Its currently the theory of John Lear that the reason it takes the space shuttle so long to dock with the ISS, is because its stopping off at another secret space station in-route. I have attempted to explain why this is not possible with the current shuttle system, I’ve even posted the shuttle mission timeline from launch to docking, but it’s like knocking my head against a wall with this group. In response to me Mr. Lear’s sidekick posted a link to this site full of unidentified objects photographed in orbit. I would have to assume that most astronomers would be familiar with these objects and know what was actually photographed.

Secret Space Station

Any ideas as to what they are photographing?
I guess they are satellites, but some of them must be extremely large. At least one of them looks like a bad picture of the Pleiades to me.

You got me. Without information as to when they were photographed, where, and with what, it is pointless to figure out. We are just guessing. Some look like poor images of the ISS, scintillating stars, and just about anything else. Details, details, details.... The scope could easily produce some distortion as well if the optics are not collimated correctly.

I was looking at the wide field shots where he has "What is this?". Both those images may be internal reflections in the lens system from the artificial lighting around the building. That is just a guess but I have had similar images over the years.

Utterly ridiculous. It's easy enough to see the ISS and Shuttle with the naked eye. I've done it repeatedly. They're big and bright. Even when the government tries to hide things in low orbit it's extremely difficult. Here's a thread that gets into just how hard it is to hide covert satellites:

France detects "black" US Satellites

There is simply no way a shuttle docking could be hidden, and if somebody says they docked with something else, let's see the time it happened, and images. Let's see the orbital elements of the object it docked with. And so on.

So stop trying. There's no point.

I saw some fuzzy images which might or might not be astronomical, with no hint as to when they were taken, or how. I would be very impressed if anyone could make anything out of that stuff.

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The Leif Ericson Cruiser

I recognized one of the images as either NCC-1701-B or Uss Exclesior NCC-2000.

The rest were ferengi with a smattering of Klingons.

I was hoping that on some of the clearer ones maybe there would be a chance to discern what the object was based on shape and known satellites.

I also considered refraction in the lens elements on several of those photographs. Good call.


Believe me I have already mentioned this as well as the fact that the shuttle has to launch in a very specific window just to catch the one station, let alone be chasing stations all around orbit. I have mentioned the fuel limits, the changes in orbit altitude based on speed, and the difficulty with hiding the actual launches. All of this to no avail. As a matter of fact after all of that is when his friend (sleeper) showed up with all these images as well as conceptional schematics from NASA.

The problem is that his numbers of followers is growing, and its making any rational debate difficult as they wonder into them with their nutty theories. It just gets very annoying to constantly hear about how Mr Lear is "so in the know" on everything because of his family name, when he talks nothing but utter nonsense. You should see his theories on the “soul catcher” on the moon. He is nothing more then another Hoagland who does bad science based on photographic anomalies on the edges of pixilated NASA photos.

Seriously - one or two look like a badly pixelated image of Babylon 5. Another looks like a similarly degraded image of Skylab, and others have resemblances to other spacecraft from sci-fi series or films.

I call shennigans.

BTW, is this John Lear the same John Lear that is listed on the PFT website? Son of the Learjet founder?

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I am not sure what the PFT website is, but yes, it’s the same person.

Well, that explains a lot then. Thanks!

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Then you're dealing with something that is used to store almonds, walnuts, pecans, filberts, etc.

There is no reasoning with these people.

They are of the 2+2=5 in Base10 variety.

Either reality will catch up with them or it won't.



Concerning the graphics, obviously very fuzzy images of who-knows-what. Rational people look at who-knows-what graphics and conclude "I don't know what that is, if it is anything at all." CTs and HBs look at who-knows-what graphics and see what they want to see.

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Many of the pics look like pictures of bacteria rubbed with the "smudge" filter in Photoshop. A couple look like droplets of the flourescant used in chemlights with the lights turned off, and then "smudged" in Photoshop. The rest look to me like common Hubble images zoomed in several hundred times, and then, again, "smugded" in photoshop.

I see nothing on his website offerering evidence of celestial origin for any of the photographs. I doubt it would take me longer than 2 or 3 minutes with The Gimp to produce a similar image with any picture you'd care to Google me at random.

My advice about the CT nutters - don't bother, if you've done your best, as the others have pointed out. Some people have their entire identity wrapped up in these absurd theories, and you are as unlikely to talk them out of these fanciful notions as you are to talk them out of their religion. Give it an honest, truth-loving, scientist's shot, but know when to say "when"

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"Those are the people that wonder how a thermos knows whether to keep something hot or keep something cold." ~ NeoWatcher

I did a little searching on John Lear. If the Bob Lazar quote on this site is accurate, than even Lazar thinks he exaggerates! Here's the quote:

Lazar says: "Well, John Lear's a nice guy. I like him, but he does have the tendency to add about fifteen percent color to stories, and if a story goes through him twice, it's thirty percent, and it doesn't stop."

For someone like Lazar to comment . . . well, the mind boggles.

By the way, Lear has Earth visited by 80 ET species. Yeesh.

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Disclaimer: Avatar is not an official NASA image and does not imply any specific interplanetary or interstellar capability.

The Leif Ericson Cruiser

Good Lord and wow!

As for the images even with the suggestion they are of a hidden secret US space station , um my question is does the bloody thing change shape? or multiply? I mean if it was just one secret space station shouldn't the fuzzy images consistantly show a similar shape...with variations in fuzziness only?

I mean from the sizes and shapes of the images it seems the US has a super secret 'fleet' in orbit. and Yes one of those images did seem to me to be of the Babylon station and I do see Skylab in that one image. The rest look like random satelites to me *shrug*

I am no scientist just a random avaerage fan of astronomy and space exploration buff! However my first impression is if these are what this guy (Lear) says they are...

When were your photos taken? what time of day? What type of film? Camera? Telescope? What position in the sky were these filmed ?

I mean some of images have the date and time stamped on them but from where and what angle so I can I look and see too!

Just my two cents, if you can see them i should be able to as well, stands to reason.

Wait! why is this guy with holding information? Huh ? Huh ? *eyes the CT* what is he hiding?

Sorry got a bit goofy there at the end

Vons

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At leas one of the images could of Mir at an early stage of construction, or Salyut 6 or 7

Some of the others are possibly the ISS. But why are images so fuzzy? I have seen much better ISS images out there from amateur telescope.

Why is the IMAGINOVA logo on almost every image?

Hm…..

Good posts, and some good questions as well. I am not really sure how to proceed with this because I respect both of these boards, and don’t want to violate and T&C at either one of them. At the same time I would like to give credit to you all if you can help shoot down these wild theories from this group. So I am not sure whether to just post the link to that thread and let anyone interested just post over there for themselves, or to repeat the questions you have just asked and give the credit for them back to you all here. I realize that many sites take offence to linking discussions in other forums, though I have seen you all do that with GLP and Nancy Leader in the past. For the moment I’ll just ask your questions on the other site and wait until someone at both locations grants me permission to post a link to the discussion. Either way though, I will mention in the thread over there that these questions come from the folks at Bad Astronomy.

At least half of those images look like what happens when you try to track the space station by hand and fail as miserably as I do when doing hand tracking. You get a streak with a hint of a strange shape. The thing is I never irresponsibly post said images and jump up and down while screaming "OMG secret nazi space base!" In fact I usually just delete those images all together as they're embarrasing, but other people tend to be happy just to get a streak - here's an example and you tell me if this looks kind of like some of the photos on that website.


This one looks like the command module/LEM stack to me, but nope, it's actually a poorly tracked ISS and shuttle lol:

Wow NGCHunter,
I think you might have nailed this one.
Good deal; nice comparison photos…

On sort of the same subject, does anyone know of a project called “Aquila”? Supposedly it involves the “starcraft booster team” of Buzz Aldren, and several universities. Including this from Wisconsin Madison: Helium Mining on the Moon

I wish we had a secret space station! If only they were putting that much money into space expansion...

But doesn't space expand all by itself, no budget required?

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