School

http://worldsofothersuns.home.comcast.net/

Mr. Randi has stated many times that Dowsing is an acceptable test for the JREF prize of $1,000,000. He has had many dowsers test, and so far none have won. If you legitamately believe that you can dowse water, then go ahead and fill out thier application. If you read the JREF rules, you'll note that they cannot legally back out of a test. If you do your dowsing, per a test co-designed by both you and JREF, and you PASS, then go from the initial test to one attended by JREF witnesses. If you pass that, you get the $1,000,000.

Seriously, if you read thier rules, you'll see they don't leave any wriggle-room for themselves. But I highly advise you to conduct some basic double-blind tests yourself so that you can be sure you can actually do this. Here's a simple test you can do:

1.) Get two friends to assist you, ten cardboard boxes, and ten empty plastic milk containers. Fill one full of water.
2.) The first person takes the materials in another room, arranges the milk jugs, and covers each with a box.
3.) The person leaves the room, and you go in with your witness to dowse. Pick the box you think has the water, then you both leave without touching the boxes. Write down which you think it was.
4.) First person goes back in the room, and rearranges ALL boxes so none are in thier original position.
5.) Repeat steps 1-4 nine more times.

Statistically speaking, you should hit the water once. Get three or more, and you have something...

But just to give you something to think about:
1.) If dowsing rods can really detect water, why can it detect water under many tens of feet of dirt, yet not be deflected by the large water source that is your body?
2.) If you take your dowsing rods to a lake, stream, or pool, why don't you get a very strong deflection?