I'm more with Neverfly on this one. A brilliant mind is a brilliant mind; I'm sure there would have been a number of people who would have tried to use his personal vice to discredit him; but if his ideas and science held true, it woudn't have changed that.

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I'm like one of those idiot savants...well, except for the savant part.
"In order to increase awareness of the homeless, security have been given binoculars."

I think the idea is that Dr. Sagan points to the fact that moderate drug use can go hand in hand with a successful career. This will not be the case for all of course, some will abuse a vice whether it be alcohol, caffeine, cannabis, or double cheese burgers. In this case, however, the man was able to partake without serious repercussions.

He and many others. However, I doubt its use contributed to his intellect or career.

The point is that he found a balance between the two. Life is not *all* intellect and career. Some want time to play, and do unhealthy things whether that be hang-gliding, getting drunk with friends at the beach, or smoking a bit of hash or pot. The point is *not* that it enhances one's career or intellect, but that one can still be successful and intelligent when it counts and still have a private personal life.

Some believe that quality is the measure life, rather than quantity. Such a choice of measure should be a personal decision.

*I am not a professional yet, but am in my third year of pharmacy school*

Yes, St John's Wort has anti-depressive properties. However, do not just start taking it without consulting your personal medical professional, as it does have some major drug interactions. Do not take it if you already take medicine for depression or MAO inhibitors.

Antidepressants, these days most prescribed are SSRIs, do work for a lot of people. However, it taked some trial and error to find the right one or combo. Again, consult your personal medical professional. Also, they do have some undesirable side effects (insomnia, weight gain, GI issues, headache etc..) that generally go away after the first couple weeks.

As far as "normal" people using ADD meds to enhance cognition and potentially raise test scores, extremely bad idea. Almost all these drugs are amphetamine based, addictive, and have great potential for abuse. Yes, there are legitimate medical reasons for using them. However, they are not benign and should not be treated as such.

Have you ever done hang-gliding? Serious accidents are rare, and hoofing it up those hills all the time takes a good bit of cardiovascular capability!

And Carl Sagan spent his life using pot recreational fashion and never had a serious problem.

...that we know of

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Todd (Bowie, MD, US, North America, Earth, Sol System, Vega region, Local Bubble, Orion arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Virgo A Cluster, Virgo supercluster, the universe in which spock is clean shaven)

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.

personal page: http://blog.astrosketches.info

I heard he had a problem pronouncing his "Bs.."

Yup, never consider the possibility that recreational drug use might be handled in a responsible fashion. If out argued, make jokes, but never open your mind to alternative points of view.

Another thread that at time was semi-informative that had dropped to a content of zero. I am out of here!!

Content of zero?

Recreational Dug Use?!

Yeah... Zonking your brain with the bombardment of heavy chemicals is very recreational...

Clearly, TheHalcyonYear, You have never Observed the long term effects of drug use. They are not safe. They are a toxin. They destroy the brain and the body.


It would appear that reaching a content of zero on this topic would be rather appropriate.

Are you including alcohol and cigarettes in this? If so I can at least applaud your consistency. If not, you are being hypocritical.

I do not use drugs. I drink very, very little (a glass of wine once or twice a year). That said, everything in moderation. Water is a toxin and can get you high---and even kill you---in high enough doses. Same with oxygen. You need arsenic to live.

My point is be careful of blanket statements life the one above; they tend to say much more about the person speaking than they do about the subject at hand.

I have indeed observed first hand the long term effects of drugs use, many times...and the effects depends directly on the drug and the amount/frequency used. Most "overdoses" are caused by impurities in illegal drugs that are a direct result of those drugs being illegal.

All I am saying is that this is a very complicated subject, one that cannot be summed up by blanket statements.

Incidentally, on the subject of medical marijuana, there's work being done developing it in inhalator form (like those used by asthmatics) which solves both the original problem of taking an anti-nausea drug orally and solves the problems that smoking it has, such as inconsistent dosage.

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‘To those who regard “crime fiction” as some sacred icon which must follow a rigid formula, I will always be the man who writes 18-syllable haiku.’Trying to make sense of computers, The Error Log.

See 'ya!

I find this entirely reasonable, as the ingredients are known for their anti-emitic properties, as well as a treatment for glaucoma.

well, to keep everything equal between legal medications and marijuana, suppose somebody grows a weed that produces zoloft (yeah, I know impossible, but hypothetically) in smokeable form. Would it be legal to grow and smoke it? Or would you be required to have a doc's prescription and purchase it from a licensed pharmacist who got it from a drug manufacturing company subject to the usual regualtions?

One could conceive of legalizing marajuana usage--but only under guidelines similar to other prescription medications (such as a requirement for extensive clinical testing and FDA approval).

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Todd (Bowie, MD, US, North America, Earth, Sol System, Vega region, Local Bubble, Orion arm, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Virgo A Cluster, Virgo supercluster, the universe in which spock is clean shaven)

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.

personal page: http://blog.astrosketches.info

Basically, growing and smoking it would have the same fundamental disadvantage I see in all "natural" medicines, there's no reliable way to control dosage.

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‘To those who regard “crime fiction” as some sacred icon which must follow a rigid formula, I will always be the man who writes 18-syllable haiku.’Trying to make sense of computers, The Error Log.

True...but it would be very difficult (impossible?) to overdose on medical marijuana.

That depends on your definition of overdosing.
If it's "take too much, drop dead", then you'd right, but then that would be true for almost all drugs.

If it's "take too much, get effects other than those that are its purpose", then you're wrong, it's extremely easy to do that when smoking marijuana.

The high, the impaired judgment, mellowness, etc. etc., you know, all the effects for which it is used recreationally are all unwanted side effect when used medicinally and without a well controlled dosage they are impossible to avoid.



Overdosing in the first sense is generally not the problem when talking about controlling drug dosages.

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‘To those who regard “crime fiction” as some sacred icon which must follow a rigid formula, I will always be the man who writes 18-syllable haiku.’Trying to make sense of computers, The Error Log.

Agreed.

Actually, they do, at least one that has the same effect.

St. John's wort is an SSRI anti-depressant, as is zoloft. The only reason it's available over counter in most countries is because it's been used for thousands of years. Still, Ireland requires a prescription.

And in "natural" form it has the normal problems with natural medicines of uncontrollable dosage.
If I remember correctly St. John's wort contains two active anti-depressant drugs whose relative concentrations varies depending on how it grew, and since they don't have quite the same effects and side-effects, the result of taking it is unpredictable even if the overall concentration of them is known, which it commonly isn't.

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‘To those who regard “crime fiction” as some sacred icon which must follow a rigid formula, I will always be the man who writes 18-syllable haiku.’Trying to make sense of computers, The Error Log.

That is exactly the kind of thing we need. Not everyone would want to smoke the plant to get its benefits, and it is ultimately not the optimal way of receiving its inhalative effects. Vaporizing is pretty much benign, but is still harder to control the dose.

In other news, inhaling cannabis may actually help asthmatics due to its bronchodilation effect.

Anecdote time: A friends dad, severe asthmatic, almost died from being is a enclosed valley with a few bonfires burning where the smoke lingered. Doc has told him a puff on a cigarette would probably kill him. He smokes cannabis freely, safely, and gleefully.

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"In the end the aggressors always destroy themselves, making way for others who know how to cooperate and get along. Life is much less a competitive struggle for survival than a triumph of cooperation and creativity."- Fritjof Capra

www.gonzoscience.com

I not here to debate or advocate it's use. I merely used it as an example, and given that it's been used for at least two millennia... The control for the leading manufacturers is quite precise, in part because the process is so easy (test batch, apportion apropriate amount).