HenrikOlsen, if you think it is justifiable to torment a person and destroy their life- to make an example out of them- ask yourself this:

What if that person was you? What if a bit of human error on your part- A misjudgement, a mistake- resulted in tragedy? Would it be ok for me to amplify that tragedy? Jump in and rub salt in your wounds and make it worse- then say, "Look everyone! Look what happend to him!"

Perhaps I'm too compassionate- I don't know. But I would not do that to you. I would figure you were in enough pain without adding to it.

Well buddy... You can't make assumptions that they are going to commit crimes either then.

It certainly speaks for my case- You cannot justify taking away her surviving kids, throwing her in jail for ten years etc then can you?

I'm not trying to "justify" anything. I'm saying that you can't argue that you know who's going to do what, as both you and HenrikOlsen are trying to do. Some may indeed be dissuaded by the sentencing more than by the direct consequences, I can't say for sure. And neither can either of you. You both made assertions about how it "will" or "won't" make difference to other people. All pure speculation.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

Yes, exactly. She has lost a child in tragedy. Legal action is not required.

...I wasn't agreeing with you. I don't know how you got that from "Some may indeed be dissuaded by the sentencing more than by the direct consequences." Let me clarify: You're both wrong. This is a pointless arguement of exaggerated straw men, with no real solution.
In your opinion.

It may or may not be "required". It's a subjective matter.
It's just not our call to make. We're just expressing opinions on a chat board, with no power to affect the outcome.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

I really don't care if you agree or not.

It isn't Opinion though.

To punish the punished is wrong. No matter how you look at it.

Opinions are irrelevent. We all have opinions. Opinions are what people make up to satisfy how they want things to be.

But there is right from wrong- regardless of opinions.

To punish the punished- as if this somehow deters people from doing wrong- Can you not see she has been punished? Do you think people are mindless, that they cannot see the pain - and avoid it on their own?

In discussing the disturbing trend in modern days to punish the punish, others can see this.Hopefully, in time, people will also learn right from wrong, and this trend can be reversed.

You know, I do think the woman should have been punished. It's criminal neglect to leave an infant alone in the bath, and anyone with a lick of sense should know that drowning is a possibility.

__________________
Gillian

"Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

"You can't erase icing."

"I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

It may be your opinion that this is so. Doesn't make it true. Each case is unique, each individual is unique, there are always unique circumstances, there are no absolutes.

And since there are no ways to make your belief and mine compatible, I'll say nothing more on the subject.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

Bold Mine:
Well, I have great news for you then. You will be thrilled to know.


She was.

Her child will never look up at her and call her "Mommy" again.
Because she's dead.
[Line removed for being out of line]

ETA: What were you saying about empathy?

That's low. You have no call to say something so rude and petty.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

Sure drives home the reality though.

Brattiness and ad homs drive home nothing but your own lack of self-control.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

http://www.kare11.com/news/news_arti...storyid=266976
Ok, how's this for satisfaction then?
$20,000 bail and supervised visitation with her kids only.

The article fails to mention that she went to check on the other two children and incidently checked online for the shoes while she was at it.

They are trying to make an example out of this person - even though they admit that it was not criminal intent nor neglect- but an error in judgement.

The child was not alone, she was monitering four children, tragedy struck.

And to be heartless about it- totally cruel and take everything else away- for what?
To say that it will deter criminally minded people?!
NONSENSE!
That it will warn other people to not leave kids alone in a tub?
NONSENSE!

The prosecutor wants another nice fat conviction under his belt- while being hailed as a hero for children- locking away naughty parents.

For you folks hailing the prosecutors here- Let me ask you:
Do you ever screw up? Not use your best judgement? Have you ever changed lanes on the freeway and almost hit someone?
How many near misses and close calls have you had in your life when you made a dumb mistake?
But because tragedy didn't strike- because you got out of it lucky - You want to point the finger and condemn others.
Just because you Got Away with it? Do we need to hire a team of law enforcment officers to go around investigating Near Misses that could have happened in order to prevent accidents in the future?
Shameful. Seriously. Sit there and feel ashamed of yourself for a moment.

And if you think I'm resorting to ad homs or brattiness Noclevername- It's called a reality check. Real life. You know. That stuff we all have to go through. No dreamer ideology is going to save you. That's reality.

No, it's uncalled for visciousness over a difference of opinion. You owe Gillian an apology. No tragedy to someone else excuses you acting in such a way to her.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

Uncalled for visciousness is trying to punish the punished.

And every apology I ever made to Gillianren went unacknowledged with a Haughty flare as she looked down her nose at me.

The tragedy does not excuse the prosecution of making an example out of a person. That is immoral, corrupt and outright wrong. Reality Checks are a harsh thing.

Neverfly, for someone who says so vehemently that you believe in absolute right and wrong, why are you acting so wrongly?

Stop, take a moment, and calm down. Gillian has done nothing to harm or punish anyone. She is expressing an opinion, nothing more. You are taking this too personally.

__________________
"If this were play'd upon a stage now, I could condemn it as an improbable fiction."
Shakespeare, Twelfth Night
Illuminati's Razor-The most complicatedly evil answer is usually the most correct answer. - Fazor
"Every book is a children's book if the kid can read." - Mitch Hedberg
"Distance doesn’t matter much in space, where if you just start a thing off with the right kind of shove, sooner or later it will get where you want it to go." -Frederik Pohl, Mining the Oort

Because the mentality that makes it "ok" to add tragedy to tragedy disturbs me greatly.

And I'm not going to keep my mouth shut. I will speak out against it.

While we are sitting here talking about it- Someone is suffering. You are not suffering that persons fate. It's so easy to point the finger and condemn- as long as it is not you in that position right?
Most people don't Listen until you whack 'em upside the head and make them see the reality of it.

ETA: This case is as wrong as wrong can get.
Taking a position that supports this government nanny- only encourages it to continue. The more people that think this way- the more lives are going to get ruined- destroyed while the crowd shouts in supportive encouragement. It's all good- until it happens to you.

Neverfly, I'm also of the opinion that your are letting this get to you. Some stuff you seem to be overlooking include the definition of Manslaughter:
From the article you linked:
A mistake which cause the death of an 11 month old baby. Yes, it's tragic, and yes, the woman is probably goin