If I knew I would have passed that information to someone who asked the same question.

I find the racetrack interesting with nobody able to give an answer

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Actually, I think I guess at the the best mechanism.

It probably comes from living in a cold climate where one can watch sheets of snow and ice slowly slide of roofs, mountains, hills, etc...

As ice slides off the mountains when conditions are correct (the earth warmer then freezing point, and death vally has a ton of ambient ground heat)
The ice slowly sliding down the mountains pushes the the ice in the valley away from the mountains.

Sometimes this can be in almost a strait line, sometime due to ice sliding off other mountains, or due to fracturing (similar to ice sheets in the poles), the direction of travel of the ice sheets change.

Rock and Boulders caught in the ice sheets, are moved along with it.

No wind required, and really not all that mysterious.

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There is no problem that cannot be solved by a suitable application of high explosives - US Army Demolitions School

I just saw Hayley's comet, she waved, Said "why you always running in place? Even the man in the moon disappeared, Somewhere in the stratosphere" - Shinedown

http://worldsofothersuns.home.comcast.net/

When I first saw the suggestion that ice was involved, I thought they were going to say that the expansion of water as it freezes (just about equally in all directions in a flat shape) was the culprit. Freezing ice in a small container can burst the container...

Cant see how a frozen sheet of ice no thicker than 2-3 inches can enable the wind to move 500lbs rocks.

I've seen the wind blow a car, with its handbrake off, along a flat road. Cars weigh far more then 500kg. I have also see the result of a wind gust blowing a tanker unit over, and seen footage of very strong winds picking up truck trailer units.

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Howling from the Shadows

It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. --- JayUtah

You can't reason an irrational person out of an irrational belief. --- Noclevername

Apollo: The History and the Hoax
Enter the World of Athran

Well while wind is a possibility... It's not as likely as my explaination, with ice sliding down the slopes pushing the ice on the plain around.

I'll go with the simplest explaination for now. This kind of activity occurs every winter in northern climates, but usually our mountains and hills have vegitation preventing the snow or ice movement.

With out vegitation, such as our volcanic peaks, plowed hills, and rock quaries. Snow/Ice packs sliding slowly down hills or mountains is quite common.

Those mountain in death valley are fairly barren, with the expection of a josua tree or two per acre if luckly, and maybe a "Digger Pine" tree every mile or so.

I used to have a "Digger Pine" cone, but don't know what happened to it. It even had seeds in the cone which was/is a rare find.

__________________
There is no problem that cannot be solved by a suitable application of high explosives - US Army Demolitions School

I just saw Hayley's comet, she waved, Said "why you always running in place? Even the man in the moon disappeared, Somewhere in the stratosphere" - Shinedown

http://worldsofothersuns.home.comcast.net/

My question on it would be "How common is snow and ice on the hills of Death Valley?" The reason they are looking at ice on the floor is that the water settles in the dry lake bed and overnight freezes, I'm not sure that the same would be true of the hills around it.

__________________
Howling from the Shadows

It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. --- JayUtah

You can't reason an irrational person out of an irrational belief. --- Noclevername

Apollo: The History and the Hoax
Enter the World of Athran

Jim, that's life, but not as we know it.

I believe that the wind and moisture can move small stones and rocks, even considering the ice sheets. the larger of the boulders is probable given more extreme conditions but harder to visualize. Floating ice sheets, broken up into sizeable sections is the most probable. Shame anybody hasn't taken the time to do day time lapse video thoughout the winter season.

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As was mentioned earlier. Which rocks do you watch? The area is huge.
And frame rate? Lets say for instance, you want a 10 hour video thats around 1M frames. Over about 100 days that's about 6s per frame. Depending on distance, you may miss it completely.
You'd need some fancy motion detection triggered equipment to catch the actual movement. So far, nobody thinks it's enough of a mystery to warrent that kind of effort. (along with the security to make sure it remains safe)

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Numbers are not case sensitive. (me)

Huh? Ya lost me. What did I say that draws this response?

BTW, here's a video, not of the rocks moving, but offering an explanation of water, ice and wind.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1hoi...elated&search=

Summarizing, the dry lake fills with water from a rain shower/snow melt. The wind blows a thin sheet of water across the valley. The dropping temps freeze the water. The wind blows the ice and rocks.

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Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
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There is never that much Snow/Ice there. the mountains can be essentially covered, but it is always patchy and normally melts in place as even during the coldest winter days the direct sun will melt snow and ice on the hill sides. If it were packs sliding down the hills as a mechanism there'd be a whole lot more rubble building up on the lake bed from the talus on the slopes.

For whatever reason I’ve never liked the ice explanation it just would never be coherent enough over a big enough area, and like phantomwolf said, you will need to add the weight of the ice to your mass that the wind needs to push. Water as a lubricant is definitely involved, IMO, but the exact mechanisms I can’t even agree on my own opinions.

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Wind, small rocks, moisture and a slimy surface. This I can understand for small rocks. Some of the boulders are upto 500lbs. An ice sheet is a smooth surface and in a short period of time "winter" is not sufficient enough time for a boulder upto 500lbs to be dragged across a surface to gouge a track.

There is obviously something happening and probably very straight forward, however, nobody seems to have footage or a defined answer.

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Thank God for magnetism.

[quote=Jim;869973]Huh? Ya lost me. What did I say that draws this response?

Star Trek, the Klingon song. Spock says "Thats life Jim but not as we know it"

Just a little humour.

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Thank God for magnetism.

About 20 years ago I read a science fiction story about moving rocks. The "explanation" was that the earth was mad at humans exploring other worlds and the rocks went and destroyed a launch site. Enough to put you off science fiction, neh?

At last, someone talking sense........

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Thank God for magnetism.

If you're going to deliver a punch line, you need to give the set up, too.

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Never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
Isaac Asimov

Thought it didn't need a set up....


To smile is to accept defeat or plead ignorance
"Sean Clayden" 21st Nov 2006

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Thank God for magnetism.

Having seen the place first hand, there was absolutely no evidence of 700 pound rocks, nor paths left in the mud from rocks that size. So I would like to see the evidence of those before I buy the claim in PW's article. Second, if there was any ice involved, the mud trails would not occur. If the ground is dry, it is hard as cement. When wet, there are footprints in it. The lake bed has to have that inch of wet mud one gets when rains have occurred for the rock trails to be left when they move.

It's the wind, there is no mystery. The calculations claiming 175 MPH wind would be needed would have to include good evidence of large rocks. I suspect they didn't have that evidence but I will keep an open mind about it. On the other hand, if true, then I'd say measure the winds.

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The ground is level as a pancake. No reason for an ice sheet to move.

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You would have a hard time leaving your camera. There are people driving through the area all the time. We went. We saw several other people there. It was Nov.

It isn't floating ice sheets, there aren't any 500 lb rocks, it's the wind, it's obvious. The only mystery is in why so many people want to make something more mysterious than it is.

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