Why do we have ATM here?

[sirius0]

Perhaps there could be a section titled BAUT think tank validated contributions to science. Where any thread of any section is copied to. Provided the author of relevant paper has actually participated and believes that the discussion assisted them.

Originally Posted by nauthiz

Ooh, ooh let me guess - and then the thread will have to be locked 'cuz it's now in off topic and therefore in violation of the rules, right?

[Moose]

Originally Posted by EDG_

Did your hypothesis provide this sort of exact prediction at all?

Perhaps this conversation shouldn't be taking place outside of ATM?

[astrocat]

Originally Posted by EDG_

Seriously. Why exactly do we have an ATM forum here? Have any ATM ideas proposed there ever been validated? Have any ATM "theorists" ever admitted they were wrong? I'm finding it hard to see any possible benefit there could be to having an ATM board here - it's certainly not educational.

Maybe because it's so popular... Apart from 'Casual Babbling' more people are viewing ATM than just about any other.

[EDG_]

Originally Posted by Moose

Perhaps this conversation shouldn't be taking place outside of ATM?

True, but then he bought it up as an example... but yes, any further discussion of the specifics of his ideas should be in ATM.

[baric]

Originally Posted by EDG_

Seriously. Why exactly do we have an ATM forum here? Have any ATM ideas proposed there ever been validated? Have any ATM "theorists" ever admitted they were wrong? I'm finding it hard to see any possible benefit there could be to having an ATM board here - it's certainly not educational.

If there were no ATM forum, then the woo woo trolls would clutter the Astronomy & Science forums, screaming "censorship" and creating much forum drama when their posts were deleted or locked.

With an ATM forum, we keep the useful forums clear of clutter and give the occasional intrepid soul an opportunity to go jostle in the ATM forum, if they want.

Me? I just ignore it.

[John Mendenhall]

Originally Posted by captain swoop

Like talk.origins on Usenet. day after day patiently explaining and correcting the same debunked ideas and misconceptions.

Yes, ATM attracts many who have lots of ideas and very little knowledge. There are many stickies at the start of ATM about logic and rules and what to expect if you ATM post, but they don't seem to have much effect. Hmm, let me back up and look at ATM for a moment.

edit: OK, after reviewing the ATM stickies (a discouraging process, I might add. Try the post by Wisp.) I feel the above paragraph is confirmed. Perhaps we could use another sticky that reviews current mainstream cosmology, and emphasizes that the mainstream was not made up on a web posting site, but represents the combined observations and analysis of the human race, checked and verified again and again. The ATM ideas that I have the least patience with are the variations on 'Einstein was wrong!', by posters who have no idea what special or general relativity are about, and probably can't pass a high school physics class.

Enough, I'll come back and rant more later.

[Dutch]

a 30 days limit makes no sense at all, if the subject at hand has to do with interdimensional correlations that can only be detected indirectly in our reality. The HDDesign wasn't properly debunked during these 30 days and just after the thread was closed new important developments took place as anticipated and posted on the timeline here at this forum. I can't post about it though. A real breakthrough in our understanding of reality won't take place here I'm affraid.

[R.A.F.]

Originally Posted by Dutch

The HDDesign wasn't properly debunked during these 30 days and just after the thread was closed new important developments took place as anticipated and posted on the timeline here at this forum. I can't post about it though.

Well, Dutch...if indeed you have new important developments, then you should PM this information to a mod. If they decide that these "new developments" are worth discussion, then they will reopen your thread.

[01101001]

Originally Posted by Dutch

a 30 days limit makes no sense at all, if the subject at hand has to do with interdimensional correlations that can only be detected indirectly in our reality.

Right. In those cases, the limit should be 3 days. No, 3 hours.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by 01101001

Right. In those cases, the limit should be 3 days. No, 3 hours.

In this case 3 seconds. that's all it takes to come to the conclusion that you don't even want to consider the possibility the HDDdesign material could be valid.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by R.A.F.

Well, Dutch...if indeed you have new important developments, then you should PM this information to a mod. If they decide that these "new developments" are worth discussion, then they will reopen your thread.

done

[John Mendenhall]

Originally Posted by Dutch

done

I don't recall this one (HDDesign?) What thread, closed or otherwise?

Thanks, John M.

[triplebird]

Originally Posted by Fraser

The ATM serves several valuable purposes...

ATMs are valuable, but they're also expensive if they're not owned by the bank that holds your account.

Oh, not that kind of ATM.


Seriously though, I'd rather that the ATM and Conspiracy forums are there to contain the woo-woo(?) than let it spread through out the board. Imagine, say, every thread about future lunar exploration being filled with Apollo Hoax proponents, or every thread about possible interstellar travel filled with "Einstein was wrong" proponents. If you don't want to read the ATM forum, don't click on that link and it won't bother you.

[01101001]

Originally Posted by John Mendenhall

I don't recall this one (HDDesign?) What thread, closed or otherwise?

Expired 2007 May 18.

Hyper Dimensional Design

[John Mendenhall]

Originally Posted by 01101001

Expired 2007 May 18.

Hyper Dimensional Design

Thanks, now I remember, and I'm working on suppressing it again.

[Dutch]

You can suppress it, but it will come to the surface again.
In that thread I posted my expectations for June 2. I posted months ago on this forum to keep an eye on Mladic, Karadzic etc, and those politically responsible for the Srebrenica massacre. During the anticipated timeframe the number 3 of the most wanted list Tolimir was arrested and the Dutch government was sued. Out of nowhere, exactly as anticipated. Only mentioned once on the timeline. It is ridiculous if such 'in the face' confirmations can't be discussed because the 30 days are over.

[01101001]

Originally Posted by Dutch

You can suppress it, but it will come to the surface again.

Can we keep the ATM out of About BAUT? Thanks.

[Van Rijn]

Originally Posted by R.A.F.

Well, Dutch...if indeed you have new important developments, then you should PM this information to a mod. If they decide that these "new developments" are worth discussion, then they will reopen your thread.

R.A.F., stop being mean to the moderators!

[Dutch]

I'm on your ignore list Van Rijn, since you dismissed your own 'September 8' subconscious contribution to the HDDesign material. As you might expect, I have no problem with 'indirect communication'.

[Maksutov]

Originally Posted by Van Rijn

R.A.F., stop being mean to the moderators!

He's not being mean, he's just alerting them to new "interdimensional" possibilities!

Think how bored and frustrated the mods must get, with all the chaff they have to wade through.

Then comes a special opportunity for comic relief, in the form of fortune telling.

Wouldn't you want to support your local moderator and alert himer to a really pleasant diversion?

Of course you would.

[Tinaa]

Dutch stop posting your ATM ideas in About BAUT.

[Peter Wilson]

Originally Posted by EDG_

Have any in the history of this board been validated by observational data?

No, but have some perspective.

Can anyone name the journal that Einstein published his Special Theory of Relativity in? What came of it, anyway? Go back to the 10 years prior to 1905, EDG_, and browse the journal's archives. What will you find? Mountains of "useless physics" and a whole lot of stuff that is just plain wrong.

Its easy to imagine that if we put you in the time-machine and sent you back to 1905, you just might convince the publisher that the journal was "Worthless...not one useful paper has come of it."

I might be exaggerating, but I'm guessing that the journal that published Einstein's original Special Relativity paper published only one significant physics paper in its entire existance. Likewise, if only one astronnomical mystery is ever solved/explained in BAUT's ATM section--even if it takes decades--it will have served a purpose.

[01101001]

Originally Posted by Peter Wilson

I might be exaggerating, but I'm guessing that the journal that published Einstein's original Special Relativity paper published only one significant physics paper in its entire existance. Likewise, if only one astronnomical mystery is ever solved/explained in BAUT's ATM section--even if it takes decades--it will have served a purpose.

Yeah, you might be exaggerating.

Wikipedia: Annalen der Physik

Annalen der Physik is one of the best-known and oldest (since 1790) physics journals worldwide.
[...]
Many very important articles about scientific discoveries have been first published in the journal, including Albert Einstein's Annus Mirabilis Papers in 1905 that provide much of the foundation of modern physics.

Some of the most famous papers published in Annalen der Physik were:

• on the photoelectric effect by Heinrich Hertz in Annalen der Physik 33, pp983-1000, 1887.
• on the theory of blackbody radiation by Max Planck in Annalen der Physik 4, p553 ff 1901.
• on energy quanta by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik 17, pp132-148, 1905.
• on Brownian motion by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik 17, pp549-560, 1905.
• on mass-energy equivalence by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 17, pp639-641, 1905.
• on the special theory of relativity by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 17, pp891-921, 1905.
• on the heat capacities of solids with quantized energy levels by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 22, pp180-190 and 800ff, 1907.
• on molecular motion near absolute zero by Albert Einstein and Otto Stern in Annalen der Physik, 40, pp551-550, 1913.
• on the general theory of relativity by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 49, pp769-822, 1916.

In the early 20th century Germany was the centre of physics research in the world. Annalen der Physik was published in German like most of the scientific physics-related literature of that time.

[hhEb09'1]

Originally Posted by Peter Wilson

No, but have some perspective.

I hope 01101001 has provided you with that

Sure, there are rare surprises, but almost all advances come from the mainline--hard work by specialists in the field. Pretending otherwise--especially about Einstein's work--is not going to help ATM get where it needs to go.

[Celestial Mechanic]

Originally Posted by Peter Wilson

No, but have some perspective. Can anyone name the journal that Einstein published his Special Theory of Relativity in? What came of it, anyway?

Annalen der Physik. It is still being published, now in English, by Wiley and Sons.

Originally Posted by Peter Wilson

Go back to the 10 years prior to 1905, EDG_, and browse the journal's archives. What will you find? Mountains of "useless physics" and a whole lot of stuff that is just plain wrong.

Its easy to imagine that if we put you in the time-machine and sent you back to 1905, you just might convince the publisher that the journal was "Worthless...not one useful paper has come of it."

From the Wikipedia entry for Annalen der Physik:

Some of the most famous papers published in Annalen der Physik were:

• On the photoelectric effect by Heinrich Hertz in Annalen der Physik 33, pp983-1000, 1887.
• On the theory of blackbody radiation by Max Planck in Annalen der Physik 4, p553 ff 1901.
• On energy quanta by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik 17, pp132-148, 1905.
• On Brownian motion by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik 17, pp549-560, 1905.
• On mass-energy equivalence by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 17, pp639-641, 1905.
• On the special theory of relativity by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 17, pp891-921, 1905.
• On the heat capacities of solids with quantized energy levels by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 22, pp180-190 and 800ff, 1907.
• On molecular motion near absolute zero by Albert Einstein and Otto Stern in Annalen der Physik, 40, pp551-550, 1913.
• On the general theory of relativity by Albert Einstein in Annalen der Physik, 49, pp769-822, 1916.

Wow, that's quite some list! Annalen der Physik is not bird-cage liner like Galilean Electrodynamics or The Journal of Theoretics!

Originally Posted by Peter Wilson

I might be exaggerating, but I'm guessing that the journal that published Einstein's original Special Relativity paper published only one significant physics paper in its entire existance. Likewise, if only one astronnomical mystery is ever solved/explained in BAUT's ATM section--even if it takes decades--it will have served a purpose.

We'll wait while you wipe that spot of egg off your face.

Edited to add: I've just reached one kilopi (3,142) posts with this one.

Edited again to add: ToSeeked by 01101001!

[hhEb09'1]

Originally Posted by Celestial Mechanic

Edited to add: I've just reached one kilopi (3,142) posts with this one.

Some fireworks!!

[Peter Wilson]

Okay, maybe Annalen der Physik was a bad example...

[hhEb09'1]

Originally Posted by Peter Wilson

Okay, maybe Annalen der Physik was a bad example...

Maybe it was a bad idea.

We'll grant that there can be rare instances of what you are talking about, but to take a random paper, especially famous ones, and look over its pedigree--well, that's probably not going to work.

[Jim]

Originally Posted by Dutch

You can suppress it, but it will come to the surface again.
In that thread I posted my expectations for June 2. ...

Dutch, you PMed me yesterday asking for permission to reopen your thread and post your new information. Without waiting for a response, you posted that information in an unrelated thread outside ATM.

Bad form.

Tinaa has warned you. Consider yourself lucky she got to you first.

[John Mendenhall]

Originally Posted by Dutch

You can suppress it, but it will come to the surface again.
In that thread I posted my expectations for June 2.

Dutch, have you got an open thread? I don't want to take this one off topic. Anywhere, doesn't have to be UT.

Thanks, John M.