Principal offenders

[Neverfly]

Originally Posted by davidlpf

Very well played, I bow to you. I wonder how much more damage I can do here without Neverfly?

Guilty.

<raises hand.>

[HenrikOlsen]

Originally Posted by Arnold Layne

The board doesn't have customized rank titles, does it?

It does, but it also has automated title changes, so if someone got a customized title and then hit kilopi, the title would (as far as I know) change to Order of Kilopi.

[peter eldergill]

Originally Posted by HenrikOlsen

It does, but it also has automated title changes, so if someone got a customized title and then hit kilopi, the title would (as far as I know) change to Order of Kilopi.

Does that mean I can make my title Sir Peter Eldergill????

Oohh..how about "Ceritfied Genius"???

Heh

Pete

[Gillianren]

Gillianren, super genius!

Wait, that would mean war.

[PetersCreek]

Dibs on Artiste de Charcuterie

But we digress...

[mugaliens]

Hi. My name is Mugs and I am a principal offender. I offended several principals in my youth.

Though I think some of them were more amused than offended, as they were trying not to smile/laugh...

Originally Posted by Nereid

Nereid has no sense of humour ... every EU proponent (chained or otherwise) is united on this ...

1. I think Nereid has a sense of humor.

2. If your statement is true, I must not be an EU proponent.

**

"Princip** offender" could be either "principle" as in "a primary source," or "principal" as in "most important, consequential, or influential."

Either way is fine, but the context suggests that "principal" would be more appropriate, as it's the form used in "the principal ingredient" and "the region's principal city."

**

Gillianren: "I think it is extremely discourteous to make broad sweeping statements about a field wherein you obviously know very little."

Good post, by the way - thanks for taking the time to craft it!

That sounds a great deal like two recent critiques of my contributions to the board...

"I am infuriated by people who don't put real effort into their posts."

Agreed. It's board clutter. On the first board I ran, our focus was meaningful contribution to the topic, and we admins generally selected the topics. Any detraction from meaningful contribution, including snips at others, one-liners, fluff (word salad), etc. was simply replaced by a rather impolite (by today's standards): "Content was a poor substitute for rational thought, eloquent discourse, and logical construct" (or something along those lines). But the next sentance, "Look around and try again!" was exact.

Sort of rude, eh? Oh, well - online message forums were in their infancy then...

"However, there are some people who are systematically posting opinions in threads where they admit to ignorance and don't care."

You mean comments such as, "I'm a newbie, and know next to little about astronomy or physics, but I'd like to share with you my pet theory about how Einstein was full of marbles..."

That sort of thing? If so, I've noticed they're shot down by other members in fairly short order. If not, it's because they feedback loop is broken and they're not reading the responses - something I think is the most rude thing of all.

[mugaliens]

Me: "If not, it's because they feedback loop is broken and they're not reading the responses - something I think is the most rude thing of all."

Seriously, when others take the time to craft a response to your points, and in a polite, objective (non-personal) manner, whether you agree with the response or not, choosing to ignore it is the forum equivalent of looking away and moving away when someone you know walks up to you and says "Hello."

That's incredibly rude, and in my opinion, haughty, demeaning, snobbish...

Those who engage in this behavior are usually those who appear to have low self-esteem in the first place, and perhaps not enough strength of character to extend grace beyond their inner circle of "frinds," i.e. those who make them feel good.

I believe it's important that we all at least try, without quitting, to at least respond to the comments of others as they're directed our way, regardless of how we personally feel about the comment or the commentator. It's our ability to separate personal feelings from rational, objective thought which comprises a principal difference between ourselves and the rest of anamalia.

Intentionally ignoring another merely reflects an ignorance of the overarching issues, and in my opinion, is one of the principal offenses seen on this board.

Other principal offenses:

1. Taking potshots are ATM/CT-ers instead of asking clarifying questions or refuting their claims with proven science.

2. Rude behavior/comments, particularly those designed to inflame another.

Oh, I'll think of more, but right now my beans are done cooking!

[grant hutchison]

Originally Posted by mugaliens

Seriously, when others take the time to craft a response to your points, and in a polite, objective (non-personal) manner, whether you agree with the response or not, choosing to ignore it is the forum equivalent of looking away and moving away when someone you know walks up to you and says "Hello."

Originally Posted by mugaliens

I believe it's important that we all at least try, without quitting, to at least respond to the comments of others as they're directed our way, regardless of how we personally feel about the comment or the commentator.

How many times do you suggest we try? When the comment is unobjective, and the commentator repetitive? It strikes me that BAUT might also be a happier place, with fewer suspensions and bannings, if people just learned to ignore each other a little better.

Grant Hutchison

[Gillianren]

Regarding a few people, I've no way of knowing if they've aimed a comment at me unless someone else quotes it.

[ineluki]

Originally Posted by Swift

Keep it to broad user types,

Ok, I'm quite annoyed by those who

- assume we, the users, are all stupid and follow the Mainstream jsut because it is Mainstream
- assume the mods are evil and out to censor their great ideas
- assume the owners of the board are either evil or stupid to let the mods act this way
- but somehow are really obsessed of promoting their theories here.

If pretty much nobody agrees with one's ideas how the board should be run, there should be a point when one should accept that and find a more suitable place instead of complaining over and over again how unfair one is treated.

[Gillianren]

I mean, I understand that creative criticism is a helpful thing. But when your criticism isn't taken on board and isn't going to be, there comes a time where you either have to live with things or walk away. Personally, I love it here; it's almost the only place on the entire internet I post. I can imagine, however, a time when I couldn't stand to be here and had to leave, and I like to think I'd know when that time had come. There would, for starters, be a lot less of a feedback process than there is now.

[mahesh]

Oh Gillian!

[R.A.F.]

Originally Posted by Gillianren

...when your criticism isn't taken on board and isn't going to be, there comes a time where you either have to live with things or walk away.

Wiser words are seldom spoken, unfortunately not everyone sees things that way.

[mugaliens]

Originally Posted by grant hutchison

How many times do you suggest we try? When the comment is unobjective, and the commentator repetitive? It strikes me that BAUT might also be a happier place, with fewer suspensions and bannings, if people just learned to ignore each other a little better.

Grant Hutchison

I was speaking of a first response, not a nagging one.

[Ara Pacis]

Originally Posted by Gillianren

I mean, I understand that creative criticism is a helpful thing. But when your criticism isn't taken on board and isn't going to be, there comes a time where you either have to live with things or walk away. Personally, I love it here; it's almost the only place on the entire internet I post. I can imagine, however, a time when I couldn't stand to be here and had to leave, and I like to think I'd know when that time had come. There would, for starters, be a lot less of a feedback process than there is now.

There's no reason to leave permanently. I often leave for months at a time. Forget why I left and come back, and sometimes it's just that I was busy to too sick to bother. I've left and come back several times where things changed dramatically. Twice I've left and come back to forum software changes. I left once and came back to find it renamed and discover lots of mods and the loss of the BA. I stuck around. And all this despite being involved in some of the worst and most confusing unpleasantless many posters around here might remember.

[captain swoop]

People come and go from websites all the time, new interests, work, relationships. Because someone stops posting doesn't mean they don't like a site anymore.

[Neverfly]

Originally Posted by captain swoop

People come and go from websites all the time, new interests, work, relationships. Because someone stops posting doesn't mean they don't like a site anymore.

Heh...

[davidlpf]

Originally Posted by Neverfly

Heh...

I think the captain means normal people unlike us.

[Neverfly]

Originally Posted by davidlpf

I think the capain means normal people unlike us.

Oh!



Actually, I know quite a few posters that quit because they disliked the board.

[davidlpf]

I can think of one or two off the top of my head too but there are a few that have not posted for awhile because situations in their lifes.

[Tobin Dax]

Originally Posted by Neverfly

Actually, I know quite a few posters that quit because they disliked the board.

Sure, but there are also a number of people who have disappeared for other reasons.

[grant hutchison]

Originally Posted by mugaliens

I was speaking of a first response, not a nagging one.

I must have misunderstood. When you wrote

Originally Posted by mugaliens

... try, without quitting ...

I assumed there was necessarily some repetition involved.

Grant Hutchison

[grant hutchison]

Originally Posted by Neverfly

Actually, I know quite a few posters that quit because they disliked the board.

So do I. It seems like a pretty sensible and utterly unsurprising thing to do.

Far more unexpected are those people who seem to stay because they dislike it here.

Grant Hutchison

[HenrikOlsen]

Originally Posted by grant hutchison

Far more unexpected are those people who seem to stay because they dislike it here.

Perhaps they like that this is one of the few places on the internet where they can complain about the place without getting banned for it.

[aastrotech]

Originally Posted by HenrikOlsen

Perhaps they like that this is one of the few places on the internet where they can complain about the place without getting banned for it.

With the caveat of not publicly posting specific exemplary evidence to support the complaint. That way the complaint can be denied due to lack of evidence.

[01101001]

Originally Posted by aastrotech

With the caveat of not publicly posting specific exemplary evidence to support the complaint. That way the complaint can be denied due to lack of evidence.

Provide the evidence to the moderators or the proprietors. They're the people you need to convince.

[aastrotech]

Originally Posted by 01101001

Provide the evidence to the moderators or the proprietors. They're the people you need to convince.

Already did that.

[Neverfly]

Originally Posted by HenrikOlsen

Perhaps they like that this is one of the few places on the internet where they can complain about the place without getting banned for it.

I would have agreed to this and replied quite differently had I not seen this first:
BAUT banned/suspended posters log

The post does not say where his infraction occurred. And I have not yet read all the new replies in threads yet (Woke up late this morning).

But if it was regarding his posts yesterday in the Forum Feedback forum and after Swift specifically replied to me that this forum was where people could do that...

Then it seems your statement may not be accurate.

[Tinaa]

aastrotech has continued to complain about our extreme moderation yet will not show specific examples. I know I've made mistakes when moderating. I've also tried my best to fix those mistakes. That is hard to do when I don't even know the specific mistake I made.

I think aastrotech simply disagrees with the moderation. He doesn't have specific examples; he just doesn't like it.

I would have have classified his suspension as a Rule 14 violation.

The moderators and administrators reserve the right to take action against a poster who is disrupting the normal flow of the board. This includes violations listed in the other rules (trolling, use of ad hominems, posting copyrighted materials, etc.), but may also include behavior we have not yet foreseen. Since this rule is perforce general, we will attempt to correct the problem by warning the violator (via PM, email, or posting in the thread) and giving him/her a chance to explain his/her behavior, and we will take further action only if proven necessary.

my bold

[01101001]

aastrotech is suspended now, not banned.