Chatroom
 

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Forum > Universe Today > Universe Today Story Comments
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

   

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 26-September-2008, 08:50 PM
Fraser's Avatar
Fraser Fraser is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Courtenay, BC, Canada
Posts: 13,401
Default Astrophysicist's South Pole Death Remains a Mystery After Eight Years

In May 2000, Australian astrophysicist Dr Rodney David Marks died from acute methanol poisoning whilst stationed at the US Amundsen-Scott South Pole Station. He was a 32 year old "brilliant and witty" scientist, whose death shocked his family and friends. The media jumped on this story, citing the tragedy as the "first South Pole murder," [...]

More...
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 26-September-2008, 10:32 PM
KaiYeves's Avatar
KaiYeves KaiYeves is offline
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Currently on assignment on planet shown in avatar photo
Posts: 10,249
Default

Creepy...
__________________
When you're standing on the edge of nowhere, there's only one way up...
"If you think the LHC will create black holes, you might as well believe Hobbits are at the bottom of your garden."- Dr. Mike Inglis
Rovers forever! - ToSeek
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 26-September-2008, 10:58 PM
01101001's Avatar
01101001 01101001 is online now
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,794
Default

Maybe he couldn't take the weather, as illustrated in the 1-minute video in BA Blog: But baby it’s cold outside.

Blowy!
__________________
0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 ...
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 27-September-2008, 04:34 AM
Jeff Root Jeff Root is online now
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 6,501
Default

Sounds to me like he may have been conducting a really-poorly-thought-out
experiment on keeping warm biochemically.

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis
__________________
http://www.FreeMars.org/jeff/

"I find astronomy very interesting, but I wouldn't if I thought we
were just going to sit here and look." -- "Van Rijn"

"The other planets? Well, they just happen to be there, but the
point of rockets is to explore them!" -- Kai Yeves
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 27-September-2008, 10:09 AM
JonClarke JonClarke is offline
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Canberra Australia
Posts: 3,227
Default

By many accounts the NSF and its contactors likes to think Antarctica their personal fifedom and do not take kindly to outsiders sticking their noses in. even when they are the proper authorities.

Jon

Last edited by JonClarke; 28-September-2008 at 04:13 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 27-September-2008, 06:25 PM
Jerry's Avatar
Jerry Jerry is offline
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Earth
Posts: 4,171
Default

He would not be the only person at a lonely outpost who mistakenly consumed methanol. Sometimes something that looks like a tragic accident is just that.
__________________
jwj

It's a big universe out there...is it really unwinding, really burning out?
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 27-September-2008, 10:38 PM
cjameshuff's Avatar
cjameshuff cjameshuff is online now
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 1,609
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
He would not be the only person at a lonely outpost who mistakenly consumed methanol. Sometimes something that looks like a tragic accident is just that.
Considering the enclosed environment, methanol vapor poisoning does not seem unlikely.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 27-September-2008, 11:10 PM
Warren Platts Warren Platts is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,786
Default

Sounds like he was a junkie. He figured the South Pole was a good place to go cold turkey. He had no heroin, so he was jonesing real bad. So he figured he'd inject a little methanol.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 28-September-2008, 04:15 AM
JonClarke JonClarke is offline
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Canberra Australia
Posts: 3,227
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren Platts View Post
Sounds like he was a junkie. He figured the South Pole was a good place to go cold turkey. He had no heroin, so he was jonesing real bad. So he figured he'd inject a little methanol.
I doubt that a junkie would pass the extremely rigorous tests required for wintering over personnel. Also the coroner would have undercovered evidence of him being one.

Jon
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 28-September-2008, 12:24 PM
Warren Platts Warren Platts is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,786
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonClarke View Post
I doubt that a junkie would pass the extremely rigorous tests required for wintering over personnel.
Yeah, like the diaper lady from NASA.

Quote:
Also the coroner would have undercovered evidence of him being one.

Jon
The doctor who first examined him found needle tracks on the guys arm, and described Mark as "nervous, anxious and upset," all psychological symptoms associated with a severe jones.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 01-October-2008, 06:40 AM
JonClarke JonClarke is offline
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Canberra Australia
Posts: 3,227
Default

Indeed. But there are other explanations for such such signs and symptoms as well.

The facts are that Mark had no reported history of drug abuse. No evidence for it was reported by the autopsy. No sign of it in the extensive pre expedition investigations which screen people very, very carefully. The chance of a past or present IV drug user wintering over at the South Pole are probably about the same as one becoming an astronaut.

He died of methanol poisoning, not IV drugs. Thy could have been self administered, accidently adminstered, or malicously administered. In the first case the base crew should have identified a problem and manged it better. In the second there is and OH&S problem that could endanger others, in the third there is a murder out there why may well winter over again. This is what makes the lack of cooperation with the inquiry by the NSF very serious.

Jon
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 02-October-2008, 05:15 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default not what it seems

there is more to this than meets the eye. unfortunately it is suppressed in new zealand where the inquest took place.
affidavits given to the police/coroner state that the doctor treating rodney self medicated with the base supply of morphine and ketamine. he also offered these to others at the base for recreational use. rodney did not take these. the doctor probably tried to cover up his own illegal use of drugs under his supervision by claiming rod had needle marks. doctor made marks. us marshal later ordered that the empty drug vials/containers, found by doctors bed, be destroyed.
does that make things a little clearer??
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 02-October-2008, 05:27 AM
01101001's Avatar
01101001 01101001 is online now
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,794
Default

Welcome to BAUT Forum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by astrolover View Post
does that make things a little clearer??
And your evidence for all this is...
__________________
0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 ...
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 02-October-2008, 05:58 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

i was in court
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 02-October-2008, 06:44 AM
01101001's Avatar
01101001 01101001 is online now
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 13,794
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by astrolover View Post
i was in court
Show us the documentation.
__________________
0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 ...
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 02-October-2008, 07:35 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

i will post a link next week to an article. like i said. evidence is only under a suppression order in nz. dont take my word for it. see article next week!
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 02-October-2008, 01:30 PM
Warren Platts Warren Platts is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,786
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by astrolover View Post
there is more to this than meets the eye. unfortunately it is suppressed in new zealand where the inquest took place.
affidavits given to the police/coroner state that the doctor treating rodney self medicated with the base supply of morphine and ketamine. he also offered these to others at the base for recreational use. rodney did not take these. the doctor probably tried to cover up his own illegal use of drugs under his supervision by claiming rod had needle marks. doctor made marks. us marshal later ordered that the empty drug vials/containers, found by doctors bed, be destroyed.
does that make things a little clearer??
Fascinating. So it looks like the doctor gave Rodney a hot shot of methanol. Why though? Did Rodney threaten to rat him out? Did Rod owe the doctor some money? And how would Rodney find out about it unless he was in on it too?
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2008, 03:26 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

due to publication prohibition, you will need to order the newspaper. details of this story have been published today (saterday 4th october) by "the age" a melbourne based newspaper. main paper for that city. they are not allowed to put online due to new zealand prohibition. so, sorry i cannot send link as there is no link to send! fyi, if you are interested enough to order a copy, story is on page 11.
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2008, 05:15 AM
Warren Platts Warren Platts is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,786
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by astrolover View Post
due to publication prohibition, you will need to order the newspaper. details of this story have been published today (saterday 4th october) by "the age" a melbourne based newspaper. main paper for that city. they are not allowed to put online due to new zealand prohibition. so, sorry i cannot send link as there is no link to send! fyi, if you are interested enough to order a copy, story is on page 11.
Oh come on, astrolover! This is great stuff, and we on the other side of the world have enquiring minds. Can't you type in a few tidbits for us? Or at least tell us the main gist of the article? Please?
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2008, 08:02 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

its a rather large article. it does center around the issues raised in my original post. the article includes names ect and the usual fluff ie southpole descriptions, corny catch phrases. but it does confirm the original post. it also names the person who gave the evidence. oh, it describes malfunctioning medical equipment and issues around substandard medical treatment provided.
Reply With Quote
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2008, 01:26 PM
Warren Platts Warren Platts is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,786
Default

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4704605a11.html

Quote:
"It could well be that he thought he had consumed ethanol from laboratory sources but in fact had consumed methanol," the coroner wrote in his findings.

It was suspected "moonshine" was produced at the base and there was a possibility this could contain methanol.

Drinking it could also have come about "through a third person's actions, either in the form of a prank or with a more sinister motive. There is no evidence before the Coroner's Court to support this theory," the findings said.

...

The coroner said base physician Dr Robert Thompson did not diagnose the methanol poisoning and "failed to carry out certain diagnostic checks".

"They would have been helpful in narrowing the diagnostic possibilities but would not have necessarily changed the ultimate outcome," he said.

Thompson also failed to investigate recent needle tracks in Marks' arm, "which could have led to vital information on his treatment of the patient".

However, the coroner's findings said it was unlikely Marks injected the methanol and no other drugs were present in his system.

He was known to smoke cannabis and to have used heroin, but friends said they had never seen him use it when he was on the Ice.
Reply With Quote
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 04-October-2008, 11:06 PM
BigDon's Avatar
BigDon BigDon is online now
Order of Kilopi
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 6,131
Default

And herion use isn't automatically I.V. drug use.

Especially among casual users. There are a lot of ways to "chase the dragon" that don't require main lining the drug. Oh believe me when I say I take an extreme position on this when I find out one of the young men I associate with reveils he has been "chipping" and/or "skin popping".
__________________
In your rush to call everyone "entrenched" or closed-minded or "limited" you fail to note that the "limit" here has a very natural boundary: that point at which the evidence stops. - JayUtah

Science fiction was never meant to be an educational tool. - Editor Amazing Tales
Reply With Quote
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 05-October-2008, 12:13 AM
Warren Platts Warren Platts is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,786
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDon View Post
And herion use isn't automatically I.V. drug use.

Especially among casual users. There are a lot of ways to "chase the dragon" that don't require main lining the drug. Oh believe me when I say I take an extreme position on this when I find out one of the young men I associate with reveils he has been "chipping" and/or "skin popping".
Exactly! If they're smart--and all astrophysicists are smart--they don't reveal themselves. Never trust a junky.
Reply With Quote
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 09-October-2008, 04:59 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

here is that link i was telling you about. it appears it made it online after all. if interested, one needs to pay for article (small fee). keep in mind, no drugs or metabolites of drugs were found in rodney mark's system.

http://newsstore.fairfax.com.au/apps...=1&rc=10&rs=31
Reply With Quote
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 09-October-2008, 07:00 AM
astrolover astrolover is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 7
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren Platts View Post
Oh come on, astrolover! This is great stuff, and we on the other side of the world have enquiring minds. Can't you type in a few tidbits for us? Or at least tell us the main gist of the article? Please?
find out more here...http://newsstore.fairfax.com.au/apps...=1&rc=10&rs=31
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
South Pole Experimental Detection of Gravitomagnetism Gsquare Astronomy 0 12-December-2007 03:57 AM
Did our sun blow up 5 billion years ago? snowflakeuniverse Against the Mainstream 118 27-September-2005 04:16 AM
Nancy has resorted to lying about me The Bad Astronomer Against the Mainstream 88 17-June-2004 08:51 AM
Twin Paradox: Definitive Proof That It's SR? Eroica Science and Technology 2085 30-January-2004 02:10 AM
Quasars and Supernova Fires snowflakeuniverse Against the Mainstream 11 04-December-2003 04:05 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.0.0
©  2006 Bad Astronomy and Universe Today