that I can't really debate here. It concerns religion you see, but I thought, since it also involves the secular study of religion, someone here could point me to the right place to find the information I'm looking for.

My question concerns the origins of Islam. I'm looking for a secular study of Islam's origins, and its relationships to Judaism and Christianity; specifically whether it emerged out of Judaism, Christianity or both. My problem is that the only sites I can find that deal with this topic are Muslim sites which begin with Muhammad and his revelation by the angel Gabriel, or Christian sites seeking to undermine and defame Islam. Has any secular study of the origins of Islam been done?

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Wikipedia: A MMORPG for self-denialists.

It's gotten to the point where careful investigation is needed just to tell parody from reality. I think that means reality is broken.- Noclevername.

I'd start with Karen Armstrong, especially her first three books, "A History of God" (Ballantine, 1993), "Jerusalem: One City, Three Faiths" (Knopf, 1996) and "The Battle for God" (Knopf, 2000).I consider her one of the best writers on religion in the English language.
I hope this helps.

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"I want to write about people I love, and put them into a fictional world spun out of my own mind, not the world we actually have, because the world we actually have does not meet my standards." Philip K. Dick
No matter how strong, or brave, or pure of heart you may be; sometimes the dragon wins!

Edit: Oopps. Disregard my post.

Sam

Let me second that, then sound like an old lady for a minute.

This is what the library is for. You local library will have people whose whole job is to help answer questions just like this. In a lot of ways, they're far more helpful than the internet, because in general, they have a degree in "finding obscure information." Library Sciences are your friend. Why doesn't anyone remember that anymore?

Edit: I'm seconding what Graybeard said; Sam posted while I was posting. It's actually my understanding that most of Islam's early converts were from various Pagan religions.

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Gillian

"Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

"You can't erase icing."

"I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

Lengthy, but extremely well-informed secular look: http://www.bibleorigins.net/index.html

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol. A human.

Whoever says "perception is reality" is daft. It's merely an abstraction, and often not a very good one.

Folks, we really can't discuss the details, pros, cons, etc. here, nor should we, as it violates board rules and can lead to contentions. Parallaxicality asked for a resource. I posted a link. If you have one, too, please post it and let's not discuss the matter further. Thank you.

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol. A human.

Whoever says "perception is reality" is daft. It's merely an abstraction, and often not a very good one.

For some reason, this post makes me think of Oolon Colluphid...

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SeanF

"Ask to understand, but don't challenge unless you have the knowledge."--NEOWatcher

The contents of this post are ©2008 by SeanF and may not be copied or retransmitted in any form without the express written consent of SeanF

I think--and I could be wrong, here--that if it's all kept in a historical perspective, it ought to be no different than the discussions of Watergate we've had. Yes, in theory, Watergate is a political issue, but we were not discussing it as such. We kept it as history. We've in fact had various discussions of finer points of various religions as they apply to other things, and that generally worked unless someone actively tried to take offense. (Intelligent design is just one example.)

Then again, I get very vexed when the study of history becomes polarized beyond reasonable discourse.

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Gillian

"Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

"You can't erase icing."

"I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

One of the first(if not the first) monotheistic religions was Zoroastrianism which had a lot of influence on Christianity and Islam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism