This discussion seems to be boiling down to whos word salad fantasy weaponry is better. Unless you set some baselines for actual comparisons, all you will be doing is saying, mine is better! is not! is too! is not! is too!

1 Imperial Knight could beat Master Chief.

Amen.

A Death Star would tower over all the ships.

Yeah they are bigger, but not better.

You are right on those ship facts, but check these out!

A Imperial-class Star Destroyer is 1605m.

60 turbolasers.

60 laser cannons.

10 missle launchers.

10 proton torpedo launchers.

10 tractor beam projectors.

It also has many shields and many fighters.



Second of all, A Super Star Destroyer is 19000m.

It has 500 laser cannons, 550 turbolasers, 300 missle launchers, 350 proton launch tubes. And, it has tractor beams, shields, and a super weapon (capable of destroying a ship in one shot!). Thousands of fighters.

Let's see the Covenant match a 19000m ship!

In response to comment #55, Amen!

Maybe, but then the Master Chief would come back from the dead and work out how to kill the imperial knight. Now someone mentioned some star wars guy who can come back from the dead too. If they fought each other what would happen is they would both keep killing each other until the first to kill the other a certain number of times would be declared the winner. But sometimes they would grab each others flags instead.

With the force on their side, an Imperial Knight would have no problem in destroying Master Chief.

I like Halo and Star Wars very much; but, I know if it was Milky Way (Halo) vs. Star Wars galaxy, Star Wars would win hands down.

First of all: You don’t have to sound condescending, I try to do my research well, and the things that I can’t find I ask about. Is that so wrong? Also the double post was my bad, the computer was acting up and didn’t register the first post until an hour or so later.

Second: I was agreeing because of sheer numbers of ships. The Covenant would be out numbered 10:1 or even 20:1

Third: Particle Shields still wouldn’t protect their ships from Plasma Torpedoes, but Ray Shields would, and that still doesn’t mean that they would skip off the shields. As for power, a Plasma Torpedo is a massive ball of plasma that is guided to enemy ships from the ship it was fired from. Im not sure of the Power behind that amount of Plasma but from what I would understand it should take only a dozen or more hits to down shields and start boiling away the hull.

Forth: Pulse lasers were meant to be used as point defense, although they had the range and accuracy to target capitol ships. There is no comparison between one ships main weapons and anothers point defense. Unless you assumed that a ball of plasma the size of an asteroid guided into an enemy ship is point defense?

Fifth: the Gravity well projectors don’t stop a ship from moving, they’re meant to stop a ship from entering Hyperspace. As for tractor beams the mass and momentum of the Cov. Ships would allow them to be able to escape them, Mind you, it would be annoying for them, but it would not hold them in place.

Sixth: the AT-AT’s size is correct and I’m not sure of the exact size of the Scarab but I tested it. I jumped off the top of it and counted how long it was to die on impact, it took around 3 seconds to hit the ground. So since I fell at 9.8m/s/s (I accelerated by 9.8m per second) and since my downward velocity was nill when I started the jump, this figure states that the height of the Scarab is about 50 to 60 meters. Of course this is just my math and is not canon to my knowledge, so this point is still murky.

Seventh: I do believe that the Plasma canon is hot enough to, if not melt then stress Doonium to the point at were it will at least bend and be useless. As for a direct hit on that enormous target of a head, it’s the same mistake that the UNSC ships make: placing command in front like a shield, instead of tucking it away were it will be useful.

Eighth: I cant find in my research the variant that you describe with missiles, though there is the standard one that has a concussion grenade launcher.

Ninth: It wouldn’t matter if the trooper was seasoned or not, because even a Blackbelt would loss to someone ten times their strength, and skilled at killing.

Last: I will grant you your precious Mk 3 armor, because you stated that it was “Like” the armor from “Tinian On Trial”. As I’m sure that you’ve read, that research complex was destroyed, and all research lost (Except the cut off hardware of one suit). If the suits used the same “Anti-Energy” field, then yes plasma would have a tough time hurting the trooper, but then they’d pull a carbine out and shoot him to death. I say this because the god armor of the Stormtroopers isn’t imperious to projectile fire as you’d assume. The 18 plastoid parts of the main body can and will stop a projectile, but the body glove can’t, nor can the visor, and if the projectile is of sufficient size, velocity, or is designed to be armor-piercing then it stands a decent chance to penetrate the shell as well.

PS: If one Clone Commando is equal to a Spartan then the rebels were F***ed from the beginning, so I really don’t think they are equal. First a Spartan is hand picked to be genetically the best of the best, this would be more than equal to picking Jango Fett. Then they were given training since childhood, same as the clones. But that’s were the similarities stop, were clones given “Carbide ceramic ossification” were their bones were made nigh-unbreakable? Were the clones Muscles amplified and enhanced? Were they tuned to be bigger and stronger than any human that has ever come before? Were they given better natural sight? And were their reflexes increased by 300%... I think not. That is an un-armored Spartan! When you can tell me that one unarmed & unarmored commando could take on twenty seasoned veterans and win without breaking a sweat, then I’ll just start to believe you.

In response to comment #70,

Sorry for sounding harsh, I meant no harm.

You brought out a few points that are correct, but still you have some facts that are wrong.

First, the Covenant would be outnumbered 100-1 (I am not fooling around).

Second, You are correct. A particle shield wouldn't stop a plasma torpedo; because it is made of heated plasma energy. But, you are not quite correct on the ray shield issue. A Star Wars Deflector Shield (ray shield) absorbs energy weapons during combat. You are right in a sense that they wouldn't "skip off", but you are wrong because the plasma energy would be absorbed. Civilian-grade Deflector Shields do not last long, but Imperial Military-grade Deflector Shields can last for a very long time (they can even get recharged by the absorbed blasts). They only way to stop a Deflector Shield is to blow the projector or wait until it burns out. A Imperial Star Destroyer is equipped with Military-grade Shields. So in the end, a plasma torpedo would be absorbed by the shield. But, a plasma torpedo is a very effective way to destroy unshielded ships.

Third, what I meant was that a turbolaser is better than pulse lasers (which is true); because, a turbolaser is charged to 480D and a pulse laser isn't enough to match that. A pulse laser is great for point defense, but then again, a shielded ship wouln't have trouble avoiding damage (like a Star Destroyer). Also, turbolaser is a great way to take out a Deflector Shield by a continual salvo of shots (too bad the Covenant doesn't have some).

Fourth, You are correct that a Covenant ship could escape the gravity-wells, and it's size doesn't matter; because, An Interdictor Cruiser has 4 Military-gade Tractor beams that could hold ships 7 times their original size (see the book Labyrinth of Evil). So in the end, It would only take two Interdictors to hold a Covenant Ship (and the Empire has many of them).

Fifth, An Imperial All Terrain Armored Transport Walker (AT-AT) is 75.5 meters tall. A Scarab is about 64.2 meters tall. Like I said before, "an AT-AT is about 15 meters taller" it is really about 10.8 meters taller (so an AT-AT towers a scarab!).

Sixth, I don't think you even know what Doonium is. You see, Doonium is one of the only alloy that can be super heated and not melt. Doonium can even be placed in lava. The Empire used Doonium for its' Imperial Walkers, Lava Trooper armor, and even parts of the Death Star! A plasm cannon wouldn't ever be able to melt an AT-AT's armor. The only weak spot on tha AT-AT its' the unprotected neck. And you can only hit the neck from above, below, or to the side of it.

Seventh, Watch Episode III. See the part with the Venator-class Star Destroyer battles the Seperatist Ship. Those cannons are MG-A proton torpedo launchers. Also installed on Imperial-class Star Destroyer, which has four of them (as seen in Star Wars: Dark Lord and Star Wars: Jedi Trial). Or check out, Star Wars The New Essential Guide To Vehicles & Vessels[look in a Layperson's guide to technology (page xii, the part about Proton Torpedoes)] at your local library.

Eighth, You don't seem to understand that the Empire has been in more wars the Covenant can count (and that is alot!). I did not say "seasoned" for no reason. The Imperial troops have fought off, in ground combat, aliens that are 10-25 times stronger than an Elite(like wookies, trandoshans, and even Jedi!). The Seasoned troopers have lived to tell the tales about it. A Trandoshan is about 15 times stronger than an Elite (when have you seen an Elite lift a ship the size of the Slave 1!!!!). The Stormtrooper fight enemies stronger than themselves with Power Gloves (with those gloves they would be stronger than a Spartan).

Ninth, I said "like" for a good reason. I know the resaerch was lost,but the Empire looked for different armorers after the "Tinian on Trial" era. About 60 years after the Battle of Yavin, the Empire used Mark III Stormtrooper armor (as seen in the Dark Horse Star Wars Legacy #0) which is the same thing as the armor in "Tinian on Trial". That is why I said "like". Actually, the visor and body glove was also made with "projectile proof" material (like the ones the Mandalorians used). Anyways, Mark II Stormtrooper armor can absorb the blasts of unconcentrated plasma like a "glancing bolt" would (Mark II is the armor seen in the films).

Tenth, Jango Fett was "the best of the best", but not only did the clones end commandos get a life of training; but, they also got bone, stamina, health, vision, muscle, brain, nerve, and strenghth enhancements (like the Spartans, but without the nasty side affects). Clones became stronger than ordinary humans, but Clone Commandos became super humans (like spartans, but better). Commandos reflexes are up to 500% better than normal (see Republic Commando). A Commando wears Katarn armor which could stop even concentrated plasma bolts!!!!!!!!!!In the Star Wars dark hores Republic comics, an unarmored clone owned abou 40 mercs from Nar Shaddaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A squad of Clone Commandos could take on many Spartans!!!!!!

And, you seem to forget that the Rebel Alliance was DOOMED from the start. It just so happens that the foolish Emperor put 2/3 of the Clone Commando squads on the Death Star that was blown away! That is why the Rebels didn't face many Commandos.

I do. It's like Unobtanium, only it's not. See, Unobtanium isn't real. Unlike Doonium, which merely doesn't exist.

Guys, just a request to play nice and keep things in perspective? Halo is fiction. Star Wars is fiction. You can't compare them directly without a common baseline. There isn't one. The worlds are quite different. I'd suggest incompatably so.

One objective comparison I think we can agree on: FTL space transit is trivial in the Star Wars universe. It's accessible to absolutely anybody with the money to book passage on a ship, even in time of war. In the Halo universe, space flight is available only to the military. Civilians travel only with great difficulty, if at all.

Military capability shouldn't be judged by the power of individual weapons, or the thickness of armor. Viet-Nam taught a harsh lesson we'd forgotten. You can lose every battle and still win the war. The real secret is logistics and mobility. The ability to strike meaningfully where needed, when appropriate.

The Star Wars universe has the advantage in both their mobility and their logistics. Individual weapons don't count when you can't find or intercept their forces, or prevent their ability to strike at will.

Better? No. They're different universes.

__________________

New! It combines the power of science with the gentleness of your mother's best intentions!
A new miracle technique, we apply homeopathic methods to achieve scientific efficaciousness
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What in the name of wumpus is a Unobtanium!!!!

Well, in the fictional Star Wars universe, Doonium is real.

Where does ubtpdkjgkjfhazsojeeifjdgfdjgjtatuinum come from?!!!!

I see your point, but this is my point.

Star Wars owns Halo!

Ok then, lets stop our bickering for the moment and at least try to find a common baseline between these two universes.

Here goes some numbers that I pulled for what I’m using on the Plasma weapons
Most plasma technologies that we can understand in real life use “Cold Plasma”, now even though it is “Cold” it’s still around 7000 degrees C.

!Nerd Rant Warning!
Also in the game manual the Core Power output on a Plasma Pistol is rated at 100kV - 150kV and 2dA - 3dA. That would be 100,000V - 150,000V and .2A - .3A. So multiplying them we get the amount of Watts. So that would be 20,000W - 45,000W. This is a good unit for power but not joules, to get this converted to Joules, we make it into a Watt/hour. Which would come to 1,200,000W/h - 2,700,000W/h. After getting watt/hours it’s time to convert to joules, as 1 Watt/hour equals 3,600joules, the final number is 4,320,000,000J - 9,720,000,000J.
That’s one big battery!
Now that’s how much energy is in a fully loaded Plasma gun, lets average it to 7GJ. Now as I stated in my first post here I had ran a StarWars RPG that had covenant in it. I had to find out how many shots each gun had, and well I did, Plasma Rifle = 200 shots, Plasma Pistol = 300 shots or 11 at overcharge. So divide the battery by the number of shots and you get the output in joules per shot. Plasma Rifle = 35MJ/shot, Plasma Pistol 23MJ, Overcharged Plasma Pistol = 63MJ

Now there is going to be loss of power, through inefficiencies and equipment factors, so reduce each by 50% for magnetic containment, and energy loss to environment.
New Figures: Plasma Rifle = 17MJ, Pistol = 11MJ, and if Overcharged = 31MJ.
Ok now that it’s all figured out we can compare to other energy based weapons.

Finally, to me that looks alright. But if I’ve made a mistake in my calculation don’t hold back, tell me.

Also by all accounts in the books I think the force is with John - 117

Shenanigans. A fully charged Plasma Rifle carries 100 shots. No more, no less. Same for the Plasma Pistol. [Edit: retracted for lack of evidence.] On top of that, what you're describing is unsurvivable by humans. Yet, all marines and all covies (even the grunts) could and did survive getting shot by plasma weaponry in game. Even the plasma pistols on full overcharge. Only the sniper gear and explosive shot (rocket launcher and grenade equivs) could insta-kill anybody.

For Halo, the game canon necessarily has to trump the books. Even the technobabble guide. Just like the movies necessarily trump anything in the SW EU.

Computing the height of the Scarab by MC's fall time was clever, though. I don't think in-engine gravity was correctly set at 9.8m/s^2, even on "Earth", but it is a clever approach to getting that measurement.

__________________

New! It combines the power of science with the gentleness of your mother's best intentions!
A new miracle technique, we apply homeopathic methods to achieve scientific efficaciousness
for dilutions WAY beyond Avogadro's Limit. It's New! It's Fresh!
It's Placebo^[tm] Brand Power Drink! *[Use as directed. May increase kidney function.]

It's the indestructible, yet somehow shapable/cuttable stuff they made the hull out of in The Core. Just as nonsensically magical as Doonium. (I think someone may have been reading McCaffrey while writing that technobabble guide.)

__________________

New! It combines the power of science with the gentleness of your mother's best intentions!
A new miracle technique, we apply homeopathic methods to achieve scientific efficaciousness
for dilutions WAY beyond Avogadro's Limit. It's New! It's Fresh!
It's Placebo^[tm] Brand Power Drink! *[Use as directed. May increase kidney function.]

Moose you are correct that each gun states that it has 100, but that's a %.

Also I was off by double on how much the Rifle could fire, every four shots it decreased by 1%, which would mean it has a capacity of 400 shots instead of 200. As well the Pistol fires around 2.5 shots for every 1% coming to roughly 250-280 shots, with only 7 overcharge

so New Figures: Rifle: 8.8MJ/shot, Pistol: 13.4MJ/shot, OC: 500MJ (bear in mind most of it is channeled into the magnetic field, this is so it can home in on targets, basically I’d say only 1% actually discharges and the discharge is very unconcentrated in comparison.)

As for the issue of game canon vs book canon, it would be a more likely assumption that the books are played out at a setting somewhere between Heroic and Legendary. By that I mean that All weapons deal Legend damage, but are at Heroic accuracy. Don’t forget the game mechanics make the enemies harder to kill than they would be on higher levels. I'd also say that allies die like legend and covies die like easy. fair assumption?

Also the reason that those troopers in halo could take that kind of punishment was do to rely good armor and a good shot of Biofoam. Basically think sealant, disinfectant, and blood cloter, its also speeds healing. Most new armor has an auto-dispenser built in.

oh and also the various races of the covenant are rely risiliant in comparison to a human, that and a mortal wound to us, might not be for an Elite.