Welcome to the BAUT. Read the FAQs and Rules (click on "FAQ" above) and have a good time. There's an old saying, "Ignorance is bliss."

Unfortunately it's usually bliss for the person pulling a fast one on you.

Let's say someone offers you a computer for $25 and claims it's the latest offering from a reputable manaufacturer, but doesn't allow you to examine it, instead insisting on selling it to you unseen. According to what you wrote you should not be skeptical, but fork over the $25.

Yeah, there's always an innocent explanation for how that unusual lipstick got on that shirt collar.

I strongly suggest you rethink your position.

Meanwhile, welcome to a nest of skeptics, and enjoy!

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My Father-in-law is one of the kookiest people I know. He believes everything - pretty much on the basis that everything has "some basis of truth in it", and he likes to be "open-minded". He has paid (among other things) to do Reiki courses, and used to insist on using acu-pressure on me (pressing the palm of my hand when I had stomache pains). Pretty much any snake-oil remedy that cures everything is tried by him, without him seeing the irony. He has sent money to obvious (to me, and I warned him so) scammers - just in case. Then sent them letters to say how dissapointed he was, after his money vanished. He thinks that my atheism is my "path to God" and when he said I "prayed to the big bang" I don't think he meant it as a metaphor.

He got to be so annoying I basically ended up avoiding him.

Now, a lot of his attitudes have rubbed off on my wife. She used to do TM (and took our Daughter there, once), sometimes buys homeopathic remedies, and has paid for iridology sessions and astrological charts. (And various other "medicines too").

Somehow though, we get along fine - I hassle her for being a kook and she hassles me for my own mental flaws. It all balances out.

Over time we affect each other, she is now more skeptical, less likely to be fooled by scammers and spends way less on junk. In turn I now tend to be nicer to and more accepting of people, and sometimes I am actually found in social situations with people I don't know.

So I get to this line, and I've forgotten what my point was.

I had thought that it would be that we should all just accept each other as we are; except I just described how my wife and I affect and change each other.

Still, if you are skeptical, then skeptical is part of who you are. Be you.

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Measure once. Cut twice. Power tools are fun.

I´v turned very skeptic in the last few years.

But i always try to avoid the great dangers of pseudoskepticism.

So you know what I go through ... it is tough at times.

One way and it may go against your own principles is to engage them in conversation and point them carefully to their own references.

Just agree that Adam with a rib removed had less ribs than Eve. Fair enough but their children and also the rest of us were born with all of our ribs.

Also if that doesn't work you could try the no belly button bit as they were made not born and we all have belly buttons. It is one of those fallacies that will keep popping up without the presence of Adam and Eve to x-ray.

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"Nature is obliged to let reality determine its laws, whereas mathematics is under no such constraint."

I just took the poll and had to answer honestly that my skepticism never gets in the way of my social life. Well being an anti-skeptic it would be wrong to say yes, but social life, well I had best say what social life.

I like argument 13 in pseudo skeptic "Counter-claims based on plausibility rather than empirical evidence".

When you exist on an extreme end of the bell shaped curve it typically limits the number of conversations that are interesting to both you and your audience. It is either something you get use to or develop a technique of gentle social babble to get a conversation.

Hope it helps.

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"Nature is obliged to let reality determine its laws, whereas mathematics is under no such constraint."

I have friends... LOTS of friends who are actors. Yes, actors! So I do my fair share of shutting up just to keep relationships intact. I'm convinced that a couple of them, should they ever win a major award, will thank "The Secret."

On the other hand, I have a number of writer friends. We dish about our silly actor friends. So it all evens out.

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See? Because of me, now there's a warning. -Homer Simpson

Angella, welcome to BAUT!!!! Please take the time to peruse the rules under the "AboutBAUT" forum (you're doing fine so far - we just have different rules than many boards). May your stay here be long and prosperous.

Basically, Angella, many of us believe that what you don't know CAN hurt you

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"I have this theory that the Apollo missions were faked when NASA found out that general relativity was wrong because the Earth was expanding due to the Sun's iron core being influenced by magnetic waves from the electric universe after being perturbed by Planet X and thereby causing global warming. Where should I start a thread about this?" ~ ToSeek

"Those are the people that wonder how a thermos knows whether to keep something hot or keep something cold." ~ NeoWatcher

I think as much as anything, my desire to be a skeptic is toned down by my desire to avoid fights and arguments, which I dislike. I'm also a big believer in "pick your battles". Its a whole risk/benefit analysis. Even if one is 'right', sometimes the cost of proving it is just not worth it.

I don't know how to teach it to anyone, sorry.

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At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

I find the principles of skepticism work well enough for professional and some social life. But a preponderance of logic does not work well for me in dictating behavior for many other social occasions. I too have many friends who are artists, actors -- even mystics. My supplier of aircraft aluminum, for example a logical and knowledgeable businessman, does psychic readings on the side. I find more of this duality every day, and not all of it seems unpleasant to me.

Part of living a successful life, in my philosophy, is the development of judgment sufficient to know when skepticism and logic are not the best mode of thinking. What happens in an engineering lab or a court room doesn't much matter when, for example, you visit for a week in a cancer ward. Science and logic are important there too, of course, but in the perspective of most of the residents they aren't the most important thing.

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"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams
Clavius Moon Base

The Problem is The Middle Ages Belonged to a Relavatory Age, Much Like Pre-Classical Greece ...

Ironically Enough The Ancient Civilization MOST Like Ours in Terms of The Ratio of Thinking to Doing was Actually Old Kingdom Egypt, Albeit at a Lower Tech Level ...

In Such Terms Charles Darwin was Surely The Imhotep or Aristotle of his Age!

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If you Ignore YOUR Rights, they Will go away.

Actually My Faith is Part of The Problem and Truth Be Told Why The Title itself References Selfish Memes; Lately My Skepticism has Been More or Less Attacking My Faith ...

It Started Off Slowly but Like The Classic Experimenter I am I Came to a Decision to Put it to The Test ...

Word to The Wise Don't Call G-d Names and Demand He Smite you While Riding Around in a Car Full of People; NOTHING Will Actually Happen but your Friends Will Freak Out All Around you!

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If you Ignore YOUR Rights, they Will go away.

Why would I want to "turn off" my scepticism? To get along with people? Bah! I don't want to be friends with anyone who refuses to think. In fact, I get along with my best friend because we both think.

What's truly frightening is when we both start to argue with some third person - sometimes we get some sort of harmonic argument going. I'll make a point and peter out. He'll extend the idea, and run out of steam. Then I'll take it back up again...

The looks of horror are priceless! It may not endear us to the third person, but maybe they'll learn from it.

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Quaeso quousque humi defixa tua mens erit? Nonne aspicis, quae in templa veneris?

That's quite a profound way of approaching the issue of skepticism in life imho, and it's probably one of the best ways. I used to really harp on the whole "buy a star name" scam every time someone would come up to me asking for me to point out the star they think they bought. Then one day it struck me that this might not be the best time and place to go around debunking a myth, and that it might do more harm emotionally, especially if the person bought the star for a deceased loved one or something of that nature. Luckily I never made the mistake of opening my yap to anyone who had bought a star for such a serious reason, but I quickly realized that I needed to reform my approach. Sure, it's important to get the word out to people who are considering buying a star that it's not going to be officially recognized by anyone, but at the same time there is a need for restraint as well. Now when people ask me to show them the star they bought, whether I know the reason for the purchase or not, I just quietly punch in the coordinates and let them see it if it happens to be visible. If they were to ask me about the authenticity I won't lie, but I'm also not going to go out of my way to burst their bubble when in truth there's no real harm that's going to come of it aside from allowing an unfortunate misunderstanding to persist. In the same way, I wouldn't voice my skepticism of herbal medicine to someone who's run out of mainstream options in curing their terminal illness. I think many of us could use such restraint even when it's not easy. Is the rib thing silly? Yes, but I personally wouldn't let such a silly understanding stand in the way of an otherwise good friendship, annoying as it may be. Unless she's going to be operating on people, how is it really going to hurt her or anyone else as long as she knows now that not everyone believes the way that she believes? If she decides to spread this misinterpretation to other people, that's her own decision and it's not your fault.

I personally would have to say something like, "It's not a matter of agreeing to disagree. It's a matter of fact that men and women have the same number of ribs. Now, if you want to talk about it, I'll be happy to, but otherwise we can just drop it." That would be one way to avoid acceding to a manifestly incorrect belief without pointlessly damaging the friendship.

[I personally might mention that I don't have any problem being a Christian and accepting the equal-ribs fact, but that's a whole 'nother ball game right there.]

angella, welcome to the board.

Hi all. I'm a new member to this post. It's a good thread. Everyone has mentioned their own thoughts in a good way. My opinion is that we shouldn't be skeptical in any matter.

My opinion is that it's very important to be skeptical (which is not to be confused with knee-jerk denialism). There are simply too many important issues on a personal and societal level in which unquestioning acceptance is at best wasteful and at worst dangerous. A few examples of claims which demand a skeptical approach:
- fluoridation is a government mind-control plot;
- vaccines cause autism, power lines cause cancer, etc.;
- a solution of a certain chemical, diluted far beyond the point where said chemical is present at all in the solution, can cure various acute diseases;
- the 9/11 attacks were (caused by Iraq; staged by the U.S. government; etc.)

The point is not to discuss the particulars of any of the above claims - they are out of scope for this forum - but to illustrate the urgent need for skepticism in facing the choices we are presented with at home, the marketplace, or the polling booth.

And especially in love or marital relationships. It may cause a huge damage for you...

There's a time for unconditional acceptance, too. But what about elderly pensioners wooed by con-men and -women only to be swindled? Do you believe they are better off without skepticism?

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"Slapping a guy on the head is just as funny now as it was eighty years ago."

I had a wound that got skeptic once. So I conspired with a doctor.

Disclaimer: I haven't read the rest of this thread yet.

I have to take issue with this characterization.

No. My skepticism has never intruded upon my life. It's a vital, essential and most welcome facet of my world view. It is my armor and my shield. Even when it tells me what I most need to hear (as opposed to what I'd most like to hear.) And even as it punctures my most selfish fantasies, ultimately it is my sense of wish-fulfillment that is intruding. Not my skepticism.

I do have to say, however, that others do occasionally go out of their way to intrude upon my skepticism. Still, it says much more about "them" than it does about me. I'm generally content with that.

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[Dr. Horrible]___________________________[Penny]
Listen close to everybody's heart________And you believe there's good in everybody's heart
And hear that breaking sound_____________Keep it safe and sound
Hopes and dreams are shattering apart____With hope you can do your part
And crashing to the ground_______________To turn a life around