Composition Of Spacetime

#1 (**permalink**) 02-June-2004, 04:19 AM

Which of the following could be the "true" carrier of spacetime:

The Neutrino?
The Photon?
The Higgs boson?
The superstring?

Photons seems to have a basic structure, and are carriers of info.
Neutrinos travel faster than light (probably).
Higgs bosons compose the Higgs field and give mass to all other particles.
Superstrings are only theorized, but are infinitesimaly small and elongated.

Littlemews · #2 (**permalink**) 02-June-2004, 04:30 AM

I think I will pick Neutrino, since they are small and not easy to interacting with matter and was mostly create by nuclear fusion (hot)

emporium · #3 (**permalink**) 02-June-2004, 03:11 PM

The only slightly possible answer to those could be superstrings!! think about it...

- Neutrinos: millions travel through earth every second... i think we would notice if they were spacetime

- The photon: this is simply a force carrier for electromagnetic... if the photon was spacetime then so would be gravity and the strong and weak forces

- The Higgs boson: still only theorised... remember that! Also the boson itself couldn't be spacetime as it is a virtual particle like the photon.

- Superstrings: This could be possible because they are said to be of the smallest length to hold up in physics (planck length) but they are still highly theorised and so very speculative.

Spacetime fabric is most probably just a vacuum but with more abilites in deep space than we have ever considered possible here on Earth!

K_

John L · #4 (**permalink**) 02-June-2004, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by StarLab@Jun 1 2004, 10:19 PM
Which of the following could be the "true" carrier of spacetime:

The Neutrino?
The Photon?
The Higgs boson?
The superstring?

Photons seems to have a basic structure, and are carriers of info.
Neutrinos travel faster than light (probably).
Higgs bosons compose the Higgs field and give mass to all other particles.
Superstrings are only theorized, but are infinitesimaly small and elongated.

None of the above. The neutrino does not travel faster than light. Nothing does, even though starship1 insists his rocket could do it. As emporium said, the photon is only a force carrier, the Higgs is still only theoretical, as is the string.

And I've tried to correct your misunderstanding of strings a few times. Strings are the particles. The problem with general relativity is that it breaks down at the zero size of the supposed classical particles. This is corrected/dodged by giving all particles a minimum length (i.e., a one dimensional string) to avoid the accompanying infinities that result from using zero as the particle's size.

This is the Big question IMO, though. If we can ever answer this one we'll develop a significantly deeper understanding of the universe. I'm leaning toward emporium's vacuum answer, but then how could gravity curve a vacuum? I agree that it has to be made of something, I just don't know what. I do know that it isn't anything you listed, though.

emporium · #5 (**permalink**) 02-June-2004, 04:22 PM

Agreed John L. Perhaps vacuum fabric that can interact with gravity but nothing else. Perhaps 'graviton' is vacuum but which only creates any interaction strong enough to measure when not already under the influence of gravity ie. Earth feels this vacuum gravity but we do not have gravity because we are under the ffect of earth's gravity. Highly speculative theory but hey, who would have ever thought black holes could be real?!

K_

#6 (**permalink**) 02-June-2004, 10:35 PM

Well, what if the spacetime fabric is one gigantic energy force field on one plane that, had gravity and matter and mass been absent, would've been flat...

imported_Nexus · #7 (**permalink**) 07-June-2004, 01:56 PM

Hi all,

I may be wrong, but I understand gravity to be the result in the curvature of space. It looks to me like you guys have the impression that gravity is some sort of wave, particle or something. For all the reding i have done, what i have come to understand is that if gravity has a for of a wavecule or particle - then we would have come a long way into understanding most of everything else - including quantum gravity - though we would not be riding our flying cars any time soon.

As for the actual composition of spacetime, one basic bit is space and time!! Then the next logical question is, what is space made of. I have read "vaccum" among other listings.

In one documentary where some of my most fav science horeos featured (e.g. Stephen Hawking) they sighted a theory that if you were to observe the vaccum of space close enough, you will notice that its not empty, you will notice that it fizzess and is almost "alive" as though you were looking at a boiling pool of mercury. What its actually made of is something else - another sighted an oil-droplet like phenomenon that seems to be part of the fabric of space.

Look deep enough, end you will start heading into quantum physics territory - an area i look on with great joy and excitement of possible future developments.

SO! what is space made of: Boiling stuff that scientists are still trying to work out what it actually is and prove beyond double or theorization of its components and existence.

I love this discussion board, you guys keep it going.

I will be reading on from here at home in South Africa!!

#8 (**permalink**) 07-June-2004, 06:07 PM

On my computer at home (I'm at school right now) I copied off a site some information that I will paste on this string soon as I get the chance. Hopefully it would be helpful and useful!

#9 (**permalink**) 08-June-2004, 01:10 AM

Alright, here 'tis! This is just a couple of paragraphs from the huge thing, but I hope that it'll be helpful nevertheless.

Quote:

Since every composite elementary or subatomic particle known has an electric charge that corresponds to one of the three possible charge states (+, –, 0), this signifies that only two fundamental particles are required to explain the existence of all charged and neutral particles including all events of particle charge transformation.

A. One particle must have a constant whole positive electric charge of 1.602 x 10-19 Coulombs, equal to the charge of the positron. This will be identified as the A-particle.

B. The second particle must have a constant whole negative electric charge of 1.602 x 10-19 Coulombs, equal to the charge of the electron. This will be identified as the B-particle.

a. This will show that composite particles with positive electric charges are a result of one extra positive charge in composition relative to the total number of negative charges. Stated another way, the total of positive and negative charges in composition are in equal numbers except for the one extra positive electric charge that identifies the particle.

b. This will show that composite particles with negative charges are a result of one extra negative charge in composition relative to the total number of positive charges. Stated another way, the total of positive and negative charges in composition are in equal numbers except for the one extra negative electric charge that identifies the particle.

c. This will show that composite particles with neutral charges are a result of equal numbers of positive and negative charges in composition. Because the positive and negative charges are in equal numbers, this will neutralize the electric charge and the result is a neutral particle.

d. This conforms with all known research and data relating to any charged or neutral particle.

2. Since photons, elementary and subatomic particles exhibit both particle properties and wave properties, this signifies that a third fundamental particle must exist exhibiting both vibration, oscillation and some method of attraction to indivisible particles, small composite particles and mass, in general.

C. This third particle that must exist is required to be a vibrating particle with a net ‘0’ electric charge; however, as the evidence indicates, it must also exhibit some form of attraction through the electric charge or through some other force and must also exhibit a frequency of vibration within some system. These complicated requirements will make it difficult to identify such a particle; nevertheless, it will be found, and to remain consistent, it will be named the C-particle.

These are the requirements and at the same time, the clues that must help us to identify the actual fundamental particles. From these three particles, all forces including gravity, energy, and the structure, composition and the formation of rudimentary, elementary, sub-nuclear, and subatomic particles are explained.

D. However, the evidence shows that a fourth particle must exist; this very simple particle is the origin of the previous three, it well be named the D-particle.

Quote:

Properties of the A, B, C, and D particles:
1. The D-particle is defined as the fundamental point-like particle of energy having one GMU unit of mass. It is further defined as: Any particle of energy with one GMU unit of mass that has not as yet obtained one of the primary properties of spin (angular momentum) or vibration (at a frequency f ), or any particle of energy with one GMU that has lost its primary property of spin or vibration through some event is a fundamental D-particle. From this it is obvious that the ‘D’ does not spin or vibrate and therefore does not have electric charge in any form nor an associated field, nevertheless, it has other features that make it the origin of everything in the universe. The primary and secondary properties of the D-particle are:

a. It is a fundamental point-like unit of energy that provides a fundamental mass / energy constant of approximately 1.8926578 x 10-2 MeV/c2, where this figure is equal to one unit of fundamental mass described as a Geatron Mass Unit (GMU).

b. It occupies space and has volume.

c. It is indivisible and therefore it cannot be reduced or modified in mass or volume.

d. Since the D-particle is an indivisible fundamental unit of energy, this signifies that all interactions involving D’s must be, by definition, completely elastic, even though in some instances of collision, some kinetic energy is converted into particle rotation and in other instances it is converted into particle vibration. [2]

e. It has a linear momentum and velocity of ± c.

f. It is propelled by direct collision with other fundamental particles in motion (those having kinetic energy) or during violent nuclear events such as supernova.

g. It is not attracted nor repelled by electric, magnetic or gravitational forces or fields, where its trajectory and velocity remain constant and only deviate through direct collision.

h. However, such direct collisions with other A, B, C, or D particles will convert a ‘D’ into an A, B, or C particle. [3]

i. And, A, B, or C particles may revert back into D-particles through various events.

j. Since it has no electric, magnetic or gravitational force associated with it, the D-particle is and remains undetectable until an event will convert it into an A, B, or C particle state, where detection becomes remotely possible.

k. Since there is no known system that could restrict nor limit the velocity of a D-particle in any space or environment other than collision, the Geatron Model predicts a velocity potential greater than c.

l. D-particles will be found emerging (technology permitting) from a black hole, supernova, gamma ray burst, black hole nova or other violent nuclear events where a quantity of A, B, and C particles will loose their primary properties and revert into D’s. These common cosmic occurrences provide continuous supplies of high velocity (high-energy) D-particles that permeate space with a relative uniform density subject to the proximity or concentration of galaxy clusters.

m. Generally speaking, matter is invisible to D particles, subject only to direct collisions with other D’s or free-state A, B, and C particles and those in rudimentary, elementary or subatomic composition.

n. D-particles are continuously CONSERVED without regard to their particle state or velocity. However, theoretically, in some circumstances, a ‘D’ could give up all kinetic energy, where v = 0, through a series of minor collisions and come to rest relative to the motion of other particles and larger composite bodies and remain dormant (float in space) for extended periods until an event (explosion and, or collision) occurs that will send the ‘D’ into motion once more, where again, v = ± c.

o. If we can get it to spin or to vibrate, then anything and everything can be constructed?

Note: The listed mass and volume of the D-particle are estimates based upon the accuracy of the determined masses and volumes of the electron, proton, and other established elementary particles. If at some future date it is found that the determined masses and volumes of the electron, proton and other established elementary or subatomic particles are incorrect, then the mass and volume of the D-particle will be modified accordingly. However, any such modification to the ‘D’ will not damage nor invalidate the Geatron Model or any of its provisions or conclusions, as such a possibility was initially anticipated.

2. The model proves that only a single species of energy exists, which is the D-particle and its derivatives, the A, B, and C particles. The ‘D’ is identified as the fundamental form of energy.

3. D-particles convert into the other particle states through collision with other D’s or with A, B, or C particles as follows:

a. An extreme angular collision (an extreme off center or non-center-of-mass collision) between two D’s will produce two spinning A’s or two spinning B’s, depending upon whether it is a left or right sided collision. Two D’s involved in a right sided collision will become two A-particles and two D’s involved in a left sided collision will become two B-particles.

b. A narrow angle collision (an at or near center-of-mass collision) between two D’s will produce or convert the D’s into two vibrating C-particles.

4. The A-particle is defined as a fundamental point-like particle of energy that has previously acquired the property of spin-angular momentum with a specific spin-up direction of rotation about a fixed axis, where this specific direction of spin-angular momentum results in a secondary property of a positive electric charge. It is further defined as: Any particle of energy that carries an invariable positive electric charge and one GMU unit of mass is a fundamental A-particle. It is attracted, from a distance, to any particle that carries the opposite spin orientation or the negative electric charge, whether the charge is fixed or momentary. The spin was the result of the extreme angular collisions that occurred between two D-particles, resulting in their conversion into two A’s. The newly derived A-particle has spin-up that can be represented by a clock-wise direction of spin. The primary and secondary properties of the A-particle are:

a. It is a fundamental point-like unit of energy that provides a fundamental mass / energy constant of approximately 1.8926578 x 10-2 MeV/c2, where this figure is equal to one unit of fundamental mass described as a Geatron Mass Unit (GMU).

b. The primary property of the A-particle is Spin-Angular Momentum L = I w

Where: L = a body rotating about a fixed axis, I = the Moment of Inertia. w = Angular Velocity.

c. It has Rotational kinetic Energy.

d. It has Linear Kinetic Energy.

e. It has a fixed (invariable) positive electric charge that is intrinsic and equal to 1.602 x 10-19 Coulombs that is equivalent to one fundamental unit of charge (this signifies one whole unit of electric charge).

f. It is attracted, from a distance, to any particle that carries the opposite spin orientation or the negative electric charge, whether the charge is fixed or momentary. Note: “momentary charge” refers only to the exhibit of a whole unit of charge over a short period of time (dx/dt) as opposed to a constant or fixed electric charge that is continuous over time.

g. Therefore, the A-particle is attracted to any unattached B-particle having a negative electric charge or to any unattached C-particle while it exhibits a momentary negative electric charge.

h. The A-particle repels every other A-particle or any unattached C-particle while it exhibits a momentary positive electric charge.

i. It is indivisible and therefore it cannot be reduced or modified in mass or volume.

j. Since the A-particle is an indivisible fundamental unit of energy, this signifies that all interactions involving A’s must be, by definition, completely elastic.

k. Certain extreme nuclear events as well as a variety of high and low energy angular collisions with other particles can result in the A-particle losing its primary property of Spin-Angular Momentum, thereby reverting back into a D-particle.

l. In addition to the Electric Force, other fundamental forces have influence upon it. All fundamental forces will be introduced at their appropriate places.

m. As the A-particle moves through a constant or momentary field of any other charged particle it generates both electric and magnetic fields.

5. The B-particle is identical to the A-particle in every respect, except that it has an opposite spin orientation resulting in an opposite or negative electric charge. All primary and secondary properties are identical to those listed for the A-particle with the exceptions noted. It is further defined as: Any particle of energy that carries an invariable negative electric charge and one GMU unit of mass is a fundamental B-particle. It is attracted, from a distance, to any particle that carries the opposite spin orientation or the positive electric charge, whether the charge is fixed or momentary. The newly derived B-particle has spin-down that can be represented by a counter clock-wise direction of spin. The primary and secondary properties for the B-particle are listed as follows:

a. It is a fundamental point-like unit of energy that provides a fundamental mass / energy constant of approximately 1.8926578 x 10-2 MeV/c2, where this figure is equal to one unit of fundamental mass described as a Geatron Mass Unit (GMU).

b. The primary property of the B-particle is Spin-Angular Momentum L = I w

Where: L = a body rotating about a fixed axis, I = the Moment of Inertia. w = Angular Velocity.

c. It has Rotational kinetic Energy.

d. It has Linear Kinetic Energy.

e. It has a fixed (invariable) negative electric charge that is intrinsic and equal to 1.602 x 10-19 Coulombs that is equivalent to one fundamental unit of charge (this signifies one whole unit of electric charge).

f. It is attracted, from a distance, to any particle that carries the opposite spin orientation or the positive electric charge, whether the charge is fixed or momentary. Note: “momentary charge” refers only to the exhibit of a whole unit of charge over a short period of time (dx/dt) as opposed to a constant or fixed electric charge that is continuous over time.

g. Therefore, the B-particle is attracted to any unattached A-particle having a positive electric charge or to any unattached C-particle while it exhibits a momentary positive electric charge.

h. The B-particle repels every other B-particle or any unattached C-particle while it exhibits a momentary negative electric charge.

i. It is indivisible and therefore it cannot be reduced or modified in mass or volume.

j. Since the B-particle is an indivisible fundamental unit of energy, this signifies that all interactions involving B’s must be, by definition, completely elastic.

k. Certain extreme nuclear events as well as a variety of high and low energy angular collisions with other particles can result in the B-particle losing its primary property of Spin-Angular Momentum, thereby reverting back into a D-particle.

l. In addition to the Electric Force, other fundamental forces have influence upon it. All fundamental forces will be introduced at their appropriate places.

m. As the B-particle moves through a constant or momentary field of any other charged particle it generates both electric and magnetic fields.

6. Finally the most remarkable particle of the four fundamental particles can be discussed. It was previously identified as the C-particle. What makes it so astonishing is that its straightforward property of vibration or simple harmonic oscillation explains so many of the mysteries that have plagued scientists for so long and it is directly responsible for so many nuclear and cosmic events.

Quote:

The C-particle is defined as a fundamental point-like particle of energy that has previously acquired the property of internal vibration (simple harmonic oscillation). This intrinsic property is the result of a near or at center-of-mass collision at velocity v = c, between two D-particles of energy that subsequently converted into two C-particles. The vibration provides the C-particle with an intrinsic secondary property of alternating-transforming electric charge with the interval of transforming charge being equal to its preexisting frequency of vibration. This transforming charge system may sound confusing, but it is rather simple. The C-particle is further defined as: Any particle that vibrates with simple harmonic motion, carries an alternating-transforming electric charge and has one GMU unit of mass is a fundamental C-particle. The primary and secondary properties of the C-particle are:

a. The primary property of the C-particle is internal vibration; conceptually, it could be thought of as a vibrating jellied mass of energy that compresses to one side of an elongated hollow sphere, rebounds and then compresses to the other side of the sphere. Through each period (T ) of vibration, this particle of energy produces each of three electric charge states. For example, the charge begins at zero; as the mass moves from center position and compresses on the right side it switches on the positive electric charge (+); after the rebound while the mass is no longer under pressure the charge switches to zero (0) again, and as the mass compresses to the left side, the negative electric charge (-) is switched on, then rebounds to zero and then the cycle is repeated during the next period. This is called the momentary alternating-transforming electric charge (MATEC) cycle that switches through these states, T1 = (0, +, 0, –), T2 = (0, +, 0, –) etc. and the interval is equal to its current or preexisting frequency of vibration.

b. The particle’s net electric charge is ‘0’ because the net-zero charge occupies approximately half of the period, with each positive and negative electric charge exhibited momentarily and only once during each period. Thus, each positive and negative charge is exhibited only once during each period as a whole charge, but for a short duration of time. It exhibits both positive and negative Momentary Electric Charges over the course of one period (T ). These momentary electric charges are precisely equal to the particles’ frequency of vibration, where during each sinusoidal period both charges are exhibited with (0) in between the momentary charges.

c. Frequency of vibration is equal to the net internal force and the total net external forces applied to the particle while it was part of a bound state. An additional external net force that is applied to eject the particle from the previous bound state may influence its final frequency ( ff) of vibration.

d. While still in a bound state, the ‘C’ will vibrate relative to the total of its initial frequency (before entering the bound state) and the total net external forces acting upon the bound ‘C’.

e. Its frequency is variable and spans across the entire spectrum of energy levels from f = 1 Hz to f = 1022 Hz and higher, always relative to the net external forces acting upon it. At 1 Hz, the wavelength (l) is equal to l = c/f, then, l = 3.0 x 108 m. It should be noted that if its frequency has reduced to 0.0 Hz then the C-particle has reverted back into a ‘D’. Note: There is a relationship between the discrete energy level of certain photons and that of certain electrons. Due to this evidence, the ‘C’ particle’s frequency at certain energy levels may not vary continuously, but in integral multiples of relevant quantum. There are also many other possibilities that make this subject too complicated for this paper. It will be the subject of a dedicated writing sometime in the near future.

f. Because there is no known physical limitation to the highest possible frequency that a C-particle could vibrate at, this maximum frequency (fmax) is only limited by the maximum Net external forces that could be applied upon the ‘C’ while it is in a bound state or in some other confined status. The final frequency (ff) of the C-particle is proportional to the initial frequency (fi) and directly proportional to the product of the magnitudes of qa and qb and inversely proportional to the square of the distance ( d2) between the confining particles and proportional to the Net external forces acting upon the rudimentary system while the ‘C’ is in that bound state. An increase in the force by a factor of two will decrease the distance between the confining particles and thereby decrease the space in which the ‘C’ may vibrate (or oscillate) by half, where this reduction of space induces a higher frequency of vibration by a factor of four.

g. It has a linear velocity of 3.0 x 108 m/s, equal to that of the A and B particles.

h. When the C-particle exhibits a momentary negative electric charge, it is attracted to any nearby A-particle and repels from any nearby ‘B’. When it exhibits a momentary positive electric charge, it is attracted to any B-particle and repels from any ‘A’.

i. When the C-particle exhibits a momentary zero (0) state, it is not attracted nor repelled by any particle nor does any other external force influence it.

j. When the C-particle exhibits a momentary negative electric charge, it is attracted to any C-particle that exhibits a positive charge and repels from any ‘C’ that exhibits a negative charge.

k. When the C-particle exhibits a momentary positive electric charge, it is attracted to any C-particle that exhibits a negative charge and repels from any ‘C’ that exhibits a positive charge.

l. As the C-particle moves through its electric charge cycle, it generates both electric fields and magnetic fields. The electric and magnetic fields are also generated as the C-particle moves through the constant or momentary field of any other charged particle.

m. Once the C-particle becomes bound within one of the many possible rudimentary units, immediately, it exhibits another intriguing secondary property; it begins to oscillate back and forth between the binding A and B particles. This will be described in detail as we proceed.

n. As previously stated, this is truly a remarkable particle when one considers its simple primary and secondary properties, yet these properties account for so many nuclear and cosmic phenomena and solve so many past problems, for example:

The similarities between Newton’s Law of Universal Gravitation and Coulomb’s Law of Force between electric charges has intrigued scientists for more than two centuries. Both are inverse square laws, where one describes the force of gravitational attraction between two or more bodies with mass and the other describes the force of electric attraction (or repulsion) between two or more charged particles. Because of these similarities, physicists have always suspected that these laws may have a common origin, which was never identified. It is incredible to find that, for the very first time, the C-particle explains this relationship between these two very similar inverse-square laws through its own inverse-square law system. The inverse-square law described in 6.f. above is nearly identical to the previous two laws, however, the C-particle’s law, (describing the force relative to the particles’ final frequency) emanates from the fundamental nuclear level, rather than the subatomic level, making it the origin of both Newton’s and Coulomb’s Laws. For The Record: “The final frequency (ff) of the C-particle is proportional to the initial frequency (fi) and directly proportional to the product of the magnitudes of qa and qb and inversely proportional to the square of the distance ( d2) between the confining particles and proportional to the Net external forces acting upon the rudimentary system while the ‘C’ is in that bound state.” Most readers including those with extensive backgrounds in physics will not recognize the significance of this C-particle Fundamental Force Law, which is identified as the C-Force.

Fg = G m1 m2 / r2 Newton's Law of Universal Gravitation

FE = k q1 q2 / r2 Coulomb's Law of Force between charged particles

The equations derived from the Geatron Nuclear Model, particularly the two very important inverse-square laws, will be listed on a dedicated page and posted later.

We have disclosed an unprecedented insight into the primary and secondary properties of the three fundamental particles that exhibit the electric charge in various forms, with one having a constant positive charge, another having a constant negative charge and a third having a momentary alternating-transforming positive and negative charge where the period interval is equal to its frequency of vibration. These electric charges allow the three particles to interact with each other. A summery of their primary properties are as follows:

A-particle exhibits a constant positive electric charge.

B-particle exhibits a constant negative electric charge.

C-particle exhibits a momentary alternating-transforming electric charge of 0, +, 0, –, 0, +, 0, –, etc.

Note: The D-particle is not listed here because it does not interact through any force.

#10 (**permalink**) 08-June-2004, 01:15 AM

Sorry that last post was so long. :Arrgh!:
for more information check out http://www.2xtreme.net/~boris/physics.htm
If you find you cannot access this page through typing in the URL, use the following on Google: Eugene B. Pamfiloff, or The Order of The Forces

imported_Nexus · #11 (**permalink**) 08-June-2004, 07:33 AM

StarLab,

Thank for the very detailed set of quotes, i always love reading stuff about our universe. But not to risk sounding condescending, but I think this thread seeks to get understanding mostly about the composition of space.

Some here have said vaccum and sighted particles and things. But, my question is - without spacetime, there cant possibly be a medium for these particles you are talking about to exist in.

So... we land again in the center of the question, what is the compositions of SpaceTime (except for the obvious main componets being Space & Time). If space is made of vaccum, then what is the vaccum made of - it cant possibly be made of nothing, after all space has been equated to nothing more than the foam on a seashore washed by seas that come forth from the great oceans of Zero Point Energy Fields that the universe takes its energy from (i could be mistaken).

It is also known that the universe is ever expanding, if it is, the unaccounted for mass that is creating more space through its creation is somehow drawing its enegry from elsewhere. With the new "much speculated" funnel shape of the universe, i begin to wonder if scientists are not being methodical in their research.

Shouldnt scientists try to answer the most basic questions first before trying to tackly super strings...? Really, what is space made of, i would really like to know, after all - there is so much of it out there. If something bends through the presence of a massive object thus creating an effect called gravity thereby slowing or altering the passing of time itself exists - then it must be studied and looked at much closer.

Anyway... great insert though, i look forward to reading replys to my post.

Fraser · #12 (**permalink**) 08-June-2004, 08:53 AM

I highly suggest you pick up a copy of Greene's new book, Fabric of the Cosmos. The book is all about what you're asking here, the nature of spacetime.

The first 2/3rds of it gives one of the best descriptions I've read of all the current physics theories, such as inflationary cosmology, Higgs ocean, etc. The string theory stuff is there, but it takes more of a back seat since Greene did such a thorough job in his first book.

imported_Nexus · #13 (**permalink**) 08-June-2004, 09:55 AM

Yummy, I will be going in for a closer look at that book. See, I like these kinds of responses, they are to the point.

But, do you mind giving me a brief overview of the ideas expressed in there?

#14 (**permalink**) 08-June-2004, 06:00 PM

Quote:

It is also known that the universe is ever expanding, if it is, the unaccounted for mass that is creating more space through its creation is somehow drawing its enegry from elsewhere.

Hmm...have you yet had a chance to observe recent posts by a certain member Azrael? He and I seem to recently have hit on the Universal accretion in another forum...or so we think.

Geekstronaut · #15 (**permalink**) 10-June-2004, 06:41 PM

Ugh...interesting how, more and more posts, means farther and farther away from the original question.

If i had to pick one of the four choices...i would be in big trouble. Because, i really cannot imagine psacetime to be carried by anything - especially particles.

In general i always lean toward my own assumption that space-time is a dimmension of it's own - one, i might add, that we totally missunderstand.

But anyways...I would have to pick the superstrings (i think i got their name right...). Simply because they are unknown and uncertain enough to pose a possible relation to spacetime.

There! If what i said is rediculous:wacko: & laughable

...forget i ever said it...I'm in hiding

h34r:

Peace!

#16 (**permalink**) 10-June-2004, 06:49 PM

Actually, the STG (SpaceTimeGrid) could just be a bunch of superstrings!

imported_Ziggy · #17 (**permalink**) 13-June-2004, 10:44 PM

Good question. I'd say it's a tie between neutrinos and superstrings.

imported_Ziggy · #18 (**permalink**) 14-June-2004, 08:41 PM

Finding out the exact compostion of space-time might be the greatest scientific advancement in history. Perhaps more important then discovering alien life or finding out what came before the Big Bang. If we can find out what it's made of, then we can start to manipulate it...

#19 (**permalink**) 28-February-2005, 02:46 PM

what pulls the strings of 'superstrings' to make them move?

StevenO · #20 (**permalink**) 10-March-2009, 03:51 PM

Spacetime is made of the motion that carries the massless particles.

mugaliens · #21 (**permalink**) 11-March-2009, 12:01 AM

Three year necromancy? Is that a new record?

More specifically, is necromancy even a violation? I known some think it is, but I'm not so sure.

I'd be interested in finding out, though...

In the meantime, I think it's more of a case where spacetime is.

alainprice · #22 (**permalink**) 11-March-2009, 01:00 AM

You want me to identify a particle as the carrier of spacetime and you don't offer the graviton as a choice?

I refuse to select any of the choices from the list as a possible answer.

BTW, How do people manage to go looking for these old threads?

slang · #23 (**permalink**) 11-March-2009, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alainprice

BTW, How do people manage to go looking for these old threads?

Probably from the list of 'similar threads' that often shows on the bottom of the page. Forum should ask: "ur about 2 reply to 000oold thread.. r u sure? (yes/no/dunno/wut)".

gzhpcu · #24 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 09:51 AM

Space, in general relativity, is a continuum. In every part of it, one can define regions of arbitrarily small volume, and every li

The Loop Quantum Gravity theory postulates that the basic structure of space-time is discrete. It says that there are smallest values for volumes and areas that are not divisible any farther. The fabric of space is depicted as being what is called a spin network with lines and nodes. The smallest possible volume is that of a region containing only a single node. This node is the a smallest unit of space: Its minimum volume is given roughly by the cube of the Planck length (which is 10-33 cm). Elementary particles correspond to certain types of nodes, energy fields correspond to certain types of lines.

DarkHorse220 · #25 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 12:59 PM

I have to wonder if, beyond a point, it even matters "what" space-time really is.

As in, the environment is so alien to our intuition and to our ability to examine that "what" isn't even a question that makes sense.

Or maybe I just don't possess the tools required to describe it meaningfully

gzhpcu · #26 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 01:14 PM

Perhaps, but asking why in this case, is a bit like when Edmund Hillary was asked why he scaled Mount Everest. "Because it is there..." he replied simply..

Oh, and welcome to BAUT...

djinn · #27 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 03:46 PM

Mallory, not Hillary, supposedly said that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Mallory

Hillary said something else

http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/con...03/s860601.htm

"GILLIAN BRADFORD: Another member then misquoted Sir Edmund Hillary as a famous user of the word "bugger". National MP Gerry Brownlee thought Sir Edmund had said "we knocked the bugger off" when he reached the top of Everest, when in fact he said "we knocked the ******* off".

I once bumped into Sir Edmund Hillary in Stanfords map shop in Covent Garden, London. One of my heroes when I was young. I was too shy to speak to him

Cougar · #28 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alainprice

...identify a particle as the carrier of spacetime...

Um, what does that even mean?

The Higgs mechanism, the Higgs field, and the Higgs boson...

Cougar · #29 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarLab

I copied off a site some information that I will paste on this string soon as I get the chance. Hopefully it would be helpful and useful!

It wasn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarLab

Alright, here 'tis! This is just a couple of paragraphs from the huge thing...

A couple paragraphs? That was 90 paragraphs and 3884 words - all apparently nonsense.

alainprice · #30 (**permalink**) 12-March-2009, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cougar

Um, what does that even mean?

The Higgs mechanism, the Higgs field, and the Higgs boson...

What is the OP asking? Do we have a solid definition of space-time as an independent identity? Do we assume it has an associated carrier particle?

The question itself is pure speculation, so I feel no reason to defend my opinion. The graviton may be the 'carrier' of 'spacetime'.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode