In the opening video, it says the tapes were classifed then lost. Now suddenly a declassified transcript shows up? Seems a bit like a book plot to me. I wonder if the former tower operator is making any money on this story.

-V

nbt,
you are aware that the Apollo debrief transcripts were classified for some time, aren't you? The military classifies things for reasons of capabilities and limitations. They don't want capabilities, or lack thereof, known to potential enemies for technological or political exploitation.
There was some confusion that night. This was the thick of the cold war. Things were classified quickly in those days.

There may have been a "ufo" out there that night. Intelligent extraterrestrials? ...unconfirmed.

Oh, I certainly am open to the possibility that this was from outside the earth.

What other hypotheses did you consider?

Especially when you consider what type of vehicle...

Okay, at this point it's pretty clear you're presuming what was seen over Edwards AFB was some kind of piloted vehicle.

And, as for why they say it was classified - no I don't know what reason.

Nor do I, naturally. But here's another hypothesis. The records of the incident reveal the capability of U.S. search radar and fighter interceptors. It also reveals the operation of the U.S.A.F. command structure in responding to an unknown. It reveals who reports to whom, how and when intercept assets are employed, gauges reaction times, and where airman training might not be sufficient. In short, those are things that would be useful to me if I were planning an attack on the United States by air.

Based on my experience with classifed information, that is a likely rationale. I have no information pertaining to this actual incident.

We are only left to guess.

And did you, in fact, guess? If so, what was your guess and how did you arrive at it?

__________________
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams
Clavius Moon Base

I wonder if the former tower operator is making any money on this story.

I don't know about money, but the alleged participants in this incident have been giving interviews for about ten years. The declassification apparently occurred in 1998.

__________________
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams
Clavius Moon Base

It implies our aircraft at that time could not keep up with it.

No. The limiting factor is altitude, not speed. I understand the interceptors' service ceiling was 40,000 feet, which is not very high in the grand scheme of things in 1965. This sounds like someone trying to trump up something sensational.

__________________
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams
Clavius Moon Base

I know how hard it is, as a scientist to make that leap from "unidentified" to "alien". It should be. Without an alien body were only left to speculate. However a very unusual UFO was seen by our air force and they did not know what to do about it. It was later classified. Just because something rather mundane was classified in the Apollo missions, does not in anyway suggest the same was done here. There was nothing mundane about it.

I'm not going to lie. I believe aliens do exist, and have been visiting us. I don't know for sure if this was related to that, but I am open to that. To be honest, given EVERYTHING in the case (if someone put a gun to my head and forced me to answer) I would say it's merely an non-human created object/craft. Whatever that is.

I saw that show, and I agree. They were informally called 'yoofo' officers', and their job was to investigate any undentified flying object over various airbases and such. IOW, scramble jets in the case of foreign/civilian/unauthorized aircraft, not alien space ships.

That bill guy really gets my goat. The show him interviewing wtnesses, then at the end of the program, he gives an obviously biased and hyperbolic interpretation of the testimony.

As far as I can tell, Bill has never seen or heard a UFO report that he didn't consider proof of extraterrestrials

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Banned By Nancy Lieder

There were lots of bright objects in the sky that night, like the moon, Saturn, Jupiter, Fomalhaut, Rigel, Sirius, Betelguese, and Aldeberan. (Not saying it was one of these as the USAF would never scramble to chase a celestial object - say like Venus.)

In the video, even the test pilot refused to believe it was alien. He definitely thought it was something from a "black" project. The SR-71 was kept at Beal AFB and could fly at over 85,000 ft. It was new tech in 1965.

The only thing certain is the USAF kept classified records of this unidentified flying objects event. Glowing orbs, moving slowly then rapidly, rising seemingly out of the atmosphere as evidenced with eyewitness testimonies, official doucmentation, multiple radar-visuals, too slow scrambled fighters, a YOOFO officer (from Wright Patterson suggesting balloons)...
yep, not much has changed which regards UFOs: we still don't know.

__________________
"Where the telescope ends, the microscope begins. Which of the two has the greater view?" - Hugo

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened." - Churchill

Yeah. They interview the head ATC 40 years later and he tells them something extraordinary. Where have I heard that story before? Roswell maybe? Lots of people talking about all sorts of things but a lot of it was lies or confabulation. In the Lakenheath 57 case, one of the ATCs filed a report to the Condon committee ten years after it happened. His story was similar. Recently, some UFOlogists got together and reviewed the case and discovered a lot of the extraordinary tales later told were not completely accurate. In a lot of cases, UFO witnesses will say things like "it could not have been one of ours, I would know". Unfortunately, that is not always the case.

As for the scramble, it is normal routine for jets to be scrambled. Granted I don't have a lot of time to waste watching these videos but from what I glanced at watching the latest "UFO hunters" episode (does Birnes ever take off those stupid sunglasses?), the airplane had difficulty seeing the UFOs, tracking the UFOs, and catching the UFOs. Sounds more like false radar returns with observations of things that were in the sky.

If you want to lay out your case here feel free to do so but let's not have links to videos. Give us a timeline of events and some actual data to look at. I got fed up with the "UFO hunters" episode after watching it for a few minutes since it showed only one point of view. Add to it the bad acting of the "hunters" (specifically Birnes) and it is really an awful show. I would rather watch Penn and Teller's "bull-----" show. At least they make me laugh.

And the program "UFO Hunters" has added nothing to our understanding. I complained to The History Channel about that program last week.

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Banned By Nancy Lieder

1. Edwards was known for flying classified aircraft through their airspace at the time.

2. You have no idea what type of propulsion was used and what was actually seen that night. You draw your conclusion based on 40 year old tall tales told by one or two people.

All base operations are classified the moment they happen. Obviously, you have no experience with the military. I spent over twenty years on submarines. Every operation we did was considered classified. Some of it was considered just operational security and some of it was very classified. Anything concerning the engine room was classified at least "confidential". I am sure the AF classified most air operations at some level to ensure that details about them could not be well understood by other countries.

Of course, this brings up the greatest question. If the event was classified to hide the truth about "UFOs", why wasn't it classified to the point that it could not be released via FOIA? This can be done you know. Instead the AF simply released all they had on the case because, to them, it was worthless. To UFO groups it is a godsend and they can portray the event as they want to, including the fact that it was "classified" and kept from the public for many decades until a group of diehard investigators found the truth. How gullible can you be?

All you know about this case is what UFO groups are telling you. Have you really looked into the matter yourself?

Bill Birnes helped Corso with his book full of Roswell fabrications and lies. The book was so bad, that UFOlogists who championed the Roswell case thought it was full of it. UFOlogists can be some of the most gullible people in the world and expect others to be just as gullible.

Nahh...never happen and pilots would never admit they were chasing a star or planet? Then again:

1) Dr. Hynek said the following about some UFO reports for an article that appeared in the April, 1953 issue of the Journal of the optical society of america:

And another sighting - in Northern Michigan - on July 29 of last year, a pilot chased a brilliant multicolored object close to the horizon, and due north. He flew at 21,000 feet, followed the object for over a half-hour but could not gain on it. Radar operator [in the aircraft] reported contact with the object for about thirty seconds. And ground control interceptor station reported blips too [on its radar]. In this case, it seems certain that our harried pilot was pursuing [the star] Capella! Capella was at lower culmination, that is, at the lowest point of its swing around the pole just skirting the horizon. I have seen it at that position myself in Canada, and can vouch for the fact that its blue, yellow, and red twinkling can be spectacular.

2) Case 37 of the Condon report:


Recorded conversation between the pilot and the Flight Control radar operator, indicated the pilot was chasing an UFO, which he said had risen from the river area below and was now moving away from him. The radar operator said he had a target on the scope, which he assumed to be the plane. He also said he had a second target, seen intermittently for a duration of about one minute. The pilot was heading at 110°, directly toward the object. This direction seemed to be consistent with the assumption that the second target was the chased UFO. The time was 5:40 - 5:58 am., EDT.
The pilot said the object was about 1,000 ft. above him, apparently over a small town, Town D. On first contact with the Flight Control the Cessna was at an altitude of 2,500 ft. climbing as it chased the UFO. The pilot said the object was a very bright light, which he could not catch. He could not match its altitude or speed. He said the object moved toward the ground at times, but maintained an altitude above them at all times. It moved away when they chased it, and came back when they turned.

I was thinking the same thing myself. If the military really thought there was something significant, I doubt it would have been declassified.

I knew it had happened several times, even as recently as the 1980's, but my google search didn't find much because I couldn't wade through all the woo woo. Thanks for a specific example.

To what end?

I could complain to the USAF for classifying and then declassifying such worthless UFO documents since it adds nothing to our understanding, and achieve the same result.

Then again, how would anyone go about studying the UFO phenomena?
It's entirely random, no?

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"Whe