Hello science heads.

first of all, excuse my english and lack of words


I am here because I would like to get my questions answered by educated people as most of you are

My story starts cheesy but gets more interesting in the last few paragraphs:

I have always been an atheist. I always thought people who believed in god were plain stupid and believed in fairy tales. At school, I always found history lessons a bit oo mythical sounding and also somehwat unbelievable. Things like Stonehedge, 3 pyramids in the middle of a desert, etc.. We learned about a couple of civilizations and then the next chapter was about another group of civilizations and so on. This does not make any sense (to me). Normally, you would think a civilization would evolve into the current civilization.

Many years ago, they all believed in some "god" up in the sky and they said mankind will be made and mankind will die, at some point (most of them were not good at calculation for obvious reasons). I probably do not have to add, these similar "ideas" these different civilizations were having existed in different languages at different places on earth, divided by big, deep, scary ocean's.

Then some 1000 years later some scientists discovered energy, magnetism, atoms, ions, ... whatever.... They mimick a "black hole" somewhere in Europe or Russia I believe (this happened like 1 month ago). Observers of the universe (people with telescopes) claim that there is something about to happen in 2012. It has something to do with the alignment of the planets, I believe? Mayan calender stops at exactly that time.


I first thought this is all a coincidence and that there will be some kind of light at that date which made people believe it was god (god and jesus are often visible in front of light beams) And natural disasters happen throughout history so each different civilization made up one big story and it's been translated several times.
However, I seriously do believe we are all screwed. And I am a rational guy. I've always been fascinated by maths and compared to most people I'm surrounded by, I have a high IQ! Ive never been naive and I have a skeptical mind.

What if earth "gets hit" every 3600 (or 5200?) years by something we havent discovered yet. Maybe all the planets start to vibrate? Is that possible? Isnt magnetism the only real "force" on earth? Isnt magnetism something different than all the natural elements we are surrounded by every day? What if it gets really strong or fades away rapidly? Do we really know what's going on inside earth? Maybe all this is just another natural cycle? The cycle of what we call our universe.

I would like to know why this isnt possible. Do I misinterpret history? ( I didnt pay too much attention during school) Is ot possible that during the last switch something else also happened which isnt about to happen this time because it's simply not here? Maybe there was another planet at that time which caused disaster during the switch which is now long gone? By "switch" I mean the alignment of the planets each 3600 years.

I almost forgot another interesting thing: Is it true we had a little ice age during the mid ages? around 1600 I believe? Is it true the earth is heating up during the last 100 years? Constantly, without up and down peaks? Is it true a volcano omits a whole heap of dirty gas? Is KYOTO a big load of crap?

Thanks for reading!

Hi MS-20, welcome to BAUT.

Wow, that's a lot of questions. I'm not sure I can cover all of them at once.

First, a piece of advice. Religious topics, either pro or con, are strongly frowned upon around here (it always leads to fights), so you should probably avoid that topic.

There is absolutely no evidence that the earth gets hit every 3600 or 5200 years. And no, magnetism is far from the only force on Earth. The magnetic field of the Earth does change over very long spans of time, but it doesn't cause any disasters.

As far as claims that "something" is going to happen in 2012, there is absolutely no evidence of anything happening out of the ordinary. The Mayan's were a very interesting stone age civilization, but there is no reason to believe they had any insights that we don't have, and that any turnover in their calendar is any more significant than you buying a 2009 calendar on December 31, 2008.

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All moderation in purple

IMHO,
are of great contrast to

Seriously, if you do want to ask a question, or present your own idea, please tone down a little bit. Everyone will be much nicer to you if you ask politely, and do not pretend to be smart.

However, I recommend look through a list of 2012-related threads compiled by 01101001 here.

Please do remove mentions of religions and such. They're against the rules.

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Regards,
RegisteredUsername

If something hits you, it will not hit you again.
And civilization had survived far longer than 5200 years, so even if there IS something cyclic that hits us, it'll be pretty minor.

No, it requires massive amount of energy to do so. It'd be easier to simply crash a planet.

Furthermore, a vibration is a pretty complex motion, and aren't so easily caused by a single passing object.

There are 4 fundamental forces, and electromagnetism is just one of them. So in the sense, yes, electromagnetism is different from the other forces. There is no evidence that it will get strong or fade away rapidly any time soon.

There had been geomagnetic pole reversals, but it is not cyclic, and it takes thousands of years to complete.

We model the environment inside Earth. We observe the lavas and try to get an idea about what's underground. We have theories that pretty much what inside Earth will be like. Again, there is no evidence of any of such cycles.

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Regards,
RegisteredUsername

I don't think he was being impolite or acting smart. He was being honest and offending no one at all. Your reply annoyed me more than his questions . . .

Over-all, yes. It's pretty clear to see the patterns in human behavior if one looks objectively.
Such as blaming demons for illness.

This is not correct.
You're referring to the Large Hadron Collider (LHC). The LHC had some technical difficulties and has had to shut down for repairs.
No high energy experiments have been conducted and no Micro Black Holes (mBh)Produced by it.
When the LHC is running again, next year, it's no guarantee that it will produce any mBh's either. Nor have they mimicked a Black Hole.
What they are trying to Mimic is the conditions of the Early Universe.Who?
I am not aware of any observers with telescopes making that claim.
The 2012 claims seem to be produced by people that DO NOT make observations with telescopes.
Neither of these statements are accurate either.
The claim is that the Sun will be in alignment with the Galactic Plane. Which happens every year anyway. There is no planetary alignment- and even if there was, it wouldn't make any difference.
The Mayan Calender does Not Stop in 2012.
It Rolls Over.
The same as the Julian Calender Rolls Over every year starting at January First again.
So that too, is bunk and based on their misunderstanding of how the Mayan Calender works.
We would have discoevered that by now.
Planets Vibrating? No- not possible and that sounds very goofy to me. What made you even think of that?
Nope, it isn't. And no, it won't just go away.
The magnetic field is driven by the structure of the Earth and its elements. You cannot just up and take it away.


I have no idea what you're trying to say here.

I won't comment on Kyoto, but the rest is not true.
The Earth has increased in CO₂ in the last 100 years and has increased in over-all temperature. However, there have been ups and downs. It's spiked- dropped- the change in the last 100 years is general and Overall an upward trend- but not steady.
Volcanoes do emit lots of gasses- they always have- But I think you're asking if they have been doing so more than normal- which is not true.

No, it's a real city in Japan.

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"If you think the LHC will create black holes, you might as well believe Hobbits are at the bottom of your garden."- Dr. Mike Inglis
Rovers forever! - ToSeek

Thanks for your input. I wasnt trying to be a smart ***, at all

I have a few extra Q's!

Do we know what triggers an ice age? Do we know why animals instantly froze long time ago?

What is up with the mid ages little ice age some 300 years ago? What happened then?

If a sudden polar shift is possible, caused by another planet, this has to be periodically at a certain time, no? Because otherwise we wouldnt "match up" with the rest of our solar system, right? So a planet crossing our solar system randomly is just not possible?

Is time an element of nature? Or is it something we made up?

Yeah!

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edit

Only one polar cap has to melt.

The other one is floating already. Sorry, I am not helping am I?

edit

corrected ;--)

That's quite a story. Where are you getting this stuff? The solar maximum happens (and has been happening) roughly every 11 years. Why haven't we seen these effects before?

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Umm, you do realize that this is kind of against Rule 11, right?

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Weather is somewhat chaotic so small influences can sometimes have large effect. In general, science believes a reduction in the amount of sun light reaching the earth is the cause of ice ages. Look at this website for a brief explanation: http://culter.colorado.edu:1030/~saelias/glacier.html

There are several theories about the cause of the so-called "little ice age" in the middle-ages which you can read about here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age#Causes

This is a common myth. The animals did not freeze instantly. If they had, their flesh would be preserved but in fact, every thawed carcass has been found to be in advanced decay which means the animals were dead long before they froze. Some mammoths were found with undigested food in their stomachs and so some have claimed they were flash frozen, but we now know that pachyderms often take long periods of time to fully digest their meals.

By the way, only a small number of frozen mammoth carcasses have been found. Hardly evidence of a global event. Look at this article for a level-headed discussion: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woolly_...Frozen_Remains


Sudden pole shifts are nearly impossible unless something from outside the planet causes it, like earth being struck by an object of sufficient mass at just the right angle and velocity. Such an impact would likely devastate the planet and kill all life. There is no evidence it has ever happened.

Is it frozen to the ocean bed at any location? If not, why doesn't it float about the oceans instead of staying in one place? Or maybe it does drift ever so slightly?

Seeriously, if it is truly floating, why doesn't it move at all?

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Don of Borg - Cool, Calm, Collective.

"Within the next generation I believe that the world's leaders will discover that infant conditioning and narco-hypnosis are more efficient, as instruments of government, than clubs and prisons, and that the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

Except maybe for the one that created the Moon, right?

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Don of Borg - Cool, Calm, Collective.

"Within the next generation I believe that the world's leaders will discover that infant conditioning and narco-hypnosis are more efficient, as instruments of government, than clubs and prisons, and that the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

I think this has gone on long enough to have earned its own copy (and a place in) the list of some BAUT Forum topics, and some allied articles, that have addressed predictions for the year 2012:

1. 2003 no, 2012 si
2. 2012
3. End of Mayan Calendar
4. Pole shift / Planetary alignment 2012?
5. 2012 alignment question
6. about the Mayan 2012 item
7. 2012 Debunking?
8. Possible asteroid impact in 2012?
9. 2012 asteroid?
10. We don't have to worry about 2012!
11. More on 2012 from India Daily
12. 2012 Completion of conspiracy?
13. Here's what's REALLY going to happen in 2012...
14. crop circles, Planet X and 2012
15. Planet X, crop circles and 2012 cataclysma
16. According to the Mayans, what will happen on 23rd Dec. 2012?
17. More 2012 Nonsense
18. NEO 2012?
19. Dangerous NEO in 2012?
20. Christmas 2012
21. 2012 mayan calender end of world
22. Regarding the supposed polar shift/new ice age in 2012
23. New 2012 threat?
24. 2012 look at this thing on the sun
25. Russian Expert Predicts Global Cooling from 2012
26. Pole shift idea origins
27. Dec 20 2012
28. 2012 Stuff
29. Horizon Project-New End of World Scare?
30. Date: December 21st 2012
31. Earth passing thru Galactic center in 2012 - didn't that already happen?
32. 2012: What do you think well happen (if anything)
33. So what will we see in 2012?
34. Galactic Tsunami?
35. Plane of the ecliptic of the galaxy?
36. Earth's Magnetic Field & 2012
37. 2012?
38. Any truth to this?
39. How can the sun be aligned with Galactic centre?
40. the whole 2012 poles flip nonsense
41. Planet X Official Advertisement
42. What year are we in
43. Quick question about the sun
44. Galactic Alignment
45. Books of 2012! -
46. 2007 = 2012
47. Return of Planet X By Rand
48. Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.
49. Toutatis 4179: 2012?
50. Galactic Alignment in 2012 ?
51. Solar Storms
52. A real prediction!
53. NIBURU - Brown Dwarf, The DESTROYER
54. 2012 Galactic Alignment
55. Not 2012 again! But I cant help it~
56. New evidence for 2012 TEOTWAWKI!!!
57. this may be a silly question but...
58. Just to know if this is true
59. Just Wondering...
60. Planet X/Nibiru, is it real?
61. Youv heard this a million times.
62. Nibaru or Planet X
63. Mayan calendar
64. 2012 Article?
65. can i say something please on planet x
66. Nibiru
67. The growing earth.... :P
68. Our Solar System's Eclipse of the Galactic Plane on Dec 21, 2012?
69. Something scaring the hell out of me....
70. It's Only the end of the World AGAIN!!! (Woo Woo Alert)
71. 2021 Doomsday
72. is it just me or is the milky way brighter..?
73. Polar Shift in 2012?
74. I would like to ask about Nubiru stuff...
75. Bit behind the times, my appologies...
76. the "pole shift thing"
77. All the Truth about 2012
78. Confused about 2012 (yes, another one!)
79. Another paranoia mind due to 2012

Universe Today: No Doomsday in 2012
Bad Astronomy Blog: 2012, the year nothing will happen
Universe Today: 2012: No Planet X
Universe Today: 2012: Planet X is not Nibiru
Universe Today: 2012: No Killer Solar Flare
Universe Today: 2012: No Geomagnetic Reversal

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MS-20, as has been mentioned, editing posts top alter their content is not allowed.

11. Editing & Revisionism

Edit your posts with care. There's no problem with editing a post later to change the tone or to correct spelling and the like. But changing content is not allowed! This is a slippery path that can be seen as revisionism. You may edit your post for up to 24 hours. Also, when quoting other posters, you may trim the text down to brief snippets to address something in particular, but do not misquote others or alter their content to suggest they've stated things which they haven't.

If you wish to retract something you posted previously, either post the retraction as a new message, or edit the original message by indicating what you wish to retract without removing it.

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Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
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There are parts which at least seasonally connect to land in Canada, Alaska, Greenland, Russia, etc.

That said, I would guess that the mass as a whole is given enough energy to break these anchors drift at least slightly. But it's still cold enough that the ocean surfaces freezes as it is exposed, while the southernmost regions warm up, break off, and drift away.

There is also cyclic expansion and contraction, which I'm sure also influences movement and apparent movement of the cap as a whole.

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If you're going to tell people the truth, you'd better make them laugh. Otherwise they'll kill you. - George Bernard Shaw

But I think that was before Earth had life.

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I want to go back to the moon.
I don't care which rocket you use, whichever one you pick, I'll like it, I swear.
"If you think the LHC will create black holes, you might as well believe Hobbits are at the bottom of your garden."- Dr. Mike Inglis
Rovers forever! - ToSeek

The moon is estimated to be about 4 billion (4000 million) years old.

I know it's all hoopla, but the November 21, 2008 entry on GonzoScience has a nifty intro to what appears to be an upcoming movie that's called (what else?) 2012.

Only 79? Not 80? Is there a reason why you accumulated so many links, or is it just an anti-2012 hobby?

Just curious...

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If I set the budget, we'd have Ares and more. Unfortunately, I don't set the budget, and Ares is just too expensive and too far out for us to accomplish our goals within the budget we were given.

If we halt the ISS, all versions of Ares, and transport Orion and Altair aboard DIRECTv3's Jupiter family of Shuttle-Derived Launch Vehicles, we just might make it back to the Moon by 2020.

Well! Today's your lucky day! You can change all that right here.

Bon Appétit!

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If I set the budget, we'd have Ares and more. Unfortunately, I don't set the budget, and Ares is just too expensive and too far out for us to accomplish our goals within the budget we were given.

If we halt the ISS, all versions of Ares, and transport Orion and Altair aboard DIRECTv3's Jupiter family of Shuttle-Derived Launch Vehicles, we just might make it back to the Moon by 2020.

There is a reason the list grew and is growing from its original size. It snowballs. Each time the list seems to be needed, I copy the previous list and add the current topic. That procedure made it grow to the current so-many size.

The original size was determined by how many topics I could find which addressed year-2012 predictions, at the first time I noticed the need for the list's creation. I do believe it was inaugurated in article in topic 2012: What do you think well happen (if anything). It then comprised 29 links to topics.

If people stopped creating new year-2012 topics, the list would stop growing. I do not expect the needs to reproduce it to end until at least 2013.

Maybe I shall cruelly stop satisfying the needs before that though. I don't know. Maybe I'll change my procedure to not add new links -- in which case the list's static nature would make it a candidate for stickyhood. Maybe the approaching pole flip will disrupt electrical power delivery and the Internet will die and the list will die with it. Maybe when BAUT and GLP merge, I, even with my armada of robots, won't be able to keep up with the need to propagate it.

The future's not ours to see -- especially when it comes to year 2012 stuff. (Will I be pretty? Will I be rich? Que sera, sera.)

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I think the thing MS-20 is refering to in the 1600's might be the climate change that Climatologists call "The Little Ice Age" I think it was supposed to have run between the 16th century to some point in the mid 19th century.

Could that be what he meant?

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Mission Control : "Please don't kick the robot Bill. "

We may never know. MS-20's last acts, over a month ago, seem to have been deleting the contents of some recent posts and then posting no more. That's probably not the activity of a new member who has recognized BAUT is a fine forum well worth participating in.

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You're about a week late. The trailer was mentioned on the thread here over a week ago.
The gonzo site had it the day toothdust participated there. Coincidence?

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Numbers are not case sensitive. (me)

I came across all this 2012 crap a few months ago and initially it was all bothersome, it all sounded so scientific etc., but after much searching for intelligent websites such as this (and links to others) for rational explanations I knew this was a massive hoax and a cash grab. Is there anyone else out there that has my problem, that I am 99.9% convinced the whole thing is a fraud, but that 0.1% will still bother me.