Chatroom
 

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Forum > Space and Astronomy > General Science
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

   

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-March-2007, 01:37 PM
Argos's Avatar
Argos Argos is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: 22°20'42"S / 49°03'14"W
Posts: 6,879
Default Yet another FTL claim.

They say it´s been published on Nature...
__________________
There’s probably no God. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-March-2007, 01:49 PM
Blob's Avatar
Blob Blob is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,410
Default

Hum,
by going faster than light you could possibly go backwards in time,
but i`m not sure that that this would make this a new story.
__________________
`Irony` actually does mean `metal like`...
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-March-2007, 02:41 PM
Sylas Sylas is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Newcastle, Australia
Posts: 291
Default

This is a dramatic example of a case where an absorptive medium can transmit waves with a group velocity exceeding c. In such a medium, the complex refractive index has a non-zero imaginary component.

It's the pulse shape that goes faster than the speed of light, although it still can't actually be used to transmit information.

You can read more about it under group velocity at Wikipedia.

Cheers -- Sylas
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06-March-2007, 10:56 PM
Ingo Ingo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 102
Default

There has to be something faster than light
__________________
Nikon D200
Nikon D50
Nikon 300mm F4D ED-IF AF-S
Nikon 50mm F1.8
Sigma 70-200mm F2.8EX DG Macro
Sigma 24-70mm F2.8EX DG Macro
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 03:08 AM
LucasVB's Avatar
LucasVB LucasVB is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Uberlândia, Brazil
Posts: 134
Default

That article is 7 years old!
__________________
"I am accustomed, as a professional mathematician,
to living in a sort of vacuum, surrounded by people who declare
with an odd sort of pride that they are mathematically illiterate."
— David Mumford
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 03:22 AM
BigDon's Avatar
BigDon BigDon is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 4,367
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LucasVB View Post
That article is 7 years old!
Well I guess that shoots this in the foot.
__________________
Gimme a minute to read through Jay's latest observations...
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 03:36 AM
Blob's Avatar
Blob Blob is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,410
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LucasVB View Post
That article is 7 years old!
Hum,
these temporal paradoxes still makes me laugh though...
__________________
`Irony` actually does mean `metal like`...
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 08:10 AM
snarkophilus's Avatar
snarkophilus snarkophilus is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,094
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LucasVB View Post
That article is 7 years old!
Doesn't that prove that it works?
__________________
"It's turtles all the way down."
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 12:14 PM
Argos's Avatar
Argos Argos is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: 22°20'42"S / 49°03'14"W
Posts: 6,879
Default

I´ll pay attention to the small letters next time... And stop trusting Slashdot.
__________________
There’s probably no God. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 06:26 PM
PetersCreek's Avatar
PetersCreek PetersCreek is online now
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Peters Creek, Alaska
Posts: 786
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by snarkophilus View Post
Doesn't that prove that it works?
I'd be more impressed if it were -7 years old.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 07-March-2007, 11:28 PM
cyswxman's Avatar
cyswxman cyswxman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cheyenne,Wy - Like no place on Earth!
Posts: 1,566
Default

or 7 years anti-old??
__________________
"It's time to receive our missions from The Head."
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 07:24 PM
trinitree88 trinitree88 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 2,479
Wink stick to basics...

I'll just stick to basics. No particle has ever been observed traveling faster than light in the (neutrino sea/ vacuum), none, nada, nix, nope, and ain't gonna happen if you intend on keeping SR, Hendrik Von, and Albert happy, either...not to mention Ken G, Tim T., Grey, Celestial Mechanic, Antoniseb, SpacemanSpiff,...and a host of others. pete
__________________
A third rate theory forbids
A second rate theory explains after the fact
A first rate theory predicts...A. Lomonosov
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 08:29 PM
satori's Avatar
satori satori is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Umnak, Aleutes
Posts: 539
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylas View Post
This is a dramatic example of a case where an absorptive medium can transmit waves with a group velocity exceeding c. In such a medium, the complex refractive index has a non-zero imaginary component.

It's the pulse shape that goes faster than the speed of light, although it still can't actually be used to transmit information.

You can read more about it under group velocity at Wikipedia.

Cheers -- Sylas

Sylas, you are right of course! The give away passage.........

Quote:
The NEC experiment caused a pulse of light, a group of waves with no mass, to go faster than light.
came right at the first page. Why else should you begin to talk in that way about a light puls!! Obviously the work of a science reporter who did only grasp part of what was served to him at Princton....
As I have also forgotten more than half of it since I learnt it, I will go and study the wikip. article.............thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 08:47 PM
satori's Avatar
satori satori is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Umnak, Aleutes
Posts: 539
Default

the wikip. article seems to be a little faulty
first group velocity is defined as the speed of the wave (group) envelope
from that what follows you can infer, that a medium which is apt to yield a greater than c group velocity would neccesserily alter the shape of this envelope and by that very fact invalidating the worthiness of the definition of group velocity as given at the outset.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 10:06 PM
Grey's Avatar
Grey Grey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,208
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by trinitree88
...and ain't gonna happen if you intend on keeping SR, Hendrik Von, and Albert happy, either...not to mention Ken G, Tim T., Grey, Celestial Mechanic, Antoniseb, SpacemanSpiff,...and a host of others.
Don't be silly. I'd be delighted to find out that we could travel or communicate faster than light. I just think that it's fantastically unlikely.
__________________
Conserve energy. Commute with the Hamiltonian.
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 11:03 PM
satori's Avatar
satori satori is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Umnak, Aleutes
Posts: 539
Default

so, you would be delighted then, to see causality and logic be blown to smithereeeeens......................shame on you, shame i say!
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 11:15 PM
Grey's Avatar
Grey Grey is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,208
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by satori
so, you would be delighted then, to see causality and logic be blown to smithereeeeens......................shame on you, shame i say!


To answer semi-seriously, though, obviously if superluminal movement is possible, it can't really result in serious problems for causality, or we'd see those effects already. It would certainly mean a serious revision (or maybe even a complete scrapping) of relativity, but I'm sure that some bright person would sort it all out and figure out why the universe hasn't vanished in a puff of acausality and illogic.
__________________
Conserve energy. Commute with the Hamiltonian.
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 11:23 PM
Sam5 Sam5 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,591
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LucasVB View Post
That article is 7 years old!
Yeah, but the article hasn't been written yet!
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 11:36 PM
satori's Avatar
satori satori is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Umnak, Aleutes
Posts: 539
Default

Grey, i seem to have reached the sclerotic age, were i would be unable to let go of the strict "the Lorenz Transformations are Fundamental" axiom (hardwired in my axons)!
There were bytheby better takes at offsetting the c-vac.=const. law. One group claimed (claimes?) to having proven that the tunnelling of photons "didn't take time" ((some sort of smile))............I don't know, how they haved fared since then with that..........anyway! It would at least look to me more promissing to seek small deviations from the pure law in the quantum realm, than to go on the lookout for something as outlandish as a warp scale correction of "c=c"

Last edited by satori; 14-March-2007 at 11:49 AM. Reason: typo correct.
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 13-March-2007, 11:44 PM
satori's Avatar
satori satori is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Umnak, Aleutes
Posts: 539
Default

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

(i did smile allready today (see post above), but that one saves my day, Sam5! (at 2332 lokal time.............. just in time))

Last edited by satori; 14-March-2007 at 11:50 AM. Reason: typo correct.
Reply With Quote
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 14-March-2007, 08:45 PM
Launch window's Avatar
Launch window Launch window is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,924
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cyswxman View Post
or 7 years anti-old??
evidence of time-travel
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread