Well, yes, but I think the quote is an excellent example of missing the bigger picture (Big Don caught the spirit, though. Good for you, BD!). The missing sentence at the end of the quote, "Specialization is for insects," indicates, to me, the arbitrariness of the previous listing.

That so many of us could be engaged in testing ourselves against such a random listing, as though it actually means something, is a bit interesting. Not that I was trying to set anyone up, but I honestly expected more people to be adding things to the list, or coming up with counter-lists, or asking if the ship got a long or short conn, or it depends on where you want to actually set the bone.

I wonder if this is how sects start. Ol' Robert was sitting there at his typewriter, coming up with Lazarus Long aphorisms, and more or less free-asociated a bunch of abilities onto the paper. Later on, others see patterns in the list and assign it a value. Give it another couple of hundred years and there may be vestments and incense.

I do find the semi-defication of a successful popular writer evident in some sites to be... odd.


(edit)

I meant to add Ayn Rand and Ron Hubbard as even more extreme examples of the process.

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The Devil offered me power. I told him I preferred aperture.

That's a rather amazing insight, Mike! Perhaps you're right!

I've read Atlas Shrugged. Aweful. Non of Hubbard's stuff, though my brother has (he gave me a sort of "Cliff's Notes" version - still aweful).

I've read everything Heinlein's ever published, so I feel like I know him even better than my own brother.

I think the point Heinlein was trying to make is that the crowning achievement of the human set of genes is that we're not specialists at all, but are generalists. Thus, in groups between 1.0 and 9 billion, we can survive.

You wrote: "That so many of us could be engaged in testing ourselves against such a random listing, as though it actually means something, is a bit interesting."

I think self-appraisal (I hesitate to call it vanity, as I know not the underlying motivation) is key to both knowing one's compentancies as well as one's limits. For example, I'm a good cook, but I'll never be a chef (don't have the patiences for the schooling). I can fix my shoe, but I'll never be a cobbler. I can shoe a horse, but I'll never be a veterinarian.

Things like that.

So, things I stink at:

1. Calming females (I tend to re-assert my position too much). But that's who I am, and will not subvert my position because the relationship is threatened. Please see my new signature for further discourse. If others can't accept that, I'm sorry, but I'm not about to give up what I've come to believe over the course of half my life simply because someone else believes otherwise.

2. Punctuality. Oh, I'll work the long hours, particularly if it's work I believe is necessary. I'm just not very good at working someone else's hours, particularly if the work they have me doing is fodder for the birds.

3. Batteries. I don't know what it is with me and batteries. I spent half a day searching for a replacement battery for my vehicle's electronic key fob. 24 ampere, 12 volt? Give me a break! What happened to simply using a pair of AA's? Sheesh!

4. Cleaning house. For me, it's a once a year thing, after which things go continually downhill. I do great dishes, though...

Ah, the list continues. On to Mike's other outstanding comments:

Mike: "I honestly expected more people to be adding things to the list, or coming up with counter-lists, or asking if the ship got a long or short conn, or it depends on where you want to actually set the bone."

List:

1. Touch-type, rather than hunt-and-peck
2. Clean a bathroom
3. Clean a house
4. Clean a house on a regular basis (I fail, there, unless you count "annually" as a "regular basis")
5. Wash dishes
6. Barbeque any sort of meat known to man
7. Prepare any food edible for men to eat
8. Properly set a modern watch, including calibrating compass direction, altitude, etc.
9. Love a child in a way that causes him/her to thrive.
10. Both program and operate a remote (they didn't have that, except in the most basic form, when Heinlein wrote Time Enough for Love)
11. Counsel other people.
12. Wash clothes
13. Surf (hey, it's fun)
14. Body surf (it's even more fun, particularly when you're dodging urchins imbeded in the volcanic niches of Hawaii's North Shore...)
15. Fly a plane (includes take-off, cruise, fuel/flightplanning, and landing/taxiing and radio comms).
16. Comfort the dying (I find this to be the most emotionally draining task for me, so I don't do it very often).
17. Start a fire using primative means.
18. Bag game using primative means.
19. Accept alternative means of style and dress from various cultures around the world.

20. Forgive. Regardless of whatever differences we might have, to allow another person to continue to hold an opinion contrary to our own is perhaps the most difficult, yet also perhaps the most saving grace there is on our planet. If anything, it's perhaps this last which defines humanity.

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol. Human.

Whoever says "perception is reality" is daft. It's merely an abstraction, and often not a very good one.

Mike, you asked us whether or not we match the list, so you it shouldn't be unexpected that people are talking about whether or not they match the list.

Why does the list have nothing on it that contributes to other people's lives or to society, nothing that's about helping? They either don't mention other people or talk about how to beat and dominate them...

I think it's just as interesting how many of us scores quite high on the random listing despite that it's easier to make a long list yourself than hit many in a random list.

Apart from out genetic specialization in endurance running in hot conditions.


My (partial) list, :

• Construct equations to describe real life problems, then solve them and apply the solution to the real life problem.
• Learn(or construct) new programming languages as needed to program solutions, unless the problem can be solved with one I already know in which case I apply that.
• Make plants grow
• Basic plumbing
• Sew my own clothes
• Knit a sweater
• Forge my own tools as needed
• See what time it is and realize I can still 5½ hours of sleep before I have to get up for work
• End the list early

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And the "driving on the freeway on a scooter" analogy still holds true because the pilots are sitting in 7 to 30 ton aircraft o' doom and you are running around them in your very own Meatbody, Mark I. Beep, beep.
Trying to make sense of computers, The Error Log.

Real life list:

- go to job that I'm bored with because I need the money - check
- surf around on internet because its more fun than job - check
- vacuum the house because the wife told me to - check
- have my accountant figure out my taxes - check
- try to watch my weight and not eat a ton of crap because my doctor told me to and I don't want to die, though those fries look really good - check
- plan a vacation - check
- try to figure out why Windows suddenly decided that it doesn't know what the icons should look like for all the shortcuts on my desktop - check

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At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

One Earth, One Sky - IYA 2009

well, there's setting a bone, cooking a meal, conning a ship, taking and following orders, pitching manure, and yes, I'd also count fighting efficiently. Actually, all of the skills would make one more useful to society.

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Todd (Bowie, MD, US, North America, Earth, Sol System, Vega region, Local Bubble, Orion arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Virgo A Cluster, Virgo supercluster, the universe in which spock is clean shaven)

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.

personal page: http://blog.astrosketches.info

Who says you need to go to school? My brother started at the bottom (Denny's) and worked his way up to assistant chef of a posh restaurant at a fine hotel before he tired of self-inflicted burns and cuts (two finger tips lost and a severed tendon in his little finger). He is now a warehouse mgr. for the local branch of a major national natural gas distributor. Not to mention being keyboardist for a great band!

I was a big rig driver for years without ever going to school. I showed up, showed my "unlimited" drivers license and went to work, having never driven anything bigger than a school bus before.

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Any day you wake up on "the right side of the dirt" is a good day.

T. Anderson

Alway wondered who planned those. Now I know.

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A person's name, or a mark representing it, as signed personally or by deputy, as in subscribing a letter or other document.

Great list, Swift.

I have a long one that's quite similar, but it's headed by an item that is perhaps a list unto itself.

1. Staying sane in an insane world.

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A person's name, or a mark representing it, as signed personally or by deputy, as in subscribing a letter or other document.

Agreed... I have a hard time understanding how someone can live their lives day in, day out, for 30 years or more doing the same task over and over. I've worked in probably a dozen different offices temping and full-time, and except for the quite rare executive position or creative job, it's all a matter of one person gets trained for one or two tasks, and that's it. Hell of a way to spend 1/3rd of your life.

Since I joined the workforce ten years ago at the age of 15, I've probably had no less than 40 different jobs, most of them in widely different fields. The longer you spend experimenting the easier it is to plop yourself down in any circumstance, anywhere, and immediately recognize the elements you're familiar with and successfully face the elements you aren't so certain about.

It's really the aspect of humanity that is most impressive to me, our ability to adapt well to new environments.

No. I'm no man.

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[Foot mouth in put]
Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses.

In Heinlein's case it's more understandable than others. :-P

I am a big Heinlein fan. This quote always puzzled me a bit. I was always "yes, to an extent, but...". He probably meant it as praise of adaptability - But there are only so many hours in a day to set up for different skill sets. In the end, we only have time to pick a few of millions of different possible skill sets. If specialization produced no benefit for us as individuals, we wouldn't do it.

A generalist on a deserted island might survive, but he's going to be much poorer than a specialist with other people he can trust to trade with.

That being said, people who are capable of being self sufficient if necessary are better off than people who are dependent if society turns predatory or begins to break down. Heinlein often wrote about such situations outside civilization, or on the frayed edges of dysfunctional civilizations, the necessary settings for adventures, and areas where some degree of generalism makes sense.

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http://amssolarempire.blogspot.com

My grandfather was a generalist--got after me for specializing too much in mathematics in high school. I score close to 100% on what would be his list, mainly because he taught me many of those things:

1. Solve an equation
2. Pitch manure and herd/drive cattle
3. plant and grow a vegetable garden
4. sing and play an instrument (preferably more than one)
5. understand how things work and how they were invented (them calculators didn't drop from the sky one day!)
6. Know your religion's literature
7. Know the names and locations of all counties, county seats, and major towns in your state (WV in my case--haven't learned MD yet), as well as all states, state capitals, and major cities, and countries, capitals, and major cities the US interacts with frequently.
8. perform first aid
9. swim
10. tie various types of knots
11. build a small building, demolish a small building, and put up/break down tents
12. know the brightest stars and prominent constellations in the night sky and show them and explain their mythology to others
13. Know the primary flora and fauna of your location
14. know how to do research and learn what you don't already know
15. Do any honest job, no matter how menial, when necessary
16. fix a broken appliance
17. repair your own plumbing, electric, and carpentry
18. have good grammar, spelling, diction in writing and speaking
19. serve your country when called (I may be weak on that, unless you count civilian government)
20. give public speeches and write articles

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Todd (Bowie, MD, US, North America, Earth, Sol System, Vega region, Local Bubble, Orion arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Virgo A Cluster, Virgo supercluster, the universe in which spock is clean shaven)

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.

personal page: http://blog.astrosketches.info

The original Heinlein passage made no mention of gender:

"A human being should..."

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Any day you wake up on "the right side of the dirt" is a good day.

T. Anderson

I did mention human beans in my OP.

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The Devil offered me power. I told him I preferred aperture.

Heaven help you if you ever move to Texas (254 counties!).

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Any day you wake up on "the right side of the dirt" is a good day.

T. Anderson

True, that is one thing we do tend to do better than most...

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I am Mugs, of the Alien clan of Usa, Nordamerica, a Terran, of Sol. Human.

Whoever says "perception is reality" is daft. It's merely an abstraction, and often not a very good one.