Last week I posed a hypothetical scenario of "can the shuttle fly to the moon?"

Remember, everything potentially adressed here is theoretical and has no basis in reality, its just the old "what-if?" game.

I enjoyed the responses so much to the hypothetcial shuttle mission, I would like to pose another hypothetical question:

What would YOU do, if you accidentally stumble across real, scientific, hard evidence, that the entire Apollo program was fraudulent?

Do you; Keep it to yourself? tell someone? tell everyone? Dig deeper? Go through life with a heavy heart, but move on to other passions?

I know this is a very sensitive topic, so it is ok if nobody wants to even respond to this question, I am just bored and had this thought.

I would cry, ask for a tax refund (that my parents and grandparents paid). Then find proof that the constellation program is for real. If it is, I'd donate my new found refunded tax dollars to NASA. If it's also a hoax, I'll either vacation in Iceland or buy a ticket on Virgin Galactic.

If I had real evidence, I would bring it forward. No doubts. No hesitations. Faking Apollo would have been wrong. Assisting in the covering up of history would be evil.

__________________
Gillian

"Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

"You can't erase icing."

"I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

But, what if you had real concerns for your safety? I mean a good percentage of America would be quite upset with you, both public and private.

And how would you bring it forward exactly?


An analagous thought; if an alien UFO crashed in your backyard, what the heck do you do about it? Do you phone the police? Stash a few fragments? Tell your friends and Neighbors? Continue living as normal, telling nobody, ultimately realizing YOU now know aliens are real.

OK, lets complicate things (anytime I start boring you with my what-ifs, let me know ill stop), what if you discovered that ALL images and video of Apollo are fake ("are" fake or "is" fake, not sure about that one), yet the possibility that the mission itself was authentic still exists, but that mission was obviously performed totally in secret from the general public.

Again would you keep that to yourself? Tell someone? Tell everyone? What would you do?

Yes I to agree with 'Gillianren'., That putting aside the facts and going with your posts idea. If I found 'Proof' that the entire Apollo program was a fraud. I would be very angry. The administration and, the people would be brought to justice. A crime of that magnitude against humanity could not be brushed aside.
Fortunately this is not so and can be proven to be a fictitious in every regard.

.

Understood. But would you be at all concerned about your safety?

My mother has a saying that goes like this "you can be right, and you can be dead right" or something like that.

Is it worth living or dying over, of if you felt threatened in some way, a real life endangering threat, would you just leave it alone?

I expect some people could keep quiet about it, but I'd spread the word. Keep in mind that for me to feel certain about it, I'd probably have had some long talks with JayUtah and a few others. The people I'd be spreading it to would be people I'd trust to make their own very critical assessments of the material.

__________________
Forming opinions as we speak

__________________
At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

One Earth, One Sky - IYA 2009
All moderation in purple

Sorry, I was torn about which forum to post it in, and didnt realize it had been covered before. Any location works for me.

I would not want you to stop asking daft questions... just slow down a bit and let us discuss the issue raised... Your questions are interesting as thought provoking 'what ifs' can be. As for answering your last... barrage. No,. I do not consider personal danger. They do not know of me. I am in no danger until my name is before those that might want me not to tell... and its way to late once I have. That is surly the point of being absolutely clear of your facts. Absolute proof.
Is, are, should have been were or even was. Its past tense. ie; Images were found to be fraudulent. It was false...
No My personal risk. ( dead right ) would not force my silence. I would consider that my duty to inform. I would have been in the phone to internal affairs already. I would take my 'proof to the CIA or equivalent body...Involving lawyers and film crews.

daft (daft)

adjective

silly; foolish
insane; crazy

If this is how you feel, dont post. If I felt someone asked a daft question on a message board thread, I would feel no need to provide a response. Unless you are just trying to get a little insult in along the way to tell the viewing public "Hey, look at me, I am honest and fair enough to respond, but we all know this is a practice in sheer stupidity".

it can also mean "merry; playful; frolicsome"

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/daft?jss=0

ETA: I'll leave it to astromark to explain how he may have meant it.

__________________
Defining science can be difficult. It’s a method, a way of looking at things. It’s a compendium of facts, knowledge, data. It’s a tool, used to investigate the world and to make sure we don’t let our biases, egos, and wishes get in the way of finding what’s real. Science (and skepticism) boil off the dross and leave the pure nugget of reality. ~Phil Plait

Hey, what would I do if I found out there were pink elves hiding in my gas tank, plotting the overthrow of the free world?

I dunno...it would be fun to think about, but it is still a silly (daft) question.

What would YOU do, if you accidentally stumble across real, scientific, hard evidence, that the entire Apollo program was fraudulent?

What type of evidence are you talking about?

"Hard scientific" evidence is the kind that already existing showing it was authentic. The conspiracy theorists have fallen all over themselves trying to show how "scientifically" impossible a Moon mission would have been. In doing so they show only how little of science they actually know. All the scientific evidence is in, and it's decidedly one-sided. There isn't going to be any technical or scientific epiphany to change any of that.

What you might mean is historical evidence. That is, someone who was part of it or witnessed it, and can prove by documentary and similar means that fraud occurred. That is, at this point any case to be made for fakery has to accept that it was technically and scientifically possible, but just wasn't done for whatever reason. You need physical evidence of fakery. You need documentary evidence of fakery. You need eyewitness testimony. Those are the kinds of things that would unseat the common acceptance of the Apollo story.

Do you; Keep it to yourself? tell someone? tell everyone? Dig deeper?

First you dig deeper, because extraordinary claims still require extraordinary proof. Sam Colby, for example, thinks he has historical evidence that Apollo was faked. What he has, however, is simply certain photos, records, and documents that talk about simulations and training exercises. That is, he parlays evidence of a "legitimate" fake (because that's what training simulations are) into trumped-up claims of faking the actual missions.

If the deeper you dig, the more evidence of fakery you discover, then you are onto something. If you simply find inconclusiveness or the trail peters out, then you discount it; the evidence of success still outweighs it. When you think you have a case, you publish it and let other historians see what holes they can kick in it.

You still need a whole solution, though. Evidence of fakery has to be balanced against evidence of authenticity. If some whistleblower comes forward and says he participated in a hoax, and has documents to show how it was done, and photographs of the place where it happened, you still have to explain all the evidence. Just because someone has what appears to be a good case doesn't mean that he isn't the one creating a hoax. He has to provide a preponderance of evidence, not just a coupe of good zingers.

It's not a sensitive subject. Conspiracy theorists wrongly believe that Apollo defenders hold their opinions largely out of nationalistic pride or nostalgia or other emotional reasons. If the preponderance of evidence turns out in favor of a hoax, any reasonable person -- including me -- would hold to the hoax interpretation. There's no embarrassment in having to change one's mind, so long as one's mind is always made up based on the evidence available at the time. Right now the evidence is very strongly in favor of Apollo. If that were to change, my mind would change.

__________________
"Facts are stubborn things." --John Adams
Clavius Moon Base

Even if my life were threatened, or I had any doubts about my personal saftely, I would put the evidence forth without a second thought.

CJSF

__________________
Two years ago moved from my town
I was looking up past the city lights
But the city lights got in my way

See the constellation ride across the sky
No cigar, no lady on his arm
Just a guy made of dots and lines

-from "See The Constellation"
by They Might Be Giants

I wouldn't be able to believe the evidence. I wouldn't even be able to
evaluate it. So I would ask about it here on BAUT and show it to other
knowledgeable people I know, to get their opinions. Assuming that the
nature of the evidence allowed it to be put in a post, I would do so, and
it would thus be accessible to everyone, and I'd have to get all spiffed
up for the news reporters showing up at my doorstep:



-- Jeff, in Minneapolis

.

Attached Thumbnails

 

__________________
http://www.FreeMars.org/jeff/

"I find astronomy very interesting, but I wouldn't if I thought we
were just going to sit here and look." -- "Van Rijn"

"The other planets? Well, they just happen to be there, but the
point of rockets is to explore them!" -- Kai Yeves

Thank you all for taking the time to pay attention to me and my wandering mind, until next time, take care!

How many people have even heard of Bart Sibrel? I mean, he was on The Daily Show, but enough crazies end up there that most people have already forgotten him.

As has been said, I'd start here. I'd work very hard to test the validity of my evidence. Once I felt confident enough about it, I would contact every legitimate news agency I could. They don't pay attention now, but if I had enough evidence to convince me, there would be enough evidence to get it noticed.

First, I'd have to have a backyard. But what I'd do then would be the same basic thing. I would take a lot of clear pictures from a lot of different angles. I'd contact the science department up at UW to take a look at it. Examine the evidence and present it, just like anything else.

Further, you want "all the images and video are fake," because that's plural.

And finally, no, I wouldn't be afraid for my safety. Why would I?

__________________
Gillian

"Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

"You can't erase icing."

"I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

Umm, wait! What would you do?

__________________
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge" -- Charles Darwin
"Your right to hold an opinion is not being contested. Your expectation that it be taken seriously is." -- Jason Thompson
Meet the OOONG TOE.

Asking this question is a bit like asking, "What if you learned that the Sun doesn't exist."

Sure, you can consider the far reaching possibility in your brain of some wild and implausible scenario to explain how the Sun couldn't exist and how come so much solid evidence shows that it does...

But the question would remain absurd.

There's no point in answering such a thing, really.

Neverfly has it about right, in my opinion. I don't mind the speculative question, but it is akin to discovering proof World War Two was a fake, or finding a working sheet of Cavorite. Questioning the reality of Apollo is so over-the-top that ANYTHING that happened in the past (and everything has happened in the past) must similarly be capable of such questioning. Did you really have a cup of coffee this morning? Does Europe exist (I've never seen it)? Do YOU exist?

Doubting Thomas can sometimes go a bit too far.

__________________
If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about the answers.

I agree. That's why I was a little disappointed to see the question dropped in our laps by OP, without providing his own answer, or attempt at it.

__________________
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge" -- Charles Darwin
"Your right to hold an opinion is not being contested. Your expectation that it be taken seriously is." -- Jason Thompson
Meet the OOONG TOE.

The question itself is so pointless as to be not even hypothetical. Hypothetical questions, to be of intellectual interest and challenge are typically things which COULD happen. This could not.

The answer, for what it's worth, should be self evident. Those who spend their time rebutting the lies the Apollo Hoax proponents spread are doing it, because they want people to hear and understand and know the truth.

If that truth happened to be something else, those same people would spend their time helping making sure people heard, understood and knew this 'new' truth instead.

For it to be indisputable proof, then it must be solid from many different scientific and technological viewpoints. I don't see how anybody has such a wide field of expertise to make that kind of determination.

Therefore, there must be many people in respected positions that are already in the same position. So; no matter what that evidence is, or how that evidence has come to me, I see no way that there wasn't already a solid base of this knowledge being out.

About all I could do, is participate with the others, and contribute in an area of my own expertise.

If it were that solid, then there would be no problem getting the scientific community to agree. Scientists are not automatically government shills. They have to work within scientifc principles, not political aims.

__________________
Numbers are not case sensitive. (me)

Oh, I doubt that.

__________________
At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

One Earth, One Sky - IYA 2009
All moderation in purple

Moderation in most things.

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis

__________________
http://www.FreeMars.org/jeff/

"I find astronomy very interesting, but I wouldn't if I thought we
were just going to sit here and look." -- "Van Rijn"

"The other planets? Well, they just happen to be there, but the
point of rockets is to explore them!" -- Kai Yeves

If, and thats a big if i found my self in such a position.

I'd not care one wit what any other person thought of it. Not my Problem.

As far as Safety? I'd excersise my right to defend myself. I suspect after a few object lessons the rest of them would get the hint.

__________________
There is no problem that cannot be solved by a suitable application of high explosives - US Army Demolitions School

I just saw Hayley's comet, she waved, Said "why you always running in place? Even the man in the moon disappeared, Somewhere in the stratosphere" - Shinedown

http://worldsofothersuns.home.comcast.net/

With the whole 'personal safety' flourish I'm wondering if the OP was trying to get responders to say they would conspire to hide the truth under some extreme circumstance? Since no one bit that would explain the hasty exit.

Given the amount of money I'd be selling the information to the media for, I think I'd be able to hire a small band of mercenaries to look after my personal safety while I sipped margaritas on my new private Caribbean island.