Okay, but just one.

10 minutes before landing per MSNBC.

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Theory and practice are 2 different things of course . Well, in this case the main gear was up to the task. I don't know whether it is an obligation, but I wouldn't be too surprised by it.


According to CNN:

I'm not a pilot myself, but that seems a rather good choice considering you're flying an A-320 .

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He flew around for several hours dumping fuel before landing. Or was this mentioned?

I read that on CNN yes. I thought the quote was funny because you should always land an A320 main wheels first. Only this time he kept the nose wheel up as long as possible.


Edit: watched the video again. Ouch poor nosegear, half of it is just skidded off .

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Dang it, I'm getting tired. If anyone sees the pregnant lady talking, please post it here.

I noticed that too. I somehow think thats not an emergency procedure!

Ive heard that this model has such a small difference between take off weight and maximum landing weight that it doesnt have the capability to dump fuel. Not sure if this is true but it would explain the flying to burn off a bit of fuel if true

The A320 can dump fuel. HOwever, over populated areas and below a minimum altitude it isn't allowed (unless it is very critical I guess). At least on some planes, certain flaps positions don't allow for fuel dumping.

Anyway, dumping fuel could still be handy for an A320:

you take off, and hit an ULM. Result: left MLG gone, left wing a bit damaged, left engine a bit damaged. You want to land FAST. But your wing will probably hit the ground. SO you "quickly" dump almost all of your fuel and come in on fumes. Reduces the risk for a big fire A LOT.

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MSNBC mentioned that the pilots had the passengers and luggage moved to the back of the aircraft to reduce the weight on the front gear. That also helped him keep the nose up as long as possible after touchdown.

Heck of a piece of flying.

The Yahoo News article said the captain jokingly apologized for putting the front gear "six inches off the center line".

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Relight the Firefly!

"It is quite clear that Occam's razor does not sharpen in your pyramid." (Nicolas)

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." (Paul Simon)

In this case, though, there was no hurry. Flying around for awhile carried no extra risk, and gave time for thorough planning and "mental rehearsals" of the landing.

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"It is quite clear that Occam's razor does not sharpen in your pyramid." (Nicolas)

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." (Paul Simon)

Me thinks the great legends are about to begin. Luggage moved? Who moved it?

Passengers not buckled in? Maybe, but I doubt it.

Voila .

Candy: "hand luggage" I think.

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Oh, the webs we weave...

I want to smack the press on insinuating such nonsense!

If I'm wrong, I will lather my face with whip cream during TAM3!

What would be so impossible about asking the passengers to take their hand luggage with them when they are moving to the rear seats (in case the plane wasn't totally full of course ).

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Oh, I was thinking cargo luggage. I still think this is far fetched. Let the cream begin!

cargo luggage would be rather "cumbersome" to say the least

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Obviously I meant carry-on luggage. Cargo luggage is inaccessible during flight, as far as I know.

And the passengers were not stacked in the aisles like cordwood, just moved to seats as far back in the aircraft as possible.

Let's not get silly, folks...

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Relight the Firefly!

"It is quite clear that Occam's razor does not sharpen in your pyramid." (Nicolas)

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." (Paul Simon)

That was what I assumed, Donnie B.

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Sorry, I'm sleepy.

I still need more information than just chat. Do you have a link?

Interesting swipe at Six Sigma. Doesn't fit the description of how the principles are applied in our shop though. It occurs to me that there are pretty wide parameters for the application of the principles, and tools, but we consider risk mitigation extremely important, and the finance people do not get to decide anything alone. Their input is part of most decisions, but is only one of many factors. Actually, I'm amazed at the amount we do spend on risk mitigation. But we are almost never down, and that is very good for our bottom line in the long run.

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"Within the next generation I believe that the world's leaders will discover that infant conditioning and narco-hypnosis are more efficient, as instruments of government, than clubs and prisons, and that the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

Try this:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9430871/

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Relight the Firefly!

"It is quite clear that Occam's razor does not sharpen in your pyramid." (Nicolas)

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." (Paul Simon)

It's funny how BBC World have more or less randomly been talking about circling for hours to "dump" fuel, and circling for hours to "burn" fuel.

Burning the fuel when you're in no hurry definitely makes most sense to me, and if they'd dumped the fuel there'd be no reason to stay up for hours.

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I guess, they first circled until the case was investigated and decisions taken and then went to dump fuel before landing. It would be silly first to dump fuel and then "Hey, we need another two hours to prepare the runway for the emergency landing!".

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Not really. It was a transcontinental flight. They had fuel for six hours of flying time (at least). So three hours' worth of burnoff represented about half the total fuel load. Still plenty of time for adjusting the plans.

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Relight the Firefly!

"It is quite clear that Occam's razor does not sharpen in your pyramid." (Nicolas)

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." (Paul Simon)

hey guys

jetblue flight 292 was headlined in our e standard, london newspaper, early editions this a.m!!....pretty good coverage, but we are grateful that all the travellers are in one piece, though shaken...bless them.

but what's this about landing..... 'back wheels first'...i thought all planes, except sopwiths, have always landed with back wheels first...how else does one land?

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clear skies

If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe. CARL SAGAN

Mak: Pass the pepperoni please.
Fazor: "Hail, Bautainia! We pledge our hearts to thee! Science and woo, some babbling too, and astron-oh-meee!"
slang: And it made ash out of yew and tree.

That's how it is for companies that inherited the GE/Jack Welch version. That version means squeezing the system to get all the possible value now, and to hell with the future. I try not to fly on aircraft with GE engines.

Re "we are almost never down", that is part of the Welch "vision": push the stuff out the door no matter what. If you don't deliver something, then there are no accounts receivable. No accounts receivable, then no positive cash flow, and my bonus may be in jeopardy. If later the customer finds the product doesn't meet the specs, then that's what our marketing and legal departments are for.

DMEDI and DMAIC are techniques design, product, and process engineers should already be using and their management supporting. If they were doing their jobs, there would be no need for a Six Sigma bureaucracy.

And, don't forget, one part of the typical Black Belt charter is to get rid of the quality function. Make quality assurance everyone's responsibility and it winds up as no one's.

Deming is tossing and turning.

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You can land front wheels first (small planes which have only one wheel in the tail, called "taildraggers"). You can land 3 wheels at the same time (also mainly small planes, but not for taildraggers IIRC). But any airliner that isn't a taildragger (and you'd have to go DC-3 era to find that) always is meant to land back wheels ("main landing gear") first. Only this time the pilot kept the nosewheel up for a long time, set it very easy to the ground and tried to minimize forces on the nose wheel as much as possible. But in journalism, that one quickly gets written down into "landed on the rear wheels" nonsense.

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Very few companies have a quality management system that works and still puts the quality management functions with the people instead of a separate department indeed. I think of Scaled Composites, where it seems to work. Maybe that is because many of the engineers/designers also have to fly into their flythingies .

Rutan clearly read the standard "quality management" works, as he said in interviews

"in my company we don't give a penalty for mistakes. We encourage finding and reporting them." The essence of the quality management system, that is.

Off-topic, this is .

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man, isn't Six Sigma a joke. i mean, really. oh it chaps my hide. TQM is another fad i won't miss. ISO, sheesh, what a waste of time. mil-hdbk is probably the only real quality doc ever needed, but it's sooooo over the top that we get those thousand dollar toilets all the time.

mark

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goodbye richard pryor :(...

oh, btw, i was at the pahonicks aeroport while this mess was going down. ugh. thankfully, beer tastes good to me.

i was riveted by the events as they unfolded. the close in flyby look-see they gave the tower freaked the whole bar out. we were all hoping things would turn out OK, and thankful when they did.

mark

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goodbye richard pryor :(...