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Old 15-October-2007, 05:34 AM
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The_Radiation_Specialist The_Radiation_Specialist is offline
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Default What causes this - Seeing fast moving objects

The next time you're on the road (and not driving yourself ) notice a car's wheels fast turning. As you see the rotating wheel look at an area to the left of the wheel and quickly move move your eye pointing to the right of the wheel. Then for a split second you can see the shape of the wheel and the patterns, as if it has stopped.

This experiment can be conducted on any other fast moving/rotating object.

My question is what causes your eyes to see fast changing shapes in a split second when you move your eyes across it quickly.
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Old 15-October-2007, 12:20 PM
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Interesting.
Not something I've seen myself, but I wonder if it has something to do with the suppression of image processing during saccadic movement. Your visual cortex shuts down for a tenth of a second or so while you shift your gaze (otherwise you'd see a rapid lurch in your visual field). It backfills the gap with a static "frame" from your new fixation point. So I'm wondering if what you're noticing is that static tenth of a second.

Some more, related, visual tricks:
You can detect the visual processing shutdown by looking at yourself in a mirror and shifting your gaze from the reflection of one eye to the other. You can't see your own eyes move, despite the fact that you can see movement very readily in another person.
And you can detect the backfill, although not predictably, by glancing at a watch with a sweep second-hand. Most people have had the sensation of looking at a watch and thinking it has stopped, only to see the second-hand make a tick after what seems longer than a second. What's happened is you've caught the second-hand just after a movement, and the sensory backfill in consciousness has prolonged the apparent gap before the next tick.

Grant Hutchison
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Old 15-October-2007, 01:48 PM
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You can also do this with ceiling fans on a high speed by following the tips, it creates a strange stutter where the blades flicker between a blur and sharp contrast. Blinking rapidly does it too.

I didn't know about the sensory suppression, I had noticed the long second hand pause but had just attributed it to timing.
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Old 15-October-2007, 07:06 PM
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I can see my own eyes move in the mirror. Well, *one* eye can watch the other move. I've always been borderline "lazy eye" since I was a kid, and that allowed me to learn how to move my eyes independently which I've exploited for comedic effect.

What's going on is I'm very left-eyed (doesn't that correlate with the opposite handedness; that is, if you're right-handed, you tend to be left-eyed?), and when I'm looking at something closely, my brain will start ignoring the right eye, and it can easily just "relax". I learned how to consciously let an eye "relax", ignoring the input, and I can move it while continuing to ignore the input. If I ever lock in on its signal so to speak, I loose that ability.

However, the funny thing that works only works close up. For far field, my right eye is actually better than the left, and it actually dominates. IOW, one eye is nearsighted and the other is farsighted, or something like that.

-Richard
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Old 15-October-2007, 07:09 PM
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You can also do this with ceiling fans on a high speed by following the tips, it creates a strange stutter where the blades flicker between a blur and sharp contrast. Blinking rapidly does it too.
Yes. Rapid eye-blinking or turning your gaze away and then rapidly returning your gaze to the spinning object is similar to the strobe-light effect.
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Old 15-October-2007, 07:54 PM
grant hutchison grant hutchison is online now
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I can see my own eyes move in the mirror. Well, *one* eye can watch the other move.
Ah, this is good.
If you can shift eyes independently, then presumably you're shutting down only half your visual cortex at a time, so your consciousness is able to access a stationary view of the opposite eye moving.
Now we need you to try The_Radiation_Specialist's experiment, using this same trick eye movement. If his transient stationary view does have something to do with saccadic suppression, then we'd predict you wouldn't be able to see it.

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Old 15-October-2007, 07:57 PM
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I can see my own eyes move in the mirror. Well, *one* eye can watch the other move. I've always been borderline "lazy eye" since I was a kid, and that allowed me to learn how to move my eyes independently which I've exploited for comedic effect.

What's going on is I'm very left-eyed (doesn't that correlate with the opposite handedness; that is, if you're right-handed, you tend to be left-eyed?), and when I'm looking at something closely, my brain will start ignoring the right eye, and it can easily just "relax". I learned how to consciously let an eye "relax", ignoring the input, and I can move it while continuing to ignore the input. If I ever lock in on its signal so to speak, I loose that ability.

However, the funny thing that works only works close up. For far field, my right eye is actually better than the left, and it actually dominates. IOW, one eye is nearsighted and the other is farsighted, or something like that.

-Richard
I actually have the exact same thing with my eyes. And yea, I'm right handed and left eyed (makes shooting a gun kinda hard heh). The other advantage with have a slightly lazy eye is it makes those "Magic Eye" 3-D art images "pop out" pretty easily, especially if my eyes are tired after working on the computer all day.
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Old 15-October-2007, 08:00 PM
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The other advantage with have a slightly lazy eye is it makes those "Magic Eye" 3-D art images "pop out" pretty easily, especially if my eyes are tired after working on the computer all day.
I can see them very easily. I read somewhere that women are better at seeing those images than men. Anyone know this to be true?
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Old 15-October-2007, 10:10 PM
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I can see them very easily. I read somewhere that women are better at seeing those images than men. Anyone know this to be true?
I can never see those things at all, and I'm pretty danged manly if I do say so myself...
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Old 15-October-2007, 10:51 PM
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I can never see those things at all, and I'm pretty danged manly if I do say so myself...

<insert obligatory comment regarding androgynous appearance of Neverfly's avatar here>
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Last edited by Kelfazin : 15-October-2007 at 10:52 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 15-October-2007, 11:06 PM
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Quote:
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I can never see those things at all, and I'm pretty danged manly if I do say so myself...
<insert obligatory comment regarding androgynous appearance of Neverfly's avatar here>
<And add that Neverfly's avatar carries a very, very large sword. Almost as if he's making up for something ... >
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Old 15-October-2007, 11:08 PM
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... danged manly ...
For some reason, I read that as "dangly manned" the first time around, which was a little alarming.

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Old 15-October-2007, 11:09 PM
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I actually have the exact same thing with my eyes. And yea, I'm right handed and left eyed (makes shooting a gun kinda hard heh). The other advantage with have a slightly lazy eye is it makes those "Magic Eye" 3-D art images "pop out" pretty easily, especially if my eyes are tired after working on the computer all day.
I've never been any good at those Magic Eye things. Just can't see it. If I know what it's supposed to be, and you draw it out without the noise, I can make myself see it but otherwise I can't.

The trouble there is I can't see the forest for the trees. Always been like that. Show me something with lots of little detail, and my processing system is just going to obsess with those details. A blank wall could entertain me for hours, looking at the tiny little patterns in the sheetrock, paint, wood whatever. And no, I'm not the type who likes exicitement. A pyschologist friend of mine told me that was all related -- I don't need lots of excitement, interaction and fun because I can get all my little circuits can handle at the slightest thing. Sort of like HDTV input or something. However, unplug me totally from sensory input, and I'd be a raving lunatic in hours.

Heck, I remember my parents saying that when I was little tyke, they noticed I was literally starting at a blank wall. Well, it wasn't blank, but some knotty pine panelling that had a rich pattern of knots and wood grain. They discovered that if I was crying or something, all they had to do was bring me in that den and I'd quiet down, enthralled with that pine knot pattern.

However, I can make a face out of just about any pattern I see, if you give me enough time. Stare at something long enough, and I'm gonna make out the face of the lion about to eat me, I guess. Cars and trucks all have facial expressions to me.


-Richard
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Old 15-October-2007, 11:25 PM
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While I'm on weird little details, have any of you noticed differences between your eyes? For example, look at something and close one eye and alternate. There are subtle differences in color and "tone" there with me. It varies. I remember looking at the moon one night, and noticed my right eye was picking up more "dull reds", while my left eye didn't pick up on it as much, yet it got more of the "sharp blue" part.

-Richard
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Old 15-October-2007, 11:41 PM
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Well, I'm out of practice with the crazy eye maneuver, now it seems. I can still decouple my eyes easily enough, but if anything moves too rapidly in my field of vision, there's a strong reflex to lock in on the motion and instantly resync them. And that "jolt" is giving me a headache. It would take some practice to fight that reflex.

What I used to enjoy doing was to wear sunglass, and try to look as stern and business-like as possible, then remove them and have my eyes looking in opposite directions, or have one eye "crossed" toward the nose, and the other off to the side. Or just sit there listening to someone speak, intently staring at them and then let one eye wander off.

-Richard
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Old 16-October-2007, 01:29 AM
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If you wear glasses, stand with the sunlight and look up. Your eyes will hurt, so only do it for a few seconds at a time, but you'll see some tiny rainbows.
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Old 16-October-2007, 01:40 AM
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If looking at the 3D images , my nieces and nephews ranges from 5 - 7 years old are the genius in doing it in just a couple of seconds! They can easily spot the boat over some look alike a forest or the Lion over the chimpanzees.
They even bought the BOOK because they can't just get enough.

At first I have a hard time looking at those. It needs practice.

It's as if you're looking at the picture see through and ur mind is getting blank.
That's how I do it and the picture floats and appears.

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Old 16-October-2007, 01:43 AM
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3D rocks! I have a 3D book about the Titanic that never fails to blow my mind.
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Old 16-October-2007, 01:45 AM
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At first I have a hard time looking at those. It needs practice.
It's as if you're looking at the picture see through and ur mind is getting blank.
That's how I do it and the picture floats and appears.

Yes. I have to relax my eyes and sort of gaze through/beyond the picture. Then the images pop out - but it takes me a few seconds.
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Old 16-October-2007, 02:14 AM
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